Going Alpha

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Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
Hi all

I suggest that we go alpha:
        - we focus on getting the bugs out closure, event, delays
        - we focus on tests
        - and mit license changes.
        - remove bad code

tell me what you think
Stef

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Re: Going Alpha

Adrian Lienhard
Hi Stef,

Sounds good.

In my understanding we are already in alpha. Now we would work towards  
a first beta. That is, a version that is more or less stable and to  
which no new features are added.

Cheers,
Adrian

On Apr 21, 2009, at 12:59 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:

> Hi all
>
> I suggest that we go alpha:
> - we focus on getting the bugs out closure, event, delays
> - we focus on tests
> - and mit license changes.
> - remove bad code
>
> tell me what you think
> Stef
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project


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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
Ok for me .
Let us now target beta.

Stef

On Apr 21, 2009, at 10:56 PM, Adrian Lienhard wrote:

> Hi Stef,
>
> Sounds good.
>
> In my understanding we are already in alpha. Now we would work towards
> a first beta. That is, a version that is more or less stable and to
> which no new features are added.
>
> Cheers,
> Adrian
>
> On Apr 21, 2009, at 12:59 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> I suggest that we go alpha:
>> - we focus on getting the bugs out closure, event, delays
>> - we focus on tests
>> - and mit license changes.
>> - remove bad code
>>
>> tell me what you think
>> Stef
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pharo-project mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>


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Re: Going Alpha

Damien Cassou
On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> Ok for me .
> Let us now target beta.

Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?

--
Damien Cassou
http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st

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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse

> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Ok for me .
>> Let us now target beta.
>
> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?

this is still there but who will do it?

Stef

>
>
> --
> Damien Cassou
> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>


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Re: Going Alpha

Adrian Lienhard

On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:

>
>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Ok for me .
>>> Let us now target beta.
>>
>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
>
> this is still there but who will do it?

You did a great job in the last weeks!

I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said he  
will have more time again. And maybe there is somebody else that can  
help with this task.

Can you give instructions what needs to be done (including how to get  
to the scripts etc. because I don't know)?

Adrian

>
>
> Stef
>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Damien Cassou
>> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pharo-project mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project


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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
I do not remember I will check.
And let you know. I contacted also matthew to ask him for a bit of  
guidance.

Stef

On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:17 AM, Adrian Lienhard wrote:

>
> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>
>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> Ok for me .
>>>> Let us now target beta.
>>>
>>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
>>
>> this is still there but who will do it?
>
> You did a great job in the last weeks!
>
> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said he
> will have more time again. And maybe there is somebody else that can
> help with this task.
>
> Can you give instructions what needs to be done (including how to get
> to the scripts etc. because I don't know)?
>
> Adrian
>
>>
>>
>> Stef
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Damien Cassou
>>> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Pharo-project mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pharo-project mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>


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Re: Going Alpha

Michael Roberts-2
I have been running the sunits recently for each update or published
build. It would be great if more people could do this so that we can
seriously get the error list down. Also we should try not to push out
updates if they increase the error number. To make comparison easier I
was going to publish the baseline results on the wiki to make it easy
to see progress. I got stuck when recently the tests did not complete
:-) but I think this is a good example of why we should focus in this
area.
Thanks mike
On Wednesday, April 22, 2009, Stéphane Ducasse
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> I do not remember I will check.
> And let you know. I contacted also matthew to ask him for a bit of
> guidance.
>
> Stef
>
> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:17 AM, Adrian Lienhard wrote:
>
>>
>> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>> Ok for me .
>>>>> Let us now target beta.
>>>>
>>>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
>>>
>>> this is still there but who will do it?
>>
>> You did a great job in the last weeks!
>>
>> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said he
>> will have more time again. And maybe there is somebody else that can
>> help with this task.
>>
>> Can you give instructions what needs to be done (including how to get
>> to the scripts etc. because I don't know)?
>>
>> Adrian
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Stef
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Damien Cassou
>>>> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Pharo-project mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Pharo-project mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pharo-project mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>

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Re: Going Alpha

Adrian Lienhard

On Apr 22, 2009, at 19:31 , Michael Roberts wrote:

> I have been running the sunits recently for each update or published
> build. It would be great if more people could do this so that we can
> seriously get the error list down. Also we should try not to push out
> updates if they increase the error number. To make comparison easier I
> was going to publish the baseline results on the wiki to make it easy
> to see progress.

