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[Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

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Torsten Bergmann

[Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

Hi all,

as you know Denis Kudriashov does a fantastic job in implementing the new Calypso system browser.
The plan is that at some point in time will be a replacement for Nautilus in the standard image.
Even if not yet integrated one can already use it (either by loading from catalog or github [1])

For me the more I use it (and get used to it) the more I like Calypso and I guess others enjoy it too already.

But unfortunately there is a single but very prominently visible UI thing that I dislike on the current look:

For the "Pharo3Theme" (light theme) the current implementation of Calypso has a white toolbar in the
middle and a white status bar at the bottom. Technically Dennis sets the colors of these morphs to
transparent to have this effect (see LEFT example of the attached screenshot)

To me this lookes strange and unusual because
- usually (on Windows, GTK, Java Swing, Linux window managers) such areas like a status bar follow the window color
and are displayed in gray when that is the default window theme color (see [2], [3], [4])
- these white bars would better fit for the "Glamorous Whitespace" theme (as this theme is already more white areas)

Also the current white bars do not make a pleasant contrast to the other panes of Calypso:
- there is not really a visual distinction to the package/class/protocol-tag/method panes and filters for the middle part (toolbar)
- there is not really a visual distinction from the code pane for the bottom part (statusbar)
- the divider line in the code pane just stops in a white area without borders

To me this looks rather ugly and I would like Pharo to look more professional and clean ;)

So I proposed a simple PR [5] today to change this and technically using the window color of the theme - the result can be
seen on the right side of the attached screenshot and discussed with Denis on Discord.

Denis on the other hand still likes the white approach on the left more while I prefer the right one.

He wrote that he wants other people comment on this issue first to which I agree and therefore I write this mail
to discuss it here on the dev-list and find out about what the majority in the community prefers.

So it would be good if others could
- comment about their personal preference
- or just vote with "LEFT" (white/transparent) or "RIGHT" (window color) in reply to this mail
- or make another proposal (which is only accepted with screenshot and PR ;)

Also please do not mix other UI discussions into this thread. Thanks in advance!

Bye
T.

[1] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso
[2] http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/show-status-bar-and-disk-space-lion.jpg
[3] http://i.stack.imgur.com/pgt5n.png
[4] http://python.zirael.org/gtk-statusbar1-1.png
[5] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso/pull/91

calypsoProposedLook.png (272K) Download Attachment

Brad Selfridge

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

"RIGHT" (window color)

--
Brad Selfridge
913-269-2385

Brad Selfridge

Sven Van Caekenberghe-2

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

> On 13 Sep 2017, at 18:32, Brad Selfridge <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> "RIGHT" (window color)

Yes, right seems better.

Stephane Ducasse-3

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

In reply to this post by Brad Selfridge

I agree Right is a lot better and I would love to get FastTable or
related fixed so that we can see the filter input field at the end of
the left pane.

On Wed, Sep 13, 2017 at 6:32 PM, Brad Selfridge <[hidden email]> wrote:
> "RIGHT" (window color)
>
>
> --
> Brad Selfridge
> 913-269-2385
>
>

EstebanLM

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

right.

> On 13 Sep 2017, at 19:01, Stephane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I agree Right is a lot better and I would love to get FastTable or
> related fixed so that we can see the filter input field at the end of
> the left pane.
>
> On Wed, Sep 13, 2017 at 6:32 PM, Brad Selfridge <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> "RIGHT" (window color)
>>
>>
>> --
>> Brad Selfridge
>> 913-269-2385
>>
>>
>

Max Leske

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

In reply to this post by Torsten Bergmann

Right

On 13 September 2017 at 18:08:26, Torsten Bergmann ([hidden email]) wrote:

Hi all,

as you know Denis Kudriashov does a fantastic job in implementing the new Calypso system browser.
The plan is that at some point in time will be a replacement for Nautilus in the standard image.
Even if not yet integrated one can already use it (either by loading from catalog or github [1])

For me the more I use it (and get used to it) the more I like Calypso and I guess others enjoy it too already.

