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Folks,
I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. How about a button that lets me keep the error window? Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it be the minimum size at the bottom)? --Ted. -- Ted Kaehler If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon Viewpoints Research Institute http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html _______________________________________________ lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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Hi, Ted --
when you click on error messages they will stay and every error message is also printed to the browser console. Best, Robert On Feb 29, 2012, at 1:11 AM, Ted Kaehler wrote: > Folks, > I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep > working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping > me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. > > How about a button that lets me keep the error window? > > Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it > be the minimum size at the bottom)? > > --Ted. > > -- > Ted Kaehler > If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon > Viewpoints Research Institute > http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html > _______________________________________________ > lively-kernel mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel _______________________________________________ lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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Hi Ted, Robert, Jens and all -
I too am bothered by the completely disruptive blood red text that, as often as not, is showing me someone else's problem. It sure doesn't play well in demos. In LK1 we had a very nice feature which was a transcript window that showed the console messages. This allowed you to read the messages as long as you wish, let you see them without having to open browser tools and change windows, let you easily cut/paste/eval and especially do a -find- operation on any of the text, all almost for free (ie, a tiny amount of code). This, and an LK debugger (and changeSets ;-) would catapult us to a higher level of productivity. - Dan --------------- On Feb 28, 2012, at 4:28 PM, Robert Krahn wrote: > Hi, Ted -- > > when you click on error messages they will stay and every error message is also printed to the browser console. > > Best, > Robert > > > On Feb 29, 2012, at 1:11 AM, Ted Kaehler wrote: > >> Folks, >> I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep >> working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping >> me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. >> >> How about a button that lets me keep the error window? >> >> Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it >> be the minimum size at the bottom)? >> >> --Ted. >> >> -- >> Ted Kaehler >> If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon >> Viewpoints Research Institute >> http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html >> _______________________________________________ >> lively-kernel mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel > > _______________________________________________ > lively-kernel mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel _______________________________________________ lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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Hi Dan:
On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 8:31 PM, Daniel Ingalls <[hidden email]> wrote: > Hi Ted, Robert, Jens and all - > > I too am bothered by the completely disruptive blood red text that, as often as not, is showing me someone else's problem. - I always assumed when I get an error, something on that page will likely not work, but the fact is I was ignoring them with success, although I do not do much involved work (At the same time I lost a script after save a few times). Someone else's problem sounds better :) - the messages are hard to read for me, but, would there be a hint or two that would help to decide if the problem is my (on my page) Thanks Milan It sure doesn't play well in demos. > > In LK1 we had a very nice feature which was a transcript window that showed the console messages. This allowed you to read the messages as long as you wish, let you see them without having to open browser tools and change windows, let you easily cut/paste/eval and especially do a -find- operation on any of the text, all almost for free (ie, a tiny amount of code). This, and an LK debugger (and changeSets ;-) would catapult us to a higher level of productivity. > > - Dan > --------------- > On Feb 28, 2012, at 4:28 PM, Robert Krahn wrote: > >> Hi, Ted -- >> >> when you click on error messages they will stay and every error message is also printed to the browser console. >> >> Best, >> Robert >> >> >> On Feb 29, 2012, at 1:11 AM, Ted Kaehler wrote: >> >>> Folks, >>> I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep >>> working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping >>> me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. >>> >>> How about a button that lets me keep the error window? >>> >>> Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it >>> be the minimum size at the bottom)? >>> >>> --Ted. >>> >>> -- >>> Ted Kaehler >>> If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon >>> Viewpoints Research Institute >>> http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html >>> _______________________________________________ >>> lively-kernel mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel >> >> _______________________________________________ >> lively-kernel mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel > > _______________________________________________ > lively-kernel mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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In reply to this post by Dan Ingalls-4
Hi, Dan --
Yes, we discussed that before and I agree, for using applications written in Lively this is not desirable. However, when developing this proofed to be *very* useful. It can be really annoying to not notice errors during development and then maybe publish something that is not working correctly. One solution is to introduce a proper per-user preferences. We introduced per user config modules a while ago but they are not really being used (because they are not really documented…). But based on them we could easily implement preferences that could then also be accessed/modified using UI/Parts inside Lively. This would solve the show-or-show-not error problem, I guess. Best, Robert On Feb 29, 2012, at 3:31 AM, Dan Ingalls wrote: > Hi Ted, Robert, Jens and all - > > I too am bothered by the completely disruptive blood red text that, as often as not, is showing me someone else's problem. It sure doesn't play well in demos. > > In LK1 we had a very nice feature which was a transcript window that showed the console messages. This allowed you to read the messages as long as you wish, let you see them without having to open browser tools and change windows, let you easily cut/paste/eval and especially do a -find- operation on any of the text, all almost for free (ie, a tiny amount of code). This, and an LK debugger (and changeSets ;-) would catapult us to a higher level of productivity. > > - Dan > --------------- > On Feb 28, 2012, at 4:28 PM, Robert Krahn wrote: > >> Hi, Ted -- >> >> when you click on error messages they will stay and every error message is also printed to the browser console. >> >> Best, >> Robert >> >> >> On