How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
 
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Hello.
PBE-ja project has just begun. But there is a controversy: How should we markup it? There is a strong opinion that markup language itself does not matter, just contents matter. From this opinion, Someone concludes that it is possible to separate marking-up from translation. Actually, some people likely hate marking-up. Another conclusion is that alternative markup language like Sphinx can/should be used. Personally, I think the best way is that each translator does laTeX him/herself. But it does not seem to be a popular opinion. Dr. Yoshiki Ohshima points that if we adopt another markup language than laTeX, the appearance of final output will be different from ones of other laTeX based projects, and that we should confirm if it is acceptable to you, multi-l10n team. May I have your opinion? Regards, Hiroki Horiuchi _______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
Re: How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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On Jun 10, 2011, at 13:29, Hiroki Horiuchi wrote:
> There is a strong opinion that markup language itself does not matter, > just contents matter. From this opinion, Someone concludes that it is > possible to separate marking-up from translation. Actually, some people > likely hate marking-up. Sure, those people could write the translated text then that could be merged afterwards into the actual document, but that's of course more work for whoever will do that merge. PBE is not a novel with pages and pages of linear text; there are lots of inline examples, figures, references etc... > Another conclusion is that alternative markup language like Sphinx can/should be used. Sphinx is the python documentation markup ? Does it really have so many technical advantages over LaTeX, or is it just about someone not willing to learn a new tool ? Because, unless sphinx handles japanese content especially better than LaTeX, this just seems like NIH syndrome or arguing between Java and C# for programming :) > Personally, I think the best way is that each translator does laTeX > him/herself. But it does not seem to be a popular opinion. If the objection is about the macros and code organization, these are certainly open to improvements, and those will benefit all translations. Note that going to another markup implies you'll have to basically redo all that work from scratch and handle fixes (devil is in the details) I have no idea how much of a pain it is to use LaTeX for japanese. Do you input UTF-8, or one of the JIS encodings ? Do you have to write TeX hieroglyphs to express many things ? > Dr. Yoshiki Ohshima points that if we adopt another markup language > than laTeX, the appearance of final output will be different from ones > of other laTeX based projects, and that we should confirm if it is > acceptable to you, multi-l10n team. Appearance does not really matter that much. Actually the current typography could be simplified. IMHO what's really important is correct references, indexing... as well as being able to follow what's being done on the english version so that the translations are up-to-date. -- Damien Pollet type less, do more [ | ] http://people.untyped.org/damien.pollet _______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
Re: How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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Hello.
This English might be worse than I wrote previous time because this is not well checked by an English expert. First of all, I must apologize to you and to our team member also. I chose a word "hate" but it is too strong and must be wrong. Mr. Umezawa who is now the project Leader has started maintaining a table including a field to ask if LaTeX is OK, and there is no negative answer. Six of nineteen members say OK so far. Sorry I have no more time tonight. To be continued tomorrow... Regards, Hiroki Horiuchi On 2011年06月10日 22:19, Damien Pollet wrote:
_______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
Re: How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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On Jun 10, 2011, at 15:47, Hiroki Horiuchi wrote:
> First of all, I must apologize to you and to our team member also. > I chose a word "hate" but it is too strong and must be wrong. No worry, it's perfectly normal to hate LaTeX, I do too :) The thing is, even if LaTeX has its inconvenients and tends to make its users crazy over time, it's still the most powerful tool I know for writing technical books. -- Damien Pollet type less, do more [ | ] http://people.untyped.org/damien.pollet _______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
Re: How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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In reply to this post by Hiroki Horiuchi
Hi guys
I'm really happy to see our book translated. Now use what make you efficient even if I would prefer to have it in latex so that we can rebuild everything if needed. Stef On Jun 10, 2011, at 1:29 PM, Hiroki Horiuchi wrote: > Hello. > > PBE-ja project has just begun. But there is a controversy: How should we > markup it? > > There is a strong opinion that markup language itself does not matter, > just contents matter. From this opinion, Someone concludes that it is > possible to separate marking-up from translation. Actually, some people > likely hate marking-up. Another conclusion is that alternative markup > language like Sphinx can/should be used. > > Personally, I think the best way is that each translator does laTeX > him/herself. But it does not seem to be a popular opinion. > > Dr. Yoshiki Ohshima points that if we adopt another markup language > than laTeX, the appearance of final output will be different from ones > of other laTeX based projects, and that we should confirm if it is > acceptable to you, multi-l10n team. > > May I have your opinion? > > Regards, > > Hiroki Horiuchi > > _______________________________________________ > Sbe-discussion mailing list > [hidden email] > https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion > _______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
Re: How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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In reply to this post by Hiroki Horiuchi
This is a very short message because I am a bad English speaker. Thank you for all your advices. All of your advices are forwarded to our mailing-list. Fortunately, our leader now is considering about our LaTeXing. There is no objection to the idea of LaTeXing by translator so far. Nine of nineteen members are saying its OK. Regards, Hiroki Horiuchi _______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
Re: How should we markup Japanese version of PBE?
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On Jun 11, 2011, at 3:44 PM, Hiroki Horiuchi wrote: > Hello. > > This is a very short message because I am a bad English speaker. me too :) My french is really better than my ugly english :) > > Thank you for all your advices. > All of your advices are forwarded to our mailing-list. > > Fortunately, our leader now is considering about our LaTeXing. > There is no objection to the idea of LaTeXing by translator so far. > Nine of nineteen members are saying its OK. Excellent! This is wonderful to have Pharo-Jap :) Stef > Regards, > > Hiroki Horiuchi > > _______________________________________________ > Sbe-discussion mailing list > [hidden email] > https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion _______________________________________________ Sbe-discussion mailing list [hidden email] https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/sbe-discussion |
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