But unfortunately there is a single but very prominently visible UI thing that I dislike on the current look:

For the "Pharo3Theme" (light theme) the current implementation of Calypso has a white toolbar in the
middle and a white status bar at the bottom. Technically Dennis sets the colors of these morphs to
transparent to have this effect (see LEFT example of the attached screenshot)

To me this lookes strange and unusual because
- usually (on Windows, GTK, Java Swing, Linux window managers) such areas like a status bar follow the window color
and are displayed in gray when that is the default window theme color (see [2], [3], [4])
- these white bars would better fit for the "Glamorous Whitespace" theme (as this theme is already more white areas)

Also the current white bars do not make a pleasant contrast to the other panes of Calypso:
- there is not really a visual distinction to the package/class/protocol-tag/method panes and filters for the middle part (toolbar)
- there is not really a visual distinction from the code pane for the bottom part (statusbar)
- the divider line in the code pane just stops in a white area without borders

To me this looks rather ugly and I would like Pharo to look more professional and clean ;)

So I proposed a simple PR [5] today to change this and technically using the window color of the theme - the result can be
seen on the right side of the attached screenshot and discussed with Denis on Discord.

Denis on the other hand still likes the white approach on the left more while I prefer the right one.

He wrote that he wants other people comment on this issue first to which I agree and therefore I write this mail
to discuss it here on the dev-list and find out about what the majority in the community prefers.

So it would be good if others could
- comment about their personal preference
- or just vote with "LEFT" (white/transparent) or "RIGHT" (window color) in reply to this mail
- or make another proposal (which is only accepted with screenshot and PR ;)

Also please do not mix other UI discussions into this thread. Thanks in advance!

Bye
T.

[1] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso
[2] http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/show-status-bar-and-disk-space-lion.jpg
[3] http://i.stack.imgur.com/pgt5n.png
[4] http://python.zirael.org/gtk-statusbar1-1.png
[5] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso/pull/91

Denis Kudriashov

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.

2017-09-14 7:09 GMT+02:00 Max Leske <[hidden email]>:

Right

On 13 September 2017 at 18:08:26, Torsten Bergmann ([hidden email]) wrote:

Hi all,

as you know Denis Kudriashov does a fantastic job in implementing the new Calypso system browser.
The plan is that at some point in time will be a replacement for Nautilus in the standard image.
Even if not yet integrated one can already use it (either by loading from catalog or github [1])

For me the more I use it (and get used to it) the more I like Calypso and I guess others enjoy it too already.

But unfortunately there is a single but very prominently visible UI thing that I dislike on the current look:

For the "Pharo3Theme" (light theme) the current implementation of Calypso has a white toolbar in the
middle and a white status bar at the bottom. Technically Dennis sets the colors of these morphs to
transparent to have this effect (see LEFT example of the attached screenshot)

To me this lookes strange and unusual because
- usually (on Windows, GTK, Java Swing, Linux window managers) such areas like a status bar follow the window color
and are displayed in gray when that is the default window theme color (see [2], [3], [4])
- these white bars would better fit for the "Glamorous Whitespace" theme (as this theme is already more white areas)

Also the current white bars do not make a pleasant contrast to the other panes of Calypso:
- there is not really a visual distinction to the package/class/protocol-tag/method panes and filters for the middle part (toolbar)
- there is not really a visual distinction from the code pane for the bottom part (statusbar)
- the divider line in the code pane just stops in a white area without borders

To me this looks rather ugly and I would like Pharo to look more professional and clean ;)

So I proposed a simple PR [5] today to change this and technically using the window color of the theme - the result can be
seen on the right side of the attached screenshot and discussed with Denis on Discord.

Denis on the other hand still likes the white approach on the left more while I prefer the right one.

