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abergel

Call for action for Roassal

Dear community,

As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:

What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?

You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.

Kind regards,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

abergel

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Moose-dev] Call for action for Roassal

> - the possibility to place hangout of the edges on nodes (as box) more flexible. Indeed, I am reverse engineering a database containing around 80 tables and lot of foreign keys and the result is not readable since the edge are orthogonal starting from the top or the bottom of the box corresponding to the column name. I would like a real entity-relation diagram.

Do you have a screenshot showing the issue?

> If you want, I can show you the current stage of the visu (once again done in Telescope on top of Roassal) in order that you see on real data how uggly it is.

Yes please, some screenshots would help

Alexandre

>
> Cheers,
> Anne
>
>> Le 24 févr. 2016 à 09:51, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>>
>> Dear community,
>>
>> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>>
>> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>>
>> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>> Alexandre
>> --
>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
>

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Peter Uhnak

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by abergel

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 10:28 AM, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Alexandre,

In a wonderful world, I would like:
- a real graph layout (like in graphviz) that can take into account around hundred nodes and several hundred of edges and place the nodes in order to see something. Currently, I have to use the circle layout and it looks strange.

Unfortunately making real graph layouts is really hard issue… I've wrote my bachelor thesis about this and didn't get very far; it's bit of a nightmare if you don't have good foundations. :'(

In any case, I wrote a simpler layout delegator in Roassal that delegates the layouting to graphviz and it works reasonably well, so I could probably add it to Roassal (you however need graphviz installed and it would add another dependency to Roassal, which I'm not so keen on).

Maybe also OGDF (http://ogdf.net/doku.php) could be used if you are ok with GPL… they have their own graph format so there could be some interaction.

Peter

Martin Bähr

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

Excerpts from Peter Uhnák's message of 2016-02-24 10:35:05 +0100:
> In any case, I wrote a simpler layout delegator in Roassal that delegates
> the layouting to graphviz and it works reasonably well, so I could probably
> add it to Roassal (you however need graphviz installed and it would add
> another dependency to Roassal, which I'm not so keen on).

how does that work? does it ask graphviz for the position of the nodes and then
recreate that in roassal?

given that there is no comparable layout in roassal available this would
certainly be useful.

> Maybe also OGDF (http://ogdf.net/doku.php) could be used if you are ok with
> GPL… they have their own graph format so there could be some interaction.

this would work the same as with graphviz as an additional dependency on ogdf, right?

greetings, martin.

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Peter Uhnak

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 11:03 AM, Martin Bähr <[hidden email]> wrote:

Excerpts from Peter Uhnák's message of 2016-02-24 10:35:05 +0100:
> In any case, I wrote a simpler layout delegator in Roassal that delegates
> the layouting to graphviz and it works reasonably well, so I could probably
> add it to Roassal (you however need graphviz installed and it would add
> another dependency to Roassal, which I'm not so keen on).

how does that work? does it ask graphviz for the position of the nodes and then
recreate that in roassal?

Yes, I generate .dot file that describes the nodes I want the layout for (that includes the dimensions of it), and then the .dot file is passed to GraphViz… from there I parse the generated SVG file (they can also output other formats like txt, or xml) and move the Roassal nodes.

> Maybe also OGDF (http://ogdf.net/doku.php) could be used if you are ok with
> GPL… they have their own graph format so there could be some interaction.

this would work the same as with graphviz as an additional dependency on ogdf, right?

GraphViz is good enough for generic graphs, but OGDF is well-founded and much more powerful layouting library. However C++ coding is required if one wants to use it.

Peter

abergel

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by Peter Uhnak

> In any case, I wrote a simpler layout delegator in Roassal that delegates the layouting to graphviz and it works reasonably well, so I could probably add it to Roassal (you however need graphviz installed and it would add another dependency to Roassal, which I'm not so keen on).

Where can we have it please?

Alexandre

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

stepharo

Re: Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by abergel

Great call and initiative.

I would like see
- better arrows (this is related also to the third point)
- get the graphViz algo finished (even if not fully working) Anne
and guillaume got lost in translation there
but it would be a real game changer.
- having a better output (arrows, edge) and animation (like the web
library Telescope is using to render visualisation on the web)
Guillaume knows it name. (Guillaume what is the name of the library
you use)

Stef

Le 24/2/16 09:51, Alexandre Bergel a écrit :

> Dear community,
>
> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>
> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>
> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>
> Kind regards,
> Alexandre

CyrilFerlicot

Re: Call for action for Roassal

On 24/02/2016 12:42, stepharo wrote:

> Great call and initiative.
>
> I would like see
> - better arrows (this is related also to the third point)
> - get the graphViz algo finished (even if not fully working) Anne
> and guillaume got lost in translation there
> but it would be a real game changer.
> - having a better output (arrows, edge) and animation (like the web
> library Telescope is using to render visualisation on the web)
> Guillaume knows it name. (Guillaume what is the name of the library
> you use)
>

http://js.cytoscape.org/

>
> Stef
>
>

--
Cyril Ferlicot

http://www.synectique.eu

165 Avenue Bretagne
Lille 59000 France

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abergel

Re: [Moose-dev] Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by abergel

>> Dear community,
>> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>
> My favorite improvement would not really be a Roassal feature
> but would save me a lot of time:
> I would like the configuration versions to stop depending on numbered versions of outside dependencies (Glamour, Neo-JSON-Core)

Hi!

