Smalltalk › Pharo › Pharo Smalltalk Users

Get implementors list window from Spotter

_‹ Previous Topic Next Topic _›

Classic

List

Threaded

18 messages Options

Esteban A. Maringolo

Get implementors list window from Spotter

Hi,

How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?

I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).

Regards,

Esteban A. Maringolo

EstebanLM

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

mySelector #impl

> On 20 Sep 2016, at 20:00, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>
> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>
> Regards,
>
> Esteban A. Maringolo
>

Tudor Girba-2

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

You can also press do:
mySelector Cmd+m

Cheers,
Doru

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> mySelector #impl
>
>> On 20 Sep 2016, at 20:00, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>>
>> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
>> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>>
>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"Quality cannot be an afterthought."

jfabry

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

I repeat my comment from before: The discoverability of UI of Spotter is much too low. Please please please add a bit of explanation to the spotter window to show all these cool things with the hashtags and the keyboard shortcuts. There is *no way* for a normal Pharo user to discover this.

--
Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .

Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 15:19, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> You can also press do:
> mySelector Cmd+m
>
> Cheers,
> Doru
>
>
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> mySelector #impl
>>
>>> On 20 Sep 2016, at 20:00, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>>>
>>> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
>>> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> "Quality cannot be an afterthought."
>
>
>

Tudor Girba-2

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

We tried to address this with the help? Please let me know if some parts need updates or more explanations.

Doru

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 9:03 PM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> I repeat my comment from before: The discoverability of UI of Spotter is much too low. Please please please add a bit of explanation to the spotter window to show all these cool things with the hashtags and the keyboard shortcuts. There is *no way* for a normal Pharo user to discover this.
>
> --
> Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .
>
> Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
> PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile
>
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 15:19, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> You can also press do:
>> mySelector Cmd+m
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> mySelector #impl
>>>
>>>> On 20 Sep 2016, at 20:00, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>>>>
>>>> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
>>>> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> "Quality cannot be an afterthought."
>>
>>
>>
>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"Being happy is a matter of choice."

Esteban A. Maringolo

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

In reply to this post by Tudor Girba-2

2016-09-20 15:19 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
> You can also press do:
> mySelector Cmd+m
>
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> mySelector #impl

I open spotter, type 'printString' and press Ctrl+M and nothing happens.

If I type #impl it filters the implementors.

Neither of those opens this, expected, window.

The image is a fresh 'Pharo5.0 of 16 April 2015 update 50761'.

Regards,

Esteban.

Tudor Girba-2

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

Hi,

Could you try with Alt+M?

About the wish to open the Message Browser, this is indeed not supported. What we miss is a category action. In this case, the Implementors would open the Message Browser. So, in this case, the use case would be:

#mySelector Cmd+m Cmd+Shift+Enter

Would this address your expectation?

Cheers,
Doru

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 10:21 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> 2016-09-20 15:19 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
> > You can also press do:
> > mySelector Cmd+m
> >
> >> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> mySelector #impl
>
> I open spotter, type 'printString' and press Ctrl+M and nothing happens.
> <image.png>
>
> If I type #impl it filters the implementors.
> <image.png>
>
>
> Neither of those opens this, expected, window.
>
> <image.png>
>
> The image is a fresh 'Pharo5.0 of 16 April 2015 update 50761'.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> --
> Esteban.
>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"Value is always contextual."

Esteban A. Maringolo

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

2016-09-20 17:30 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
>
> Hi,
>
> Could you try with Alt+M?

It doesn't work, everything works with Ctrl as command modifier.

> About the wish to open the Message Browser, this is indeed not supported.

> What we miss is a category action. In this case, the Implementors would open the Message Browser.
> So, in this case, the use case would be:
>
> #mySelector Cmd+m Cmd+Shift+Enter

> Would this address your expectation?

