Smalltalk › Squeak › Squeak - Dev

All-in-one VM for 4.4?

_‹ Previous Topic Next Topic _›

Classic

List

Threaded

51 messages Options

123

Paul DeBruicker

All-in-one VM for 4.4?

Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Thanks.

Paul

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:

Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

Thanks.

Paul

--
best,

Eliot

Ken G. Brown

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

COG on Eliot's site:

<http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/>

Ken

On 2013-03-05, at 1:39 PM, Eliot Miranda wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:
Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

Thanks.

Paul

--
best,
Eliot

Paul DeBruicker

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by Eliot Miranda-2

Eliot Miranda-2 wrote

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
> here:
>
> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip
>
> It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
> have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
> me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
> made.
>

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case
use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

--
best,
Eliot

Yes.

The links for the Mac vm's from here: http://squeakvm.org/mac/ are broken. Is there another place to find the interpreter VM for mac?

I found this one on the Pharo CI http://pharo.gforge.inria.fr/ci/vm/stack/mac/ Is that the one to use for Mac?

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:

Eliot Miranda-2 wrote
> On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <

> pdebruic@

> > wrote:
>
>> Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
>> here:
>>
>> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip
>>
>> It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
>> have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
>> me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
>> made.
>>
>
> Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case
> use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?
>
>
>

> --
> best,
> Eliot

Yes.

The links for the Mac vm's from here: http://squeakvm.org/mac/ are broken.
Is there another place to find the interpreter VM for mac?

I dunno :(

I found this one on the Pharo CI
http://pharo.gforge.inria.fr/ci/vm/stack/mac/ Is that the one to use for
Mac?

No. That's a stack VM. John, are you still building Mac Interpreter VMs? If so, where are they?

--
View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/All-in-one-VM-for-4-4-tp4674402p4674447.html
Sent from the Squeak - Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

--
best,

Eliot

Paul DeBruicker

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by Paul DeBruicker

The links for the Mac vm's from here: http://squeakvm.org/mac/ are broken. Is there another place to find the interpreter VM for mac?

I found this one on the Pharo CI http://pharo.gforge.inria.fr/ci/vm/stack/mac/ Is that the one to use for Mac?

Well the links for the 'Latest Builds' are broken.

Bert Freudenberg

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by Eliot Miranda-2

On 2013-03-05, at 21:39, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:
Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

A Squeak release should use Squeak icons. That's a non-issue on Linux, easy enough on the Mac, but for Windows we would need to build a new .exe, I believe? Has someone tested either Cog or the interpreter on Windows 8 - does it work?

Also, I don't see the value in shipping two All-in-ones. If we decide to switch to Cog then that should be it.

An independent issue is what to do about Linux 64 bits.

- Bert -

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 2013-03-05, at 21:39, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:
Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

A Squeak release should use Squeak icons. That's a non-issue on Linux, easy enough on the Mac, but for Windows we would need to build a new .exe, I believe? Has someone tested either Cog or the interpreter on Windows 8 - does it work?

I can rebrand the Cog VMs as Squeak. You think I should do that?

Also, I don't see the value in shipping two All-in-ones. If we decide to switch to Cog then that should be it.

Makes sense to me. The Interpreter VMs can now load Cog-saved images, right David?

An independent issue is what to do about Linux 64 bits.

- Bert -

--
best,

Eliot

Bert Freudenberg

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by Eliot Miranda-2

On 2013-03-05, at 22:16, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:

The links for the Mac vm's from here: http://squeakvm.org/mac/ are broken.
Is there another place to find the interpreter VM for mac?

I found this one on the Pharo CI
http://pharo.gforge.inria.fr/ci/vm/stack/mac/ Is that the one to use for
Mac?

Please don't use VMs from random websites. I know Pharo's CI is not exactly random, but so far we have used the VMs from the official maintainers at squeakvm.org and we should not light-heartedly change that.

No. That's a stack VM. John, are you still building Mac Interpreter VMs? If so, where are they?

There has been no official interpreter VM release after John's 4.2 series. The latest is Squeak 4.2.5beta1U. These are the only Mac VMs that still work on PowerPC Macs. (we do get reports from US schools that still use those).

- Bert -

Bert Freudenberg

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by Eliot Miranda-2

On 2013-03-05, at 22:39, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 2013-03-05, at 21:39, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:
Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

A Squeak release should use Squeak icons. That's a non-issue on Linux, easy enough on the Mac, but for Windows we would need to build a new .exe, I believe? Has someone tested either Cog or the interpreter on Windows 8 - does it work?

