Integrating Images on a website. Don't want to use Apache or WAFileLibrary.

> I don't understand the issue with portability in having the static content
> served by a web server (apache, lighttpd, nginx).
> In fact, it is not even practical to deploy an app (used for more than a
> couple users) without a kind of proxy/load balancer in front.
>  You can let the web server do what does the best, serving static content
> and the seaside to to what it does best, to run your app.
>
> Never will Seaside, or comanche or (mongrel in ruby on rails case for the
> matter) be on par with a web server in serving static data.
>  And you don't have to have a lot of user to decide to upgrade from "all in
> the image" to using a "just the app in the image/else on webserver" setup.
> From the very beginning you can use all the cpu cicles used for Seaside for
> your app and not for serving images (that you can't cache in the image as
> you can in a webserver for faster response, ideally, without disk access,
> all served from memory)
>
> Miguel Cobá
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 3:30 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > in general there are three ways:
> >
> >  1. serve files using an external server/location (Apache)
> >  2. create a WAFileLibrary
> >  3. let the Squeak webserver serve files from hard disk
> >
> > 1. is not good for portability, 2. bloats the image - so 3. may be your
> > option to choose.
> > You can do this either with an WAExternalFileLibrary implementation as
> Holger already explained or by serving the files directly using a file
> serving module for KomHttpServer:
> >
> > For an example either have a look at "Webserver-tbn.4.mcz" in
> "www.squeaksource.com/DeveloperWorkspace" or read
> http://www.shaffer-consulting.com/david/Seaside/GettingSoftware/index.html
> >
> > Bye
> > Torsten
> > --
> > Ist Ihr Browser Vista-kompatibel? Jetzt die neuesten
> > Browser-Versionen downloaden:
> http://www.gmx.net/de/go/browser
> > _______________________________________________
> > seaside mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> >
> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>  seaside mailing list
>  [hidden email]
> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
>
>

> Miguel Cobá wrote:
>
> > I don't understand the issue with portability in having the static content
> served by a web server (apache, lighttpd, nginx).
> > In fact, it is not even practical to deploy an app (used for more than a
> couple users) without a kind of proxy/load balancer in front.
> > You can let the web server do what does the best, serving static content
> and the seaside to to what it does best, to run your app.
> >
> > Never will Seaside, or comanche or (mongrel in ruby on rails case for the
> matter) be on par with a web server in serving static data.
> > And you don't have to have a lot of user to decide to upgrade from "all in
> the image" to using a "just the app in the image/else on webserver" setup.
> >
>
>  Swazoo is actually able to come very close to Apache, able to serving
> static content with 300Mbits/s on VW, that is 3 times saturation of 100M
> Ethernet. This is enough throughput for all except really large websites out
> there. And of course, you can always switch to Apache or something similar
> later!

>  Start therefore with Swazoo as pure Smalltalk web server with all pros of
> being in Smalltalk only, and when needed, switch to Apache. Any you'll see,
> you won't need that switch soon!
>
>  Swazoo vs. Apache benchmark:
>  http://www.swazoo.org/benchmarks/swazoo-vs-apache.html
>
>  JAnko
>
>
>
> >
> >  From the very beginning you can use all the cpu cicles used for Seaside
> for your app and not for serving images (that you can't cache in the image
> as you can in a webserver for faster response, ideally, without disk access,
> all served from memory)
> >
> > Miguel Cobá
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 3:30 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
> >
> >    Hi,
> >
> >    in general there are three ways:
> >
> >     1. serve files using an external server/location (Apache)
> >     2. create a WAFileLibrary
> >     3. let the Squeak webserver serve files from hard disk
> >
> >    1. is not good for portability, 2. bloats the image - so 3. may be your
> >    option to choose.
> >    You can do this either with an WAExternalFileLibrary implementation
> >    as Holger already explained or by serving the files directly using a
> >    file serving module for KomHttpServer:
> >
> >    For an example either have a look at "Webserver-tbn.4.mcz" in
> >    "www.squeaksource.com/DeveloperWorkspace
> >    <http://www.squeaksource.com/DeveloperWorkspace>" or read
> >
> >
> http://www.shaffer-consulting.com/david/Seaside/GettingSoftware/index.html
> >
> >    Bye
> >    Torsten
> >    --
> >    Ist Ihr Browser Vista-kompatibel? Jetzt die neuesten
> >    Browser-Versionen downloaden: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/browser
> >    _______________________________________________
> >    seaside mailing list
> >    [hidden email]
> >    <mailto:[hidden email]>
> >
> >    http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > seaside mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> >
>
>  --
>  Janko Mivšek
>  AIDA/Web
>  Smalltalk Web Application Server
>  http://www.aidaweb.si
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  seaside mailing list
>  [hidden email]
>  http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
>

> Philippe Marschall wrote:
>
>
> >
> > >  Swazoo is actually able to come very close to Apache, able to serving
> > > static content with 300Mbits/s on VW, that is 3 times saturation of 100M
> > > Ethernet. This is enough throughput for all except really large websites
> out
> > > there. And of course, you can always switch to Apache or something
> similar
> > > later!
> > >
> >
>
>
> > But even in this case Swazoo will eat CPU cycles from Seaside because
> > VW (like Squeak) is single threaded.
> >
>
>  Yes, but minimally comparing to Seaside and also not on the same time.