That would be very helpful.

Thanks,
Adrian


> I got stuck when recently the tests did not complete
> :-) but I think this is a good example of why we should focus in this
> area.
> Thanks mike
> On Wednesday, April 22, 2009, Stéphane Ducasse
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I do not remember I will check.
>> And let you know. I contacted also matthew to ask him for a bit of
>> guidance.
>>
>> Stef
>>
>> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:17 AM, Adrian Lienhard wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>> Ok for me .
>>>>>> Let us now target beta.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
>>>>
>>>> this is still there but who will do it?
>>>
>>> You did a great job in the last weeks!
>>>
>>> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said  
>>> he
>>> will have more time again. And maybe there is somebody else that can
>>> help with this task.
>>>
>>> Can you give instructions what needs to be done (including how to  
>>> get
>>> to the scripts etc. because I don't know)?
>>>
>>> Adrian
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Stef
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Damien Cassou
>>>>> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Pharo-project mailing list
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo- 
>>>>> project
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Pharo-project mailing list
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Pharo-project mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pharo-project mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project


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Re: Going Alpha

Marcus Denker-3
In reply to this post by Adrian Lienhard

On 22.04.2009, at 05:17, Adrian Lienhard wrote:

>
> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>
>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> Ok for me .
>>>> Let us now target beta.
>>>
>>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
>>
>> this is still there but who will do it?
>
> You did a great job in the last weeks!
>

indeed!

> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said he
> will have more time again.

Yes, I will definitely be more active again soon. It's interesting how
much cognitive bandwith is occupied by a move to another culture...

        Marcus

--
Marcus Denker - http://marcusdenker.de
PLEIAD Lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile


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Re: Going Alpha

Sebastian Sastre-2
In reply to this post by Michael Roberts-2
wise comment Mike,
sebastian

> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] En
> nombre de Michael Roberts
> Enviado el: Wednesday, April 22, 2009 14:32
> Para: [hidden email]
> Asunto: Re: [Pharo-project] Going Alpha
>
> I have been running the sunits recently for each update or published
> build. It would be great if more people could do this so that we can
> seriously get the error list down. Also we should try not to push out
> updates if they increase the error number. To make comparison easier I
> was going to publish the baseline results on the wiki to make it easy
> to see progress. I got stuck when recently the tests did not complete
> :-) but I think this is a good example of why we should focus in this
> area.
> Thanks mike
> On Wednesday, April 22, 2009, Stéphane Ducasse
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > I do not remember I will check.
> > And let you know. I contacted also matthew to ask him for a bit of
> > guidance.
> >
> > Stef
> >
> > On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:17 AM, Adrian Lienhard wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
> >>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>>>> Ok for me .
> >>>>> Let us now target beta.
> >>>>
> >>>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
> >>>
> >>> this is still there but who will do it?
> >>
> >> You did a great job in the last weeks!
> >>
> >> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus
> also said he
> >> will have more time again. And maybe there is somebody
> else that can
> >> help with this task.
> >>
> >> Can you give instructions what needs to be done (including
> how to get
> >> to the scripts etc. because I don't know)?
> >>
> >> Adrian
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Stef
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Damien Cassou
> >>>> http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Pharo-project mailing list
> >>>> [hidden email]
> >>>>
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Pharo-project mailing list
> >>> [hidden email]
> >>>
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Pharo-project mailing list
> >> [hidden email]
> >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Pharo-project mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project


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Re: Going Alpha

Michael Roberts-2
In reply to this post by Adrian Lienhard
http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/BaselineTestResults

This is just a first version I have published.  Comments welcome.

I have some crude code to produce the wiki syntax from the image. Does
anyone mind if I add behaviour to TestRunner & TestResult to do this
or should I create a separate PharoWikiExporter class and integrate
it?  Also it would be convenient for a TestCase to be sortable. Any
thoughts on that? I have not made TestCase understand <= yet but it
seems verbose not to do so.

thanks,

Mike

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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
In reply to this post by Michael Roberts-2
I agree.
But we took the decision to harvest the fix of events because they  
could rot
dramatically.
Then removing bad code is also important for the relicensing.
The less etoy bookmoprh the less relicensing we have.