Feb 29, 2012, at 1:11 AM, Ted Kaehler wrote: >> >>> Folks, >>> I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep >>> working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping >>> me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. >>> >>> How about a button that lets me keep the error window? >>> >>> Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it >>> be the minimum size at the bottom)? >>> >>> --Ted. >>> >>> -- >>> Ted Kaehler >>> If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon >>> Viewpoints Research Institute >>> http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html >>> _______________________________________________ >>> lively-kernel mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel >> >> _______________________________________________ >> lively-kernel mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel > > _______________________________________________ > lively-kernel mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel _______________________________________________ lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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Hi,
and we should not ignore the error messages, if it is red it should not be ignored. You can ignore the green ones. If you don't understand the error message, post it here, or create an issue page and track ticket. If it is an expected error, e.g. you cut your wifi connection and try to save the page, the error messages should say so -- or at least try to. Should we add a "report" button that sends the error messages back to us? There are also a lot of little error messages that can be fixed by some checks for 'undefined', there where some errors that where triggered when a halo was forced to align without being in the world. For this I did not even open a ticket... Best, Jens Am 29.02.2012 um 15:51 schrieb Robert Krahn: > Hi, Dan -- > > Yes, we discussed that before and I agree, for using applications written in Lively this is not desirable. However, when developing this proofed to be *very* useful. It can be really annoying to not notice errors during development and then maybe publish something that is not working correctly. > > One solution is to introduce a proper per-user preferences. We introduced per user config modules a while ago but they are not really being used (because they are not really documented…). But based on them we could easily implement preferences that could then also be accessed/modified using UI/Parts inside Lively. This would solve the show-or-show-not error problem, I guess. > > Best, > Robert > > > On Feb 29, 2012, at 3:31 AM, Dan Ingalls wrote: > >> Hi Ted, Robert, Jens and all - >> >> I too am bothered by the completely disruptive blood red text that, as often as not, is showing me someone else's problem. It sure doesn't play well in demos. >> >> In LK1 we had a very nice feature which was a transcript window that showed the console messages. This allowed you to read the messages as long as you wish, let you see them without having to open browser tools and change windows, let you easily cut/paste/eval and especially do a -find- operation on any of the text, all almost for free (ie, a tiny amount of code). This, and an LK debugger (and changeSets ;-) would catapult us to a higher level of productivity. >> >> - Dan >> --------------- >> On Feb 28, 2012, at 4:28 PM, Robert Krahn wrote: >> >>> Hi, Ted -- >>> >>> when you click on error messages they will stay and every error message is also printed to the browser console. >>> >>> Best, >>> Robert >>> >>> >>> On Feb 29, 2012, at 1:11 AM, Ted Kaehler wrote: >>> >>>> Folks, >>>> I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep >>>> working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping >>>> me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. >>>> >>>> How about a button that lets me keep the error window? >>>> >>>> Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it >>>> be the minimum size at the bottom)? >>>> >>>> --Ted. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Ted Kaehler >>>> If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon >>>> Viewpoints Research Institute >>>> http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> lively-kernel mailing list >>>> [hidden email] >>>> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> lively-kernel mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel >> >> _______________________________________________ >> lively-kernel mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel > > _______________________________________________ > lively-kernel mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel _______________________________________________ lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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In reply to this post by Dan Ingalls-4
Hi -
Well, there is already an alternative to the red box. If the system is in debug mode (World menu -> Debugging -> "Prepare system..." and "Start Debugging") then a debugger window will pop up when an error occurs instead of an error message. Running Lively like this, however, comes with a slight performance overhead. A debugger will also be opened if the option "Debug Morphic Scripts" is enabled and the "debugger" statement is used inside a Morphic script. Additionally, I added an option to the world menu that enables this behavior for all methods in the Lively class system. But beware, this option is still experimental! Christopher > Hi Ted, Robert, Jens and all - > > I too am bothered by the completely disruptive blood red text that, as often as not, is showing me someone else's problem. It sure doesn't play well in demos. > > In LK1 we had a very nice feature which was a transcript window that showed the console messages. This allowed you to read the messages as long as you wish, let you see them without having to open browser tools and change windows, let you easily cut/paste/eval and especially do a -find- operation on any of the text, all almost for free (ie, a tiny amount of code). This, and an LK debugger (and changeSets ;-) would catapult us to a higher level of productivity. > > - Dan > --------------- > On Feb 28, 2012, at 4:28 PM, Robert Krahn wrote: > > > Hi, Ted -- > > > > when you click on error messages they will stay and every error message is also printed to the browser console. > > > > Best, > > Robert > > > > > > On Feb 29, 2012, at 1:11 AM, Ted Kaehler wrote: > > > >> Folks, > >> I like the fact that I can ignore most errors and keep > >> working. However, the red scrolling list of errors is not helping > >> me. It disappears before I have a chance to read it. > >> > >> How about a button that lets me keep the error window? > >> > >> Or, a button that opens the browser Javascript Console (and makes it > >> be the minimum size at the bottom)? > >> > >> --Ted. > >> > >> -- > >> Ted Kaehler > >> If at first you don't succeed ... get new batteries. --anon > >> Viewpoints Research Institute > >> http://www.vpri.org/html/team_bios/kaehler.html > >> _______________________________________________ > >> lively-kernel mailing list > >> [hidden email] > >> http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel > > > > _______________________________________________ > > lively-kernel mailing list > > [hidden email] > > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel > > _______________________________________________ > lively-kernel mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel lively-kernel mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel |
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