He wrote that he wants other people comment on this issue first to which I agree and therefore I write this mail
to discuss it here on the dev-list and find out about what the majority in the community prefers.

So it would be good if others could
- comment about their personal preference
- or just vote with "LEFT" (white/transparent) or "RIGHT" (window color) in reply to this mail
- or make another proposal (which is only accepted with screenshot and PR ;)

Also please do not mix other UI discussions into this thread. Thanks in advance!

Bye
T.

[1] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso
[2] http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/show-status-bar-and-disk-space-lion.jpg
[3] http://i.stack.imgur.com/pgt5n.png
[4] http://python.zirael.org/gtk-statusbar1-1.png
[5] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso/pull/91

alistairgrant

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

On 14 September 2017 at 09:24, Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will
> merge your changes soon.

RIGHT.

A bit late to the party, but I agree that the right version is much
easier to read.

Thanks,
Alistair

> 2017-09-14 7:09 GMT+02:00 Max Leske <[hidden email]>:
>>
>> Right
>>
>>
>> On 13 September 2017 at 18:08:26, Torsten Bergmann ([hidden email]) wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> as you know Denis Kudriashov does a fantastic job in implementing the new
>> Calypso system browser.
>> The plan is that at some point in time will be a replacement for Nautilus
>> in the standard image.
>> Even if not yet integrated one can already use it (either by loading from
>> catalog or github [1])
>>
>> For me the more I use it (and get used to it) the more I like Calypso and
>> I guess others enjoy it too already.
>>
>> But unfortunately there is a single but very prominently visible UI thing
>> that I dislike on the current look:
>>
>> For the "Pharo3Theme" (light theme) the current implementation of Calypso
>> has a white toolbar in the
>> middle and a white status bar at the bottom. Technically Dennis sets the
>> colors of these morphs to
>> transparent to have this effect (see LEFT example of the attached
>> screenshot)
>>
>>
>> To me this lookes strange and unusual because
>> - usually (on Windows, GTK, Java Swing, Linux window managers) such areas
>> like a status bar follow the window color
>> and are displayed in gray when that is the default window theme color (see
>> [2], [3], [4])
>> - these white bars would better fit for the "Glamorous Whitespace" theme
>> (as this theme is already more white areas)
>>
>> Also the current white bars do not make a pleasant contrast to the other
>> panes of Calypso:
>> - there is not really a visual distinction to the
>> package/class/protocol-tag/method panes and filters for the middle part
>> (toolbar)
>> - there is not really a visual distinction from the code pane for the
>> bottom part (statusbar)
>> - the divider line in the code pane just stops in a white area without
>> borders
>>
>> To me this looks rather ugly and I would like Pharo to look more
>> professional and clean ;)
>>
>> So I proposed a simple PR [5] today to change this and technically using
>> the window color of the theme - the result can be
>> seen on the right side of the attached screenshot and discussed with Denis
>> on Discord.
>>
>> Denis on the other hand still likes the white approach on the left more
>> while I prefer the right one.
>>
>> He wrote that he wants other people comment on this issue first to which I
>> agree and therefore I write this mail
>> to discuss it here on the dev-list and find out about what the majority in
>> the community prefers.
>>
>> So it would be good if others could
>> - comment about their personal preference
>> - or just vote with "LEFT" (white/transparent) or "RIGHT" (window color)
>> in reply to this mail
>> - or make another proposal (which is only accepted with screenshot and PR
>> ;)
>>
>> Also please do not mix other UI discussions into this thread. Thanks in
>> advance!
>>
>> Bye
>> T.
>>
>> [1] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso
>> [2]
>> http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/show-status-bar-and-disk-space-lion.jpg
>> [3] http://i.stack.imgur.com/pgt5n.png
>> [4] http://python.zirael.org/gtk-statusbar1-1.png
>> [5] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso/pull/91
>
>

Stephane Ducasse-3

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

Thanks Denis for your positive mindset and constant willingness to improve.