I do not get this. Relying on the baseline is not enough?

Roassal is very simply packaged. Only 4 packages: Roassal, Trachel, Roassal2Spec, Roassal2GT. It is very unlikely that this list of package will grow (not until we have a Git integration at least). You can make your configuration directly point to these packages no?

Cheers,
Alexandre

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Tudor Girba-2

Re: [Moose-dev] Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by abergel

This is very cool. We will all benefit from this documentation.

One thing that I would still like to see fixed before the release is the edge building (this problem of not being able to properly specify random objects to be taken into account when building edges). Could we work on that?

Cheers,
Doru

> On Feb 24, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Dear community,
>
> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>
> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>
> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>
> Kind regards,
> Alexandre
> --
> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

“Live like you mean it."

abergel

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Moose-dev] Call for action for Roassal

Do you have an example? I am not sure to understand.

Alexandre

> On Feb 25, 2016, at 12:40 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> This is very cool. We will all benefit from this documentation.
>
> One thing that I would still like to see fixed before the release is the edge building (this problem of not being able to properly specify random objects to be taken into account when building edges). Could we work on that?
>
> Cheers,
> Doru
>
>
>> On Feb 24, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Dear community,
>>
>> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>>
>> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>>
>> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>> Alexandre
>> --
>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> “Live like you mean it."
>
>

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Tudor Girba-2

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: [Pharo-dev] Call for action for Roassal

Hi,

We discussed this before. Try to draw a hierarchy using classes and inheritance objects (so, without using the class to superclass navigation). Something like this:

view := RTMondrian new.
view nodes: classes.
view edges objects: inheritances; connectFrom: #superclass to: #subclass.
view layout tree.
view

It won’t work.

Cheers,
Doru

> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:29 PM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Do you have an example? I am not sure to understand.
>
> Alexandre
>
>
>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 12:40 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> This is very cool. We will all benefit from this documentation.
>>
>> One thing that I would still like to see fixed before the release is the edge building (this problem of not being able to properly specify random objects to be taken into account when building edges). Could we work on that?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>> On Feb 24, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Dear community,
>>>
>>> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>>>
>>> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>>>
>>> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>> Alexandre
>>> --
>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> “Live like you mean it."
>>
>>
>
> --
> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"Value is always contextual."

abergel

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

Oh, but this has been in Roassal for many months (I have implemented since right after ESUG). You need to use #source:connectFrom:toAll:

Here is an example that randomly generate a graph and render it using this facility:

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

nbOfNodes := 40.
nbOfRandomEdges := 40.

nodes := 1 to: nbOfNodes.
edges := (1 to: nbOfRandomEdges)
collect: [ :notUsed | nodes atRandom -> {nodes atRandom . nodes atRandom} ].

b := RTMondrian new.

b shape circle color: (Color black alpha: 0.5).
b nodes: nodes.

b shape line color: (Color gray alpha: 0.3).
b edges
source: edges connectFrom: #key toAll: #value.

b layout force.
b

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Cheers,

Alexandre

On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:37 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi,

We discussed this before. Try to draw a hierarchy using classes and inheritance objects (so, without using the class to superclass navigation). Something like this:

view := RTMondrian new.
view nodes: classes.
view edges objects: inheritances; connectFrom: #superclass to: #subclass.
view layout tree.
view

It won’t work.

Cheers,
Doru

On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:29 PM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:

Do you have an example? I am not sure to understand.

Alexandre

On Feb 25, 2016, at 12:40 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:

This is very cool. We will all benefit from this documentation.

One thing that I would still like to see fixed before the release is the edge building (this problem of not being able to properly specify random objects to be taken into account when building edges). Could we work on that?

Cheers,
Doru

On Feb 24, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear community,

As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:

What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?

You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.

Kind regards,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

“Live like you mean it."

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"Value is always contextual."

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Tudor Girba-2

Re: [Moose-dev] [Pharo-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

Oh, I missed this one :). So, now I can refactor the code that is still using the RTEdge class side methods :).

Great!