> So, if you serve only one user, this is not an issue.
> Even if you serve many users from the same image, you still eat much more
> CPU by dynamic page generation with Seaside that static serving by Swazoo.
> That's at least my judgment from experiences with Swazoo and Aida/Web on VW,
> which should be similar to Seaside case in that respect.
>
>  JAnko
>
>
>
>
> >
> > Cheers
> > Philippe
> >
> >
> > >  Start therefore with Swazoo as pure Smalltalk web server with all pros
> of
> > > being in Smalltalk only, and when needed, switch to Apache. Any you'll
> see,
> > > you won't need that switch soon!
> > >
> > >  Swazoo vs. Apache benchmark:
> > >  http://www.swazoo.org/benchmarks/swazoo-vs-apache.html
> > >
> > >  JAnko
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >  From the very beginning you can use all the cpu cicles used for
> Seaside
> > > >
> > > for your app and not for serving images (that you can't cache in the
> image
> > > as you can in a webserver for faster response, ideally, without disk
> access,
> > > all served from memory)
> > >
> > > > Miguel Cobá
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 3:30 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]
> > > >
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
> > >
> > > >   Hi,
> > > >
> > > >   in general there are three ways:
> > > >
> > > >    1. serve files using an external server/location (Apache)
> > > >    2. create a WAFileLibrary
> > > >    3. let the Squeak webserver serve files from hard disk
> > > >
> > > >   1. is not good for portability, 2. bloats the image - so 3. may be
> your
> > > >   option to choose.
> > > >   You can do this either with an WAExternalFileLibrary implementation
> > > >   as Holger already explained or by serving the files directly using a
> > > >   file serving module for KomHttpServer:
> > > >
> > > >   For an example either have a look at "Webserver-tbn.4.mcz" in
> > > >   "www.squeaksource.com/DeveloperWorkspace
> > > >   <http://www.squeaksource.com/DeveloperWorkspace>" or read
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> http://www.shaffer-consulting.com/david/Seaside/GettingSoftware/index.html
> > >
> > > >   Bye
> > > >   Torsten
> > > >   --
> > > >   Ist Ihr Browser Vista-kompatibel? Jetzt die neuesten
> > > >   Browser-Versionen downloaden: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/browser
> > > >   _______________________________________________
> > > >   seaside mailing list
> > > >   [hidden email]
> > > >   <mailto:[hidden email]>
> > > >
> > > >   http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > seaside mailing list
> > > > [hidden email]
> > > > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> > > >
> > > >
> > >  --
> > >  Janko Mivšek
> > >  AIDA/Web
> > >  Smalltalk Web Application Server
> > >  http://www.aidaweb.si
> > >
> > >
> > >  _______________________________________________
> > >  seaside mailing list
> > >  [hidden email]
> > >  http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > seaside mailing list
> > > [hidden email]
> > > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> > >
> >
>
>  --
>  Janko Mivšek
>  AIDA/Web
>  Smalltalk Web Application Server
>  http://www.aidaweb.si
>  _______________________________________________
>  seaside mailing list
>  [hidden email]
>  http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
>

> 2008/4/24 Janko Mivšek <[hidden email]>:
>
> > Philippe Marschall wrote:
>  >
>  >
>  > >
>  > > >  Swazoo is actually able to come very close to Apache, able to serving
>  > > > static content with 300Mbits/s on VW, that is 3 times saturation of 100M
>  > > > Ethernet. This is enough throughput for all except really large websites
>  > out
>  > > > there. And of course, you can always switch to Apache or something
>  > similar
>  > > > later!
>  > > >
>  > >
>  >
>  >
>  > > But even in this case Swazoo will eat CPU cycles from Seaside because
>  > > VW (like Squeak) is single threaded.
>  > >
>  >
>  >  Yes, but minimally comparing to Seaside and also not on the same time.
>
> At least on Squeak / Kom large uploads hog the CPU / image. This is
>  not minimal at all.
>

> Miguel Cobá wrote:
>
> > Yes, maybe in some context the portability of a "server" application have
> any advantage.
> > But, in Seaside you are writing webapps. WEB apps, not desktop apps or usb
> transportable apps.
> > For a lot of us, having a server, a real server serving our application is
> worth the hassle of setting up a web server, load balancing
> > a lot of squeak images and caching the static content in the web server.
> >
>
>  Speaking of which: has anybody any experience with Seaside/Aida and Apache
> XSendfile?
>
> http://john.guen.in/past/2007/4/17/send_files_faster_with_xsendfile/