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 3:05 PM, Alistair Grant <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 14 September 2017 at 09:24, Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will
>> merge your changes soon.
>
> RIGHT.
>
> A bit late to the party, but I agree that the right version is much
> easier to read.
>
> Thanks,
> Alistair
>
>
>> 2017-09-14 7:09 GMT+02:00 Max Leske <[hidden email]>:
>>>
>>> Right
>>>
>>>
>>> On 13 September 2017 at 18:08:26, Torsten Bergmann ([hidden email]) wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> as you know Denis Kudriashov does a fantastic job in implementing the new
>>> Calypso system browser.
>>> The plan is that at some point in time will be a replacement for Nautilus
>>> in the standard image.
>>> Even if not yet integrated one can already use it (either by loading from
>>> catalog or github [1])
>>>
>>> For me the more I use it (and get used to it) the more I like Calypso and
>>> I guess others enjoy it too already.
>>>
>>> But unfortunately there is a single but very prominently visible UI thing
>>> that I dislike on the current look:
>>>
>>> For the "Pharo3Theme" (light theme) the current implementation of Calypso
>>> has a white toolbar in the
>>> middle and a white status bar at the bottom. Technically Dennis sets the
>>> colors of these morphs to
>>> transparent to have this effect (see LEFT example of the attached
>>> screenshot)
>>>
>>>
>>> To me this lookes strange and unusual because
>>> - usually (on Windows, GTK, Java Swing, Linux window managers) such areas
>>> like a status bar follow the window color
>>> and are displayed in gray when that is the default window theme color (see
>>> [2], [3], [4])
>>> - these white bars would better fit for the "Glamorous Whitespace" theme
>>> (as this theme is already more white areas)
>>>
>>> Also the current white bars do not make a pleasant contrast to the other
>>> panes of Calypso:
>>> - there is not really a visual distinction to the
>>> package/class/protocol-tag/method panes and filters for the middle part
>>> (toolbar)
>>> - there is not really a visual distinction from the code pane for the
>>> bottom part (statusbar)
>>> - the divider line in the code pane just stops in a white area without
>>> borders
>>>
>>> To me this looks rather ugly and I would like Pharo to look more
>>> professional and clean ;)
>>>
>>> So I proposed a simple PR [5] today to change this and technically using
>>> the window color of the theme - the result can be
>>> seen on the right side of the attached screenshot and discussed with Denis
>>> on Discord.
>>>
>>> Denis on the other hand still likes the white approach on the left more
>>> while I prefer the right one.
>>>
>>> He wrote that he wants other people comment on this issue first to which I
>>> agree and therefore I write this mail
>>> to discuss it here on the dev-list and find out about what the majority in
>>> the community prefers.
>>>
>>> So it would be good if others could
>>> - comment about their personal preference
>>> - or just vote with "LEFT" (white/transparent) or "RIGHT" (window color)
>>> in reply to this mail
>>> - or make another proposal (which is only accepted with screenshot and PR
>>> ;)
>>>
>>> Also please do not mix other UI discussions into this thread. Thanks in
>>> advance!
>>>
>>> Bye
>>> T.
>>>
>>> [1] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso
>>> [2]
>>> http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/show-status-bar-and-disk-space-lion.jpg
>>> [3] http://i.stack.imgur.com/pgt5n.png
>>> [4] http://python.zirael.org/gtk-statusbar1-1.png
>>> [5] https://github.com/dionisiydk/Calypso/pull/91
>>
>>
>

Torsten Bergmann

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

In reply to this post by Denis Kudriashov

"Denis Kudriashov" wrote
>Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.

No - we have to thank you. For Calypso, for accepting the community decision and (in advance) for
merging the first Calypso pull request.

I'm pretty sure the next Pharo versions will rock even more ...

Bye
T.

Stephane Ducasse-3

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

I would really like to be able to define methods without being forced
to give a protocol.

