Cypress compatibility

Hi Folks,

Cypress is a project by Dale Henrichs with the objective to create a
cross-dialect package file format. Cypress is available for Squeak,
Pharo, Gemstone, Amber and now Cuis. Dale himself did a preliminary
version of Cypress for Cuis some time ago. Today I updated the code at
https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress and it is now working.

To use it, please update your Cuis image to #1307, or get an updated
image from https://github.com/jvuletich/Cuis .

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

_______________________________________________
Cuis mailing list
[hidden email]
http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org

Juan,

Very cool!

If you are interested in taking things for a spin, see the FileTree project on GitHub[1] for Pharo/Squeak/GemStone installation instructions. For amber information see the Amber-Skeleton project[2].

FileTree uses the Cypress disk format for a Monticello repository. Amber-Skeleton incudes a Pharo-based "file server" that reads/write Cypress disk format for Amber projects.

Please report any issues on the relevant issue list for the respective projects[1][2][3] or send mail to this list.

Dale

[1] https://github.com/dalehenrich/filetree
[2] https://github.com/dalehenrich/amber-skeleton
[3] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress
----- Original Message -----
| From: "Juan Vuletich" <[hidden email]>
| To: [hidden email]
| Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 9:39:26 AM
| Subject: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
|
| Hi Folks,
|
| Cypress is a project by Dale Henrichs with the objective to create a
| cross-dialect package file format. Cypress is available for Squeak,
| Pharo, Gemstone, Amber and now Cuis. Dale himself did a preliminary
| version of Cypress for Cuis some time ago. Today I updated the code
| at
| https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress and it is now working.
|
| To use it, please update your Cuis image to #1307, or get an updated
| image from https://github.com/jvuletich/Cuis .
|
| Cheers,
| Juan Vuletich
|
| _______________________________________________
| Cuis mailing list
| [hidden email]
| http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
|

_______________________________________________
Cuis mailing list
[hidden email]
http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org

Hi Dale,

Cuis doesn't support Monticello. I think that the best way to use a VCS
like Git / GitHub is by having the IDE and tools be unaware about it.
This allows the package support in Cuis to be really simple and fast.
Because of this, Cypress makes a lot of sense for Cuis, but FileTree not
so much.

(In any case, as usual, anybody is welcome to work on this as an
external package if he desires to do it).

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

Dale Henrichs wrote:

_______________________________________________
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Juan,

I agree completely with your sentiment about sticking with Cypress for Cuis...

I mentioned FileTree only to point out that if one is interested in porting code from Pharo to Cuis (or vice versa), you should be able to create a FileTree repository with Pharo and then load/save the code into/from Cuis (and vice versa) making it easier to share cross-dialect source code, since the source can be managed in git from both platforms...

Dale


----- Original Message -----
| From: "Juan Vuletich" <[hidden email]>
| To: "Discussion of Cuis Smalltalk" <[hidden email]>
| Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2012 9:02:38 PM
| Subject: Re: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
|
| Hi Dale,
|
| Cuis doesn't support Monticello. I think that the best way to use a
| VCS
| like Git / GitHub is by having the IDE and tools be unaware about it.
| This allows the package support in Cuis to be really simple and fast.
| Because of this, Cypress makes a lot of sense for Cuis, but FileTree
| not
| so much.
|
| (In any case, as usual, anybody is welcome to work on this as an
| external package if he desires to do it).
|
| Cheers,
| Juan Vuletich
|
| Dale Henrichs wrote:
| > Juan,
| >
| > Very cool!
| >
| > If you are interested in taking things for a spin, see the FileTree
| > project on GitHub[1] for Pharo/Squeak/GemStone installation
| > instructions. For amber information see the Amber-Skeleton
| > project[2].
| >
| > FileTree uses the Cypress disk format for a Monticello repository.
| > Amber-Skeleton incudes a Pharo-based "file server" that
| > reads/write Cypress disk format for Amber projects.
| >
| > Please report any issues on the relevant issue list for the
| > respective projects[1][2][3] or send mail to this list.
| >
| > Dale
| >
| > [1] https://github.com/dalehenrich/filetree
| > [2] https://github.com/dalehenrich/amber-skeleton
| > [3] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress
| > ----- Original Message -----
| > | From: "Juan Vuletich" <[hidden email]>
| > | To: [hidden email]
| > | Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 9:39:26 AM
| > | Subject: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
| > |
| > | Hi Folks,
| > |
| > | Cypress is a project by Dale Henrichs with the objective to
| > | create a
| > | cross-dialect package file format. Cypress is available for
| > | Squeak,
| > | Pharo, Gemstone, Amber and now Cuis. Dale himself did a
| > | preliminary
| > | version of Cypress for Cuis some time ago. Today I updated the
| > | code
| > | at
| > | https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress and it is now
| > | working.
| > |
| > | To use it, please update your Cuis image to #1307, or get an
| > | updated
| > | image from https://github.com/jvuletich/Cuis .
| > |
| > | Cheers,
| > | Juan Vuletich
| > |
| > | _______________________________________________
| > | Cuis mailing list
| > | [hidden email]
| > | http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| > |
| >
| > _______________________________________________
| > Cuis mailing list
| > [hidden email]
| > http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| >
| >
| > -----
| > Se certifico que el correo no contiene virus.
| > Comprobada por AVG - www.avg.es
| > Version: 2012.0.2177 / Base de datos de virus: 2433/5070 - Fecha de
| > la version: 14/06/2012
| >
| >
| >  
|
|
| _______________________________________________
| Cuis mailing list
| [hidden email]
| http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
|