I can rebrand the Cog VMs as Squeak. You think I should do that?

Not sure how to go about it. In Windows, the icon is baked into the VM binary, right? Or e.g. what the version number on the Mac should be. John had started to number the Cog-based Mac VMs 5.8. Or maybe it's a non-issue?

Also, I don't see the value in shipping two All-in-ones. If we decide to switch to Cog then that should be it.

Makes sense to me. The Interpreter VMs can now load Cog-saved images, right David?

An independent issue is what to do about Linux 64 bits.

- Bert -

We should indeed wait a bit for David's input.

- Bert -

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 2:05 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 2013-03-05, at 22:39, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 1:31 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 2013-03-05, at 21:39, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:
Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip

It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
made.

Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?

A Squeak release should use Squeak icons. That's a non-issue on Linux, easy enough on the Mac, but for Windows we would need to build a new .exe, I believe? Has someone tested either Cog or the interpreter on Windows 8 - does it work?

I can rebrand the Cog VMs as Squeak. You think I should do that?

Not sure how to go about it. In Windows, the icon is baked into the VM binary, right? Or e.g. what the version number on the Mac should be. John had started to number the Cog-based Mac VMs 5.8. Or maybe it's a non-issue?

It's really tedious to set the icon other than in the build on both Mac and Windows. Since Teleplace is now OpenTurf there's little point in keeping on branding the Cog VMs as Croquet. I'll rebrand them with the Cog Squeak icon that (I think) Tim did. IIRC it's a Squeak icon but with a crenellated border. BTW, I'm going by memory on these icons. If anyone has them to hand feel free to email them to me.

Also, I don't see the value in shipping two All-in-ones. If we decide to switch to Cog then that should be it.

Makes sense to me. The Interpreter VMs can now load Cog-saved images, right David?

An independent issue is what to do about Linux 64 bits.

What exactly are the issues here (apart from the whole flock of them being as messy as pigeons)?

- Bert -

We should indeed wait a bit for David's input.

- Bert -

--
best,

Eliot

timrowledge

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On 05-03-2013, at 2:56 PM, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

>

> It's really tedious to set the icon other than in the build on both Mac and Windows. Since Teleplace is now OpenTurf there's little point in keeping on branding the Cog VMs as Croquet. I'll rebrand them with the Cog Squeak icon that (I think) Tim did. IIRC it's a Squeak icon but with a crenellated border. BTW, I'm going by memory on these icons. If anyone has them to hand feel free to email them to me.

Hmm, there are almost certainly tools that can edit the relevant parts but they're going to be of low utility unless they can be scripted. Quite why everybody chose to make that part of developing so annoying I'll never understand. Acorn simply nailed it in 1989 and everyone should have just heaved a sigh of relief and copied it.

I didn't actually - er, so far as I can recall - make a cogged icon but I certainly can if needed.

tim
--
tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
Useful random insult:- IQ = dx / (1 + dx), where x = age.

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 3:04 PM, tim Rowledge <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 05-03-2013, at 2:56 PM, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

>

> It's really tedious to set the icon other than in the build on both Mac and Windows. Since Teleplace is now OpenTurf there's little point in keeping on branding the Cog VMs as Croquet. I'll rebrand them with the Cog Squeak icon that (I think) Tim did. IIRC it's a Squeak icon but with a crenellated border. BTW, I'm going by memory on these icons. If anyone has them to hand feel free to email them to me.

Hmm, there are almost certainly tools that can edit the relevant parts but they're going to be of low utility unless they can be scripted. Quite why everybody chose to make that part of developing so annoying I'll never understand. Acorn simply nailed it in 1989 and everyone should have just heaved a sigh of relief and copied it.

I didn't actually - er, so far as I can recall - make a cogged icon but I certainly can if needed.

If you'd like that would be lovely. Target the Mac with lovely high-res. easy to derive a lo-fi version for Windows form that.

tim
--
tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
Useful random insult:- IQ = dx / (1 + dx), where x = age.

--
best,

Eliot

Bert Freudenberg

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On 2013-03-06, at 00:07, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 3:04 PM, tim Rowledge <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 05-03-2013, at 2:56 PM, Eliot Miranda <[hidden email]> wrote:

>

> It's really tedious to set the icon other than in the build on both Mac and Windows. Since Teleplace is now OpenTurf there's little point in keeping on branding the Cog VMs as Croquet. I'll rebrand them with the Cog Squeak icon that (I think) Tim did. IIRC it's a Squeak icon but with a crenellated border. BTW, I'm going by memory on these icons. If anyone has them to hand feel free to email them to me.