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 9:29 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:

> "Denis Kudriashov" wrote
>>Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.
>
> No - we have to thank you. For Calypso, for accepting the community decision and (in advance) for
> merging the first Calypso pull request.
>
> I'm pretty sure the next Pharo versions will rock even more ...
>
> Bye
> T.
>

Mariano Martinez Peck

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

In reply to this post by Torsten Bergmann

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:

"Denis Kudriashov" wrote
>Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.

No - we have to thank you. For Calypso, for accepting the community decision and (in advance) for
merging the first Calypso pull request.

+1. I am already enjoying it since a couple of months and Denis was also quick to incorporate my suggestions :)

BTW, RIGHT, of course.

I'm pretty sure the next Pharo versions will rock even more ...

Bye
T.

Mariano
http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Denis Kudriashov

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

2017-09-18 13:47 GMT+02:00 Mariano Martinez Peck <[hidden email]>:

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:
"Denis Kudriashov" wrote
>Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.

No - we have to thank you. For Calypso, for accepting the community decision and (in advance) for
merging the first Calypso pull request.

+1. I am already enjoying it since a couple of months and Denis was also quick to incorporate my suggestions :)

Now I am not so quick. I am in the middle of refactoring and cleaning and I not created special branch for it. (I must do it always).

BTW, RIGHT, of course.

I'm pretty sure the next Pharo versions will rock even more ...

Bye
T.

--
Mariano
http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Torsten Bergmann

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

Mhhh ... I guess this is something you can handle with some git commands.

https://www.mikeplate.com/2012/04/21/rewind-master-if-you-forgot-to-create-new-branch-in-git/

Bye

Gesendet: Dienstag, 19. September 2017 um 17:07 Uhr
Von: "Denis Kudriashov" <[hidden email]>
An: "Pharo Development List" <[hidden email]>
Betreff: Re: [Pharo-dev] [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

2017-09-18 13:47 GMT+02:00 Mariano Martinez Peck <[hidden email]>:

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:
"Denis Kudriashov" wrote
>Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.

No - we have to thank you. For Calypso, for accepting the community decision and (in advance) for
merging the first Calypso pull request.

+1. I am already enjoying it since a couple of months and Denis was also quick to incorporate my suggestions :)

Now I am not so quick. I am in the middle of refactoring and cleaning and I not created special branch for it. (I must do it always).

BTW, RIGHT, of course.

I'm pretty sure the next Pharo versions will rock even more ...

Bye
T.

--
Mariano
http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Denis Kudriashov

Re: [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

I know it is possible. But I expect that this issue can wait a bit :)

2017-09-19 17:43 GMT+02:00 Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]>:

Mhhh ... I guess this is something you can handle with some git commands.

https://www.mikeplate.com/2012/04/21/rewind-master-if-you-forgot-to-create-new-branch-in-git/

Bye

T.

Gesendet: Dienstag, 19. September 2017 um 17:07 Uhr
Von: "Denis Kudriashov" <[hidden email]>
An: "Pharo Development List" <[hidden email]>
Betreff: Re: [Pharo-dev] [Calypso] Toolbar and Statusbar Look - voting time

2017-09-18 13:47 GMT+02:00 Mariano Martinez Peck <[hidden email]>:

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:
"Denis Kudriashov" wrote
>Thank's guys for comments. And thank's Torsten for this initiative. I will merge your changes soon.

No - we have to thank you. For Calypso, for accepting the community decision and (in advance) for
merging the first Calypso pull request.

+1. I am already enjoying it since a couple of months and Denis was also quick to incorporate my suggestions :)

Now I am not so quick. I am in the middle of refactoring and cleaning and I not created special branch for it. (I must do it always).

BTW, RIGHT, of course.

I'm pretty sure the next Pharo versions will rock even more ...

Bye
T.

--
Mariano
http://marianopeck.wordpress.com