_______________________________________________
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[hidden email]
http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org

Hi Dale,

I misunderstood what you said. Apologies.

I agree that the main purpose of Cypress for Cuis is to ease handling
multi-dialect packages. But I don't really understand the process for
using the Cypress format in other dialects. It seemed obvious to me that
people should install and use https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/Cypress .
You say is that the preferred way to use the Cypress package format from
Pharo is via FileTree (and not Cypress), right? Does it make sense to
maintain both FileTree and Cypress for Pharo and other (non-Cuis)
dialects? Can you elaborate a bit on this?

For instance, is it really necessary to create a FileTree repository
with Pharo? Can't I just save with cuis-cypress and commit/push to git?
We are using GitHub for hosting many Cuis packages (in native pck
format), an I guess doing that in Cypress format should be really similar.

I haven't been following this on other mail lists, I don't use other
dialects too much, and I haven't used Monticello in the last 6 or 7
years. I might be asking stuff that is obvious to others... Thanks for
your patience.

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

Dale Henrichs wrote:

_______________________________________________
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----- Original Message -----
| From: "Juan Vuletich" <[hidden email]>
| To: "Discussion of Cuis Smalltalk" <[hidden email]>
| Sent: Friday, June 15, 2012 3:25:24 AM
| Subject: Re: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
|
| Hi Dale,
|
| I misunderstood what you said. Apologies.
|
| I agree that the main purpose of Cypress for Cuis is to ease handling
| multi-dialect packages. But I don't really understand the process for
| using the Cypress format in other dialects. It seemed obvious to me
| that
| people should install and use
| https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/Cypress .

Ah, you need a little history here:)

In January I created the initial FileTree project based on work that Otto Behrens had done.

In March I gave a talk at the STIC 2012 conference entitled "Practical Git for Smalltalk"[1]. At the Camp Smalltalk following the conference a number of us got together and agreed upon the Cypress package structure[2].

Martin Kobetic began work adapting STIG[3] originally written by Travis Griggs for VisualWorks to the Cypress package structure.

In the following months I migrated the FileTree format to conform to the Cypress package structure.

At that time the two outstanding implementations of the Cypress package structure had no common code and there was no reference implementation.

I started the amber-cypress[2] with the intent of writing reference implementation of the Cypress package structure.

When I finished that work, I started the cuis-cypress[5] project and that's when you got involved and finished up the work, quite nicely.

So right now we have 6 dialects each with their own unique implementation of the common Cypress package structure:

  Squeak/Pharo/GemStone all share the
    FileTree project which reads/writes
    Cypress package structure using Monticello
    packages.
  VW uses the STIG project, which reads/writes
    Cypress package structure using VW packages.
  Cuis uses the cuis-cypress project which
    reads/writes Cypress format using Cuis
    packages.
  Amber uses the amber-cypress project which
    reads/writes Cypress format using Amber
    packages.

[1] http://portal.sliderocket.com/vmware/STIC-2012-Practical-Git-for-Smalltalk
[2] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/Cypress/blob/master/img/CypressStructure-STIC2012.png
[3] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/STIG
[4] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/amber-cypress
[5] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress

| You say is that the preferred way to use the Cypress package format
| from
| Pharo is via FileTree (and not Cypress), right? Does it make sense to
| maintain both FileTree and Cypress for Pharo and other (non-Cuis)
| dialects? Can you elaborate a bit on this?

It shouldn't matter whether Cuis or Pharo creates a Cypress package structure repository. The basic content is the same ... I didn't intend to imply that there was a "preferred creation method".


|
| For instance, is it really necessary to create a FileTree repository
| with Pharo? Can't I just save with cuis-cypress and commit/push to
| git?