Hmm, there are almost certainly tools that can edit the relevant parts but they're going to be of low utility unless they can be scripted. Quite why everybody chose to make that part of developing so annoying I'll never understand. Acorn simply nailed it in 1989 and everyone should have just heaved a sigh of relief and copied it.

I didn't actually - er, so far as I can recall - make a cogged icon but I certainly can if needed.

If you'd like that would be lovely. Target the Mac with lovely high-res. easy to derive a lo-fi version for Windows form that.

Maybe just a new color for the Mac icon would work? E.g.:

- Bert -

Jeff Gonis-2

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 4:20 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Maybe just a new color for the Mac icon would work? E.g.:
>
>
> - Bert -

Should the Mac icon use the semi-standard "mac blue"? Think the
quicktime Q, or the color of the folders? A quick google image search
for "mac osx icon blue" will show what I am referring to.

Bert Freudenberg

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On 2013-03-06, at 00:33, Jeff Gonis <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 4:20 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

Maybe just a new color for the Mac icon would work? E.g.:

- Bert -

Should the Mac icon use the semi-standard "mac blue"? Think the
quicktime Q, or the color of the folders? A quick google image search
for "mac osx icon blue" will show what I am referring to.

Ian's VM for Mac already uses blue icons, John's uses the golden ones:

So I thought just using a third color might do the trick. Not particularly proposing red, any color except these two would be fine with me.

I can do the new colored icons, but I'll have to borrow a friend's machine first. They were done in Photoshop and I don't longer work at a place where I would have access to that. If someone else wants to experiment with my templates, let me know.

- Bert -

Colin Putney-3

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

Not particularly proposing red, any color except these two would be fine with me.

Green!

Colin

Bert Freudenberg

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

On 2013-03-06, at 00:56, Colin Putney <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

Not particularly proposing red, any color except these two would be fine with me.

Green!

- Bert -

Darius Clarke

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by timrowledge

Hmm, there are almost certainly tools that can edit the relevant parts but they're going to be of low utility unless they can be scripted. Quite why everybody chose to make that part of developing so annoying I'll never understand. Acorn simply nailed it in 1989 and everyone should have just heaved a sigh of relief and copied it.

Here's an interactive one in a pinch. The source is in Delphi if one wants to read the essential parts to automate:

http://www.wilsonc.demon.co.uk/d10resourceeditor.htm

- Darius

David T. Lewis

Re: All-in-one VM for 4.4?

In reply to this post by Eliot Miranda-2

On Tue, Mar 05, 2013 at 12:39:15PM -0800, Eliot Miranda wrote:

> On Tue, Mar 5, 2013 at 12:34 PM, Paul DeBruicker <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Following Bert's instructions I've made a new 4.4 all-in-one and put it
> > here:
> >
> > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4460862/Squeak-4.4-All-in-One.zip
> >
> > It uses the same VM as the 4.3 all-in-one. Should the 4.4 all-in-one
> > have a different VM and if so, which one for each platform? If you give
> > me links to the VMs I will attempt to put them in the 4.4 all-in-one I
> > made.
> >
>
> Can you make one with Interpreter VMs and one with Cog VMs (in which case
> use the most up-to-date VMs on my site)?
>

The VMs for Squeak 4.4 should come directly from the squeakvm.org site and
from http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/ for interpreter VMs and Cog VMs
respectively. All of these are linked from http://squeakvm.org so when in doubt,
look there first.

The all-in-one package is a special case in the sense that it is specifically
set up to run the Squeak 4.4 release image, and therefore we would have no
expectation that the VMs in the all-in-one should be able to run images such
as Etoys, Scratch, and various other pre-closure images. In this case I would
think that Cog VMs would be the appropriate choice, and I see no need for a
separate all-in-one for interpreter VMs.

I would like to see the VM links presented more clearly when the new Squeak
home page comes on line, so I'll take that as a follow up action. Many Squeak
users will be interested in running a range of images, and will therefore want
to install the interpreter VM for their platform in addition to Cog. For that
reason, we should have some clear links to the appropriate VMs for any given
platform (happily now including RISC OS once again).

Dave

123