Thanks,
Doru

> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:59 PM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Oh, but this has been in Roassal for many months (I have implemented since right after ESUG). You need to use #source:connectFrom:toAll:
>
> Here is an example that randomly generate a graph and render it using this facility:
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> nbOfNodes := 40.
> nbOfRandomEdges := 40.
>
> nodes := 1 to: nbOfNodes.
> edges := (1 to: nbOfRandomEdges)
> collect: [ :notUsed | nodes atRandom -> {nodes atRandom . nodes atRandom} ].
>
> b := RTMondrian new.
>
> b shape circle color: (Color black alpha: 0.5).
> b nodes: nodes.
>
> b shape line color: (Color gray alpha: 0.3).
> b edges
> source: edges connectFrom: #key toAll: #value.
>
> b layout force.
> b
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
> <Screen Shot 2016-02-25 at 1.57.24 PM.png>
>
> Cheers,
> Alexandre
>
>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:37 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> We discussed this before. Try to draw a hierarchy using classes and inheritance objects (so, without using the class to superclass navigation). Something like this:
>>
>> view := RTMondrian new.
>> view nodes: classes.
>> view edges objects: inheritances; connectFrom: #superclass to: #subclass.
>> view layout tree.
>> view
>>
>> It won’t work.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:29 PM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Do you have an example? I am not sure to understand.
>>>
>>> Alexandre
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 12:40 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> This is very cool. We will all benefit from this documentation.
>>>>
>>>> One thing that I would still like to see fixed before the release is the edge building (this problem of not being able to properly specify random objects to be taken into account when building edges). Could we work on that?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Doru
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 24, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dear community,
>>>>>
>>>>> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>>>>>
>>>>> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>>>>>
>>>>> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>> --
>>>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>> www.feenk.com
>>>>
>>>> “Live like you mean it."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> "Value is always contextual."
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know her."

Peter Uhnak

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: [Pharo-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

Hi Anne,

I've just added a Roassal plugin with the GraphViz-based layout.

Note that I had to hack it to work with RTMultiLine (it was originally designed for different lines which are currently not part of Roassal),

so it's possible there will be some issues.

You can load it (if you have latest Roassal installed) via the Roassal plugin menu,

or by executing the following

Metacello new

baseline: 'GraphVizLayout';

repository: 'github://peteruhnak/graphviz-layout:master/repository';

load

Then look at the class-side examples in RTGraphVizLayout.

Finally if you use this, you shouldn't move elements within the layout (because graphviz layout hard-codes the pathing)… we could probably change this in the future, but I am not sure how (ideally the layout would have to be recomputed, but that's expensive to do live),

So to summarize:

* you must have GraphViz installed in your system

* you must use RTMultiLine for lines (because only they support bending)

Let me know how it goes,

Peter

On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 2:02 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:

Oh, I missed this one :). So, now I can refactor the code that is still using the RTEdge class side methods :).

Great!

Thanks,
Doru

> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:59 PM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Oh, but this has been in Roassal for many months (I have implemented since right after ESUG). You need to use #source:connectFrom:toAll:
>
> Here is an example that randomly generate a graph and render it using this facility:
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> nbOfNodes := 40.
> nbOfRandomEdges := 40.
>
> nodes := 1 to: nbOfNodes.
> edges := (1 to: nbOfRandomEdges)
> collect: [ :notUsed | nodes atRandom -> {nodes atRandom . nodes atRandom} ].
>
> b := RTMondrian new.
>
> b shape circle color: (Color black alpha: 0.5).
> b nodes: nodes.
>
> b shape line color: (Color gray alpha: 0.3).
> b edges
> source: edges connectFrom: #key toAll: #value.
>
> b layout force.
> b
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
> <Screen Shot 2016-02-25 at 1.57.24 PM.png>

>
> Cheers,
> Alexandre
>
>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:37 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> We discussed this before. Try to draw a hierarchy using classes and inheritance objects (so, without using the class to superclass navigation). Something like this:
>>
>> view := RTMondrian new.
>> view nodes: classes.
>> view edges objects: inheritances; connectFrom: #superclass to: #subclass.
>> view layout tree.
>> view
>>
>> It won’t work.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 1:29 PM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Do you have an example? I am not sure to understand.
>>>
>>> Alexandre
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Feb 25, 2016, at 12:40 PM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> This is very cool. We will all benefit from this documentation.
>>>>
>>>> One thing that I would still like to see fixed before the release is the edge building (this problem of not being able to properly specify random objects to be taken into account when building edges). Could we work on that?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Doru
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 24, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dear community,
>>>>>
>>>>> As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:
>>>>>
>>>>> What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?
>>>>>
>>>>> You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>> --
>>>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>> www.feenk.com
>>>>
>>>> “Live like you mean it."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> "Value is always contextual."
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

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jfabry

Re: [Moose-dev] Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by abergel

Better late than never :-) (working on the holidays backlog)

I only have one request: better positioning on labels of nodes and edges. For example see the image: three of the four labels are badly positioned because the bounding box of their text is intersected by one or more edges.