I'm not used to doble shortcuts, I'd prefer a single Ctrl+Shift+M to
open the message browser. But as long as the function is there, I
don't mind using the mouse to access it rather than adding a shortcut
if it doesn't follow a common shortcut pattern, I have to use the
mouse for many features, so I'm already dependent of it.

Regards,

Esteban A. Maringolo

Tudor Girba-2

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

Hi,

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 10:37 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> 2016-09-20 17:30 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Could you try with Alt+M?
>
> It doesn't work, everything works with Ctrl as command modifier.

What version do you use? What operating system?

>> About the wish to open the Message Browser, this is indeed not supported.
>
>> What we miss is a category action. In this case, the Implementors would open the Message Browser.
>> So, in this case, the use case would be:
>>
>> #mySelector Cmd+m Cmd+Shift+Enter
>
>> Would this address your expectation?
>
> I'm not used to doble shortcuts, I'd prefer a single Ctrl+Shift+M to
> open the message browser. But as long as the function is there, I
> don't mind using the mouse to access it rather than adding a shortcut
> if it doesn't follow a common shortcut pattern, I have to use the
> mouse for many features, so I'm already dependent of it.

Ok. The shortcut would be standard for all categories. Of course, settable from the settings.

Could you please open an issue with your request?

Cheers,
Doru

> Regards,
>
>
> Esteban A. Maringolo
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

“Software has no shape. Actually, it has no one shape. It has many."

Esteban A. Maringolo

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

Esteban A. Maringolo

2016-09-20 17:41 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
>> It doesn't work, everything works with Ctrl as command modifier.
>
> What version do you use? What operating system?

'Pharo5.0 of 16 April 2015 update 50761' Ubuntu Linux 16.04 64 bit.

> Could you please open an issue with your request?

Sure, Where?

Regards,

Tudor Girba-2

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 10:46 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Esteban A. Maringolo
>
>
> 2016-09-20 17:41 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
>>> It doesn't work, everything works with Ctrl as command modifier.
>>
>> What version do you use? What operating system?
>
> 'Pharo5.0 of 16 April 2015 update 50761' Ubuntu Linux 16.04 64 bit.
>
>> Could you please open an issue with your request?
>
> Sure, Where?

https://pharo.fogbugz.com

Doru

>
> Regards,
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"If you can't say why something is relevant,
it probably isn't."

Esteban A. Maringolo

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

2016-09-20 17:49 GMT-03:00 Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>:
>>> Could you please open an issue with your request?
>> Sure, Where?
> https://pharo.fogbugz.com

Done.
<https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/19118/Spotter-implementors-should-offer-opening-Messages-Browser>

Esteban A. Maringolo

jfabry

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

In reply to this post by Tudor Girba-2

Sorry, I don’t mean to sound like a smartass, but apparently the data shows that this is not sufficient. Otherwise people would not ask on the mailing list, like Esteban did originally (and as I remember other people asking).

Speaking for myself, I honestly would not think about clicking on the ? icon to expect these kinds of instructions. I cannot say exactly why, I only have a feeling that the ? does not transmit to me that there are ‘power user’ tips, and I expect a ? icon to just tell me basic things.

--
Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .

Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 17:04, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> We tried to address this with the help? Please let me know if some parts need updates or more explanations.
>
> Doru
>
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 9:03 PM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I repeat my comment from before: The discoverability of UI of Spotter is much too low. Please please please add a bit of explanation to the spotter window to show all these cool things with the hashtags and the keyboard shortcuts. There is *no way* for a normal Pharo user to discover this.
>>
>> --
>> Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .
>>
>> Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
>> PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile
>>
>>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 15:19, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> You can also press do:
>>> mySelector Cmd+m
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Doru
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> mySelector #impl
>>>>
>>>>> On 20 Sep 2016, at 20:00, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>>>>>
>>>>> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
>>>>> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>> www.feenk.com
>>>
>>> "Quality cannot be an afterthought."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> "Being happy is a matter of choice."
>
>
>
>
>
>

Tudor Girba-2

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

Hi,

> On Sep 21, 2016, at 3:16 AM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> Sorry, I don’t mean to sound like a smartass, but apparently the data shows that this is not sufficient. Otherwise people would not ask on the mailing list, like Esteban did originally (and as I remember other people asking).
>
> Speaking for myself, I honestly would not think about clicking on the ? icon to expect these kinds of instructions. I cannot say exactly why, I only have a feeling that the ? does not transmit to me that there are ‘power user’ tips, and I expect a ? icon to just tell me basic things.