Absolutely ... when I wrote the post, I was thinking in terms of porting code from Pharo to Cuis, in which case it would make sense to create the project in Pharo first. But if one were originating a project Cuis, then it makes perfect sense to create the project with Cuis.

| We are using GitHub for hosting many Cuis packages (in native pck
| format), an I guess doing that in Cypress format should be really
| similar.
|
| I haven't been following this on other mail lists, I don't use other
| dialects too much, and I haven't used Monticello in the last 6 or 7
| years. I might be asking stuff that is obvious to others... Thanks
| for
| your patience.

No problem ... the goal[1] is to create a cross dialect package format for sharing code, so it's worth spending the time clarifying things.

I'm anticipating that there will bee some growing pains as we all learn how to share code between dialects, but I think in the end it will be worth the effort!

Dale

[1] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/Cypress/blob/master/README.md
|
| Cheers,
| Juan Vuletich
|
| Dale Henrichs wrote:
| > Juan,
| >
| > I agree completely with your sentiment about sticking with Cypress
| > for Cuis...
| >
| > I mentioned FileTree only to point out that if one is interested in
| > porting code from Pharo to Cuis (or vice versa), you should be
| > able to create a FileTree repository with Pharo and then load/save
| > the code into/from Cuis (and vice versa) making it easier to share
| > cross-dialect source code, since the source can be managed in git
| > from both platforms...
| >
| > Dale
| >
| >
| > ----- Original Message -----
| > | From: "Juan Vuletich" <[hidden email]>
| > | To: "Discussion of Cuis Smalltalk" <[hidden email]>
| > | Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2012 9:02:38 PM
| > | Subject: Re: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
| > |
| > | Hi Dale,
| > |
| > | Cuis doesn't support Monticello. I think that the best way to use
| > | a
| > | VCS
| > | like Git / GitHub is by having the IDE and tools be unaware about
| > | it.
| > | This allows the package support in Cuis to be really simple and
| > | fast.
| > | Because of this, Cypress makes a lot of sense for Cuis, but
| > | FileTree
| > | not
| > | so much.
| > |
| > | (In any case, as usual, anybody is welcome to work on this as an
| > | external package if he desires to do it).
| > |
| > | Cheers,
| > | Juan Vuletich
| > |
| > | Dale Henrichs wrote:
| > | > Juan,
| > | >
| > | > Very cool!
| > | >
| > | > If you are interested in taking things for a spin, see the
| > | > FileTree
| > | > project on GitHub[1] for Pharo/Squeak/GemStone installation
| > | > instructions. For amber information see the Amber-Skeleton
| > | > project[2].
| > | >
| > | > FileTree uses the Cypress disk format for a Monticello
| > | > repository.
| > | > Amber-Skeleton incudes a Pharo-based "file server" that
| > | > reads/write Cypress disk format for Amber projects.
| > | >
| > | > Please report any issues on the relevant issue list for the
| > | > respective projects[1][2][3] or send mail to this list.
| > | >
| > | > Dale
| > | >
| > | > [1] https://github.com/dalehenrich/filetree
| > | > [2] https://github.com/dalehenrich/amber-skeleton
| > | > [3] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress
| > | > ----- Original Message -----
| > | > | From: "Juan Vuletich" <[hidden email]>
| > | > | To: [hidden email]
| > | > | Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 9:39:26 AM
| > | > | Subject: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
| > | > |
| > | > | Hi Folks,
| > | > |
| > | > | Cypress is a project by Dale Henrichs with the objective to
| > | > | create a
| > | > | cross-dialect package file format. Cypress is available for
| > | > | Squeak,
| > | > | Pharo, Gemstone, Amber and now Cuis. Dale himself did a
| > | > | preliminary
| > | > | version of Cypress for Cuis some time ago. Today I updated
| > | > | the
| > | > | code
| > | > | at
| > | > | https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress and it is now
| > | > | working.
| > | > |
| > | > | To use it, please update your Cuis image to #1307, or get an
| > | > | updated
| > | > | image from https://github.com/jvuletich/Cuis .
| > | > |
| > | > | Cheers,
| > | > | Juan Vuletich
| > | > |
| > | > | _______________________________________________
| > | > | Cuis mailing list
| > | > | [hidden email]
| > | > | http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > _______________________________________________
| > | > Cuis mailing list
| > | > [hidden email]
| > | > http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| > | >
| > | >
| > | > -----
| > | > Se certifico que el correo no contiene virus.
| > | > Comprobada por AVG - www.avg.es
| > | > Version: 2012.0.2177 / Base de datos de virus: 2433/5070 -
| > | > Fecha de
| > | > la version: 14/06/2012
| > | >
| > | >
| > | >  
| > |
| > |
| > | _______________________________________________
| > | Cuis mailing list
| > | [hidden email]
| > | http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| > |
| >
| > _______________________________________________
| > Cuis mailing list
| > [hidden email]
| > http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| >
| >
| > -----
| > Se certifico que el correo no contiene virus.
| > Comprobada por AVG - www.avg.es
| > Version: 2012.0.2177 / Base de datos de virus: 2433/5070 - Fecha de
| > la version: 14/06/2012
| >
| >
| >  
|
|
| _______________________________________________
| Cuis mailing list
| [hidden email]
| http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
|

_______________________________________________
Cuis mailing list
[hidden email]
http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org

Hi Dale,

Thanks for the clarifications. Now it is perfectly clear.