I know that to solve this generally is hard, but for simple cases like this it should be possible.

Ah, and it should work well with animations and dragging of course ;-)

On Feb 24, 2016, at 05:51, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear community,

As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:

What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?

You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.

Kind regards,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

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abergel

Re: [Moose-dev] Call for action for Roassal

Thanks!

Alexandre

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

On Mar 7, 2016, at 10:34 AM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:

Better late than never :-) (working on the holidays backlog)

I only have one request: better positioning on labels of nodes and edges. For example see the image: three of the four labels are badly positioned because the bounding box of their text is intersected by one or more edges.

<Screen Shot 2016-03-07 at 10.31.24.png>
I know that to solve this generally is hard, but for simple cases like this it should be possible.

Ah, and it should work well with animations and dragging of course ;-)

On Feb 24, 2016, at 05:51, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear community,

As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:

What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?

You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.

Kind regards,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

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Peter Uhnak

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by jfabry

Hi Johan,

I've just commited RTAnchorConstraint to latest Roassal, see class-side example there.

I've been using it for my class diagrams where it works quite well, however class diagrams are usually orthogonal-ish, which makes it a bit nicer.

The Anchor will avoid intersecting it's own line, and one of the end shapes (it should both but apparently I have a bug there...).

It doesn't look at other lines, however you can specify on which side it should be.

(You can also put the node label inside the circle with `el @ (RTLabelled new center)` but you probably know that.)

I have also a global edge labeling layout which produces good placement… but it's slow as hell… I need to write a fast flow alogrithm…

Also the Anchor currently doesn't work with self-edges. On the other hand Roassal doesn't have self-edges yet so it shouldn't be a problem. :)

Peter

On Mon, Mar 7, 2016 at 2:34 PM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:

Better late than never :-) (working on the holidays backlog)

I only have one request: better positioning on labels of nodes and edges. For example see the image: three of the four labels are badly positioned because the bounding box of their text is intersected by one or more edges.

I know that to solve this generally is hard, but for simple cases like this it should be possible.

Ah, and it should work well with animations and dragging of course ;-)

On Feb 24, 2016, at 05:51, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear community,

As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:

What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?

You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.

Kind regards,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

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jfabry

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

Excellent, thanks a lot! I will take a look at that tomorrow.

On Mar 7, 2016, at 11:34, Peter Uhnák <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Johan,

I've just commited RTAnchorConstraint to latest Roassal, see class-side example there.

I've been using it for my class diagrams where it works quite well, however class diagrams are usually orthogonal-ish, which makes it a bit nicer.
<uml.png>

The Anchor will avoid intersecting it's own line, and one of the end shapes (it should both but apparently I have a bug there...).
It doesn't look at other lines, however you can specify on which side it should be.

(You can also put the node label inside the circle with `el @ (RTLabelled new center)` but you probably know that.)
<anchor.png>

I have also a global edge labeling layout which produces good placement… but it's slow as hell… I need to write a fast flow alogrithm…

Also the Anchor currently doesn't work with self-edges. On the other hand Roassal doesn't have self-edges yet so it shouldn't be a problem. :)

Peter

On Mon, Mar 7, 2016 at 2:34 PM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:

Better late than never :-) (working on the holidays backlog)

I only have one request: better positioning on labels of nodes and edges. For example see the image: three of the four labels are badly positioned because the bounding box of their text is intersected by one or more edges.

<Screen Shot 2016-03-07 at 10.31.24.png>
I know that to solve this generally is hard, but for simple cases like this it should be possible.

Ah, and it should work well with animations and dragging of course ;-)

On Feb 24, 2016, at 05:51, Alexandre Bergel <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear community,

As you may have seen, Roassal has entered a stabilization phase. The book AgileVisualization.com will soon be released. After its release, Roassal will go over a new development phase. In order to prepare it, I am asking this question:

What are the 3 aspects you would like to see improved in Roassal?

You can answer publicly or by sending private messages.

Kind regards,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

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jfabry

Re: [Moose-dev] Re: Call for action for Roassal

In reply to this post by Peter Uhnak

On Mar 7, 2016, at 11:34, Peter Uhnák <[hidden email]> wrote:

I've just commited RTAnchorConstraint to latest Roassal, see class-side example there.

I have been trying it, and there is a first version that works now, thanks!

I even have a bug report for you … before, when I removed the edge, the label was also removed automatically. Now this is no longer the case. :-(

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