> I have been running the sunits recently for each update or published
> build. It would be great if more people could do this so that we can
> seriously get the error list down. Also we should try not to push out
> updates if they increase the error number. To make comparison easier I
> was going to publish the baseline results on the wiki to make it easy
> to see progress. I got stuck when recently the tests did not complete
> :-) but I think this is a good example of why we should focus in this
> area.
> Thanks mike

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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
In reply to this post by Marcus Denker-3
>
> indeed!
>
>> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said he
>> will have more time again.
>
> Yes, I will definitely be more active again soon. It's interesting how
> much cognitive bandwith is occupied by a move to another culture...

oh yes!
excellent experience :)
Stef

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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
In reply to this post by Michael Roberts-2
do it
We need more regression tools.

Stef

On Apr 23, 2009, at 1:27 AM, Michael Roberts wrote:

> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/BaselineTestResults
>
> This is just a first version I have published.  Comments welcome.
>
> I have some crude code to produce the wiki syntax from the image. Does
> anyone mind if I add behaviour to TestRunner & TestResult to do this
> or should I create a separate PharoWikiExporter class and integrate
> it?  Also it would be convenient for a TestCase to be sortable. Any
> thoughts on that? I have not made TestCase understand <= yet but it
> seems verbose not to do so.
>
> thanks,
>
> Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>


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Re: Going Alpha

SergeStinckwich
In reply to this post by Marcus Denker-3
On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 1:30 AM, Marcus Denker <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On 22.04.2009, at 05:17, Adrian Lienhard wrote:
>
>>
>> On Apr 22, 2009, at 11:04 , Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 11:20 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>> Ok for me .
>>>>> Let us now target beta.
>>>>
>>>> Ok. What's the plan to go MIT?
>>>
>>> this is still there but who will do it?
>>
>> You did a great job in the last weeks!
>>
>
> indeed!
>
>> I'll try to find again a bit more time for Pharo. Marcus also said he
>> will have more time again.
>
> Yes, I will definitely be more active again soon. It's interesting how
> much cognitive bandwith is occupied by a move to another culture...

I experience the same thing here but it's wonderfull in the end !

--
Serge Stinckwich
UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC), Hanoi, Vietnam
Smalltalkers do: [:it | All with: Class, (And love: it)]
http://doesnotunderstand.org/

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Re: Going Alpha

Michael Roberts-2
In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse
for sure don't get me wrong ;-) i'm all for change and we're making
great progress. it was just in comment to alpha->beta style
discussion. I'm looking forward to us discussing release candidates.
that will be cool indeed.

mike

On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 9:32 AM, Stéphane Ducasse
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> I agree.
> But we took the decision to harvest the fix of events because they
> could rot
> dramatically.
> Then removing bad code is also important for the relicensing.
> The less etoy bookmoprh the less relicensing we have.
>
>> I have been running the sunits recently for each update or published
>> build. It would be great if more people could do this so that we can
>> seriously get the error list down. Also we should try not to push out
>> updates if they increase the error number. To make comparison easier I
>> was going to publish the baseline results on the wiki to make it easy
>> to see progress. I got stuck when recently the tests did not complete
>> :-) but I think this is a good example of why we should focus in this
>> area.
>> Thanks mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>

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Re: Going Alpha

Stéphane Ducasse
sure no problem
I was just explaining :)

On Apr 23, 2009, at 11:44 PM, Michael Roberts wrote:

> for sure don't get me wrong ;-) i'm all for change and we're making
> great progress. it was just in comment to alpha->beta style
> discussion. I'm looking forward to us discussing release candidates.
> that will be cool indeed.
>
> mike
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 9:32 AM, Stéphane Ducasse
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I agree.
>> But we took the decision to harvest the fix of events because they
>> could rot
>> dramatically.
>> Then removing bad code is also important for the relicensing.
>> The less etoy bookmoprh the less relicensing we have.
>>
>>> I have been running the sunits recently for each update or published
>>> build. It would be great if more people could do this so that we can
>>> seriously get the error list down. Also we should try not to push  
>>> out
>>> updates if they increase the error number. To make comparison  
>>> easier I
>>> was going to publish the baseline results on the wiki to make it  
>>> easy
>>> to see progress. I got stuck when recently the tests did not  
>>> complete
>>> :-) but I think this is a good example of why we should focus in  
>>> this
>>> area.
>>> Thanks mike
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Pharo-project mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>


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