Thanks for the feedback. Still, my question remains: is the help explanatory enough or do we need to improve it?

Doru

> --
> Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .
>
> Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
> PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile
>
>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 17:04, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> We tried to address this with the help? Please let me know if some parts need updates or more explanations.
>>
>> Doru
>>
>>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 9:03 PM, Johan Fabry <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I repeat my comment from before: The discoverability of UI of Spotter is much too low. Please please please add a bit of explanation to the spotter window to show all these cool things with the hashtags and the keyboard shortcuts. There is *no way* for a normal Pharo user to discover this.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .
>>>
>>> Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
>>> PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile
>>>
>>>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 15:19, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> You can also press do:
>>>> mySelector Cmd+m
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Doru
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Sep 20, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> mySelector #impl
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 20 Sep 2016, at 20:00, Esteban A. Maringolo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
>>>>>> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>> www.feenk.com
>>>>
>>>> "Quality cannot be an afterthought."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> "Being happy is a matter of choice."
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com

"There are no old things, there are only old ways of looking at them."

jfabry

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

> On Sep 21, 2016, at 01:14, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Speaking for myself, I honestly would not think about clicking on the ? icon to expect these kinds of instructions. I cannot say exactly why, I only have a feeling that the ? does not transmit to me that there are ‘power user’ tips, and I expect a ? icon to just tell me basic things.
>
> Thanks for the feedback. Still, my question remains: is the help explanatory enough or do we need to improve it?

After reading through everything, I think it’s actually too long. There is too much information and it is structured as a story. You could read all of this once (although I think many people will give up after a few pages), but there is no way to remember all of this information.

My suggestion is to add something like a quick reference card (remember those?) for Spotter. For example like http://marc-abramowitz.com/archives/2006/04/10/emacs-22-reference-card/ This has to be manually curated, something like the ‘Extensions installed in the image’ is not right because again it’s too much info and not ordered in sequence of importance. Then add a button to the UI so that this can be shown when needed.

--
Does this mail seem too brief? Sorry for that, I don’t mean to be rude! Please see http://emailcharter.org .

Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry
PLEIAD and RyCh labs - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

Ben Coman

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

In reply to this post by Esteban A. Maringolo

On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 2:00 AM, Esteban A. Maringolo
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>
> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>
> Regards,
>
> Esteban A. Maringolo
>

What might be good is next to the <Show All> button, there was a
button that opened the old ImplementsOf dialog.

cheers -ben

Ben Coman

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 4:07 PM, Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 2:00 AM, Esteban A. Maringolo
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> How can I open the implementors list from Spotter?
>>
>> I want to browse through the code of the different implementors as I
>> do by selecting a selector and searching an implementor (or Ctr+M).
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>>
>
>
> What might be good is next to the <Show All> button, there was a
> button that opened the old ImplementsOf dialog.

I meant to add, in practice what I find happened is that I use Spotter
to do initial search for implementors, then I randomly select onne of
the so that I can do ctrl-M to get to the ImplementorsOf dialog. It
would be nice to skip that intermediate step.

>
> cheers -ben

stepharo

Re: Get implementors list window from Spotter

Me too ;)

I thought that I was the only one not being able to use Spotter :)

> I meant to add, in practice what I find happened is that I use Spotter
> to do initial search for implementors, then I randomly select onne of
> the so that I can do ctrl-M to get to the ImplementorsOf dialog. It
> would be nice to skip that intermediate step.
>
>> cheers -ben
>