Status: New
Owner: ---- Labels: Milestone-2.0 Type-FirstImpressionsCount New issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 On Windows 7, I just downloaded and unzipped into one directory pharo-20504 & nbcog-2012-12-07. Double-clicked on NBCog.exe. Pharo did not open, except I noticed that NBCog.ini was created. