Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

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Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

Denis Kudriashov
Hi.

There was long discussion about some Spotter shortcut issue http://forum.world.st/GT-Spotter-dive-in-shortcut-td4899612.html
Problem: for back/forward navigation Spotter uses #meta modifier for shortcut which overrides standard text navigation.
Suggested solution: introduce kind of "alternative meta" to get opposite values for Mac and Windows relative to normal meta. It should get platform independent modifier which not overlaps with text navigation. 

I not found anything implemented. Let's do it in Pharo 7. 

What name should be used? I like #alternativeMeta

Best regards,
Denis
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Re: Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

Denis Kudriashov

2017-06-14 16:34 GMT+02:00 Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]>:

I not found anything implemented. Let's do it in Pharo 7. 

But maybe I not found other solution in thread. In Calypso I will use left/right+alt shortcut for navigation. What other applications use for this purpose?
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Re: Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

Guillermo Polito
But meta does also present problems in linux, doesn't it? I mean, meta in linux and windows means Ctrl. That means that overriding meta+arrows will break the Ctrl+arrows text navigation. What am I missing?

I don't think that alternativeMeta means something useful. And I believe in this topic that there are no magic solutions. Spotter should define for each platform shortcuts that do not override text navigation, or, as in other applications, text navigation should have precedence over spotter actions. For example, moving tabs in Chrome is 
  - Mac: Ctrl+tab or Command+alt+arrows.
  - Windows and linux: Ctrl+tab or Ctrl+pagedown

Guille


On Wed, Jun 14, 2017 at 4:50 PM, Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]> wrote:

2017-06-14 16:34 GMT+02:00 Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]>:

I not found anything implemented. Let's do it in Pharo 7. 

But maybe I not found other solution in thread. In Calypso I will use left/right+alt shortcut for navigation. What other applications use for this purpose?



--

   

Guille Polito


Research Engineer

French National Center for Scientific Research - http://www.cnrs.fr



Web: http://guillep.github.io

Phone: +33 06 52 70 66 13

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Re: Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

Denis Kudriashov

2017-06-14 17:09 GMT+02:00 Guillermo Polito <[hidden email]>:
But meta does also present problems in linux, doesn't it? I mean, meta in linux and windows means Ctrl. That means that overriding meta+arrows will break the Ctrl+arrows text navigation. What am I missing?

I don't think that alternativeMeta means something useful. And I believe in this topic that there are no magic solutions. Spotter should define for each platform shortcuts that do not override text navigation,

alternativeMeta will provide reusable solution for such cases. 
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Re: Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

Tim Mackinnon
I really would like the ability to ctrl-tab (or whatever meta-tab or even meta-some other key) reliably between windows - its frustrating that it only works sometimes via alt-tab. There has been a lot of great work on keyboard shortcuts, which I really appreciate - it would be awesome to finish the job and even add a few more.

Does this thread help with this if it was implemented?

Tim

On 16 Jun 2017, at 14:22, Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]> wrote:


2017-06-14 17:09 GMT+02:00 Guillermo Polito <[hidden email]>:
But meta does also present problems in linux, doesn't it? I mean, meta in linux and windows means Ctrl. That means that overriding meta+arrows will break the Ctrl+arrows text navigation. What am I missing?

I don't think that alternativeMeta means something useful. And I believe in this topic that there are no magic solutions. Spotter should define for each platform shortcuts that do not override text navigation,

alternativeMeta will provide reusable solution for such cases. 

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Re: Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

EstebanLM
Hi Tim, 

On 18 Jun 2017, at 23:54, Tim Mackinnon <[hidden email]> wrote:

I really would like the ability to ctrl-tab (or whatever meta-tab or even meta-some other key) reliably between windows - its frustrating that it only works sometimes via alt-tab. There has been a lot of great work on keyboard shortcuts, which I really appreciate - it would be awesome to finish the job and even add a few more.

Does this thread help with this if it was implemented?

one of the objectives we want to Pharo7 is to improve usability (in windows in particular, but also in general). 
maybe that means is finally the time to review the full key-binding support in Pharo… something that, as you said, started some years ago but we never got the time to finish (do it right is a lot of work, heh).

Esteban


Tim

On 16 Jun 2017, at 14:22, Denis Kudriashov <[hidden email]> wrote:


2017-06-14 17:09 GMT+02:00 Guillermo Polito <[hidden email]>:
But meta does also present problems in linux, doesn't it? I mean, meta in linux and windows means Ctrl. That means that overriding meta+arrows will break the Ctrl+arrows text navigation. What am I missing?

I don't think that alternativeMeta means something useful. And I believe in this topic that there are no magic solutions. Spotter should define for each platform shortcuts that do not override text navigation,

alternativeMeta will provide reusable solution for such cases. 


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Re: Extra shortcut modifier opposite to #meta

Denis Kudriashov
In reply to this post by Tim Mackinnon

2017-06-18 23:54 GMT+02:00 Tim Mackinnon <[hidden email]>:
I really would like the ability to ctrl-tab (or whatever meta-tab or even meta-some other key) reliably between windows - its frustrating that it only works sometimes via alt-tab. There has been a lot of great work on keyboard shortcuts, which I really appreciate - it would be awesome to finish the job and even add a few more.

Does this thread help with this if it was implemented?

No because I am talking about extra platform independent shortcut modifier. And for your case tab+meta is supposed to work. But by some reason it could not work all the time. It can be related to image side or also to vm side. 
As soon as we will move to sdl-driven window vm issues will gone

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