I added this information to README.md at
https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress . Feel free to correct or
modify as you see fit.

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

Dale Henrichs wrote:
> ...
> Ah, you need a little history here:)
>
> ...


_______________________________________________
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[hidden email]
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Hello,

Thank you all for these clarifications.
I think I understand what Cypress is by now but I do not understand
how it relates to FileTree. Is FileTree an earlier version of Cypress?

--Hannes

On 6/15/12, Juan Vuletich <[hidden email]> wrote:
_______________________________________________
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Hannes,

Cypress[1] is a cross dialect disk-based format for Smalltalk package structures.

cuis-cypress[2] is a Cuis native implementation of the common Cypress package format.

FileTree[3] is a Monticello-based implementation of the common Cypress package format. FileTree has been ported to Squeak, Pharo and GemStone, where the development environment has been built around Monticello.

FileTree and cuis-cypress share "the exact same disk format for packages".

The two projects _differ_ in the implementation of the reader/writers.

cuis-cypress is based on a reference implementation for Cypress.

FileTree was based on code originally written by Otto Behrens. Much of the code in FileTree is tightly coupled to Monticello.

The cuis-cypress code borrows the basic ideas and rough implementation of definitions and snapshots from Monticello, but was designed to be independent of Monticello.

Dale

[1] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/Cypress/wiki
[2] https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress
[3] https://github.com/dalehenrich/filetree

----- Original Message -----
| From: "H. Hirzel" <[hidden email]>
| To: "Discussion of Cuis Smalltalk" <[hidden email]>
| Sent: Friday, June 15, 2012 11:04:48 AM
| Subject: Re: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
|
| Hello,
|
| Thank you all for these clarifications.
| I think I understand what Cypress is by now but I do not understand
| how it relates to FileTree. Is FileTree an earlier version of
| Cypress?
|
| --Hannes
|
| On 6/15/12, Juan Vuletich <[hidden email]> wrote:
| > Hi Dale,
| >
| > Thanks for the clarifications. Now it is perfectly clear.
| >
| > I added this information to README.md at
| > https://github.com/CampSmalltalk/cuis-cypress . Feel free to
| > correct or
| > modify as you see fit.
| >
| > Cheers,
| > Juan Vuletich
| >
| > Dale Henrichs wrote:
| >> ...
| >> Ah, you need a little history here:)
| >>
| >> ...
| >
| >
| > _______________________________________________
| > Cuis mailing list
| > [hidden email]
| > http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
| >
|
| _______________________________________________
| Cuis mailing list
| [hidden email]
| http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
|

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Cuis mailing list
[hidden email]
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On Fri, Jun 15, 2012 at 6:15 AM, Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
[snip] [snip]

Interesting.  Out of curiosity, do you know if anyone has talked about
doing a similar project with VA Smalltalk?

-Chris

_______________________________________________
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Yes, Bob Nemec said he would be interested in doing a VA implentation...

Dale

----- Original Message -----
| From: "Chris Cunningham" <[hidden email]>
| To: "Discussion of Cuis Smalltalk" <[hidden email]>
| Sent: Friday, June 15, 2012 2:04:14 PM
| Subject: Re: [Cuis] Cypress compatibility
|
| On Fri, Jun 15, 2012 at 6:15 AM, Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]>
| wrote:
| >
| [snip]
| >  Squeak/Pharo/GemStone all share the
| >    FileTree project which reads/writes
| >    Cypress package structure using Monticello
| >    packages.
| >  VW uses the STIG project, which reads/writes
| >    Cypress package structure using VW packages.
| >  Cuis uses the cuis-cypress project which
| >    reads/writes Cypress format using Cuis
| >    packages.
| >  Amber uses the amber-cypress project which
| >    reads/writes Cypress format using Amber
| >    packages.
| >
| [snip]
|
| Interesting.  Out of curiosity, do you know if anyone has talked
| about
| doing a similar project with VA Smalltalk?
|
| -Chris
|
| _______________________________________________
| Cuis mailing list
| [hidden email]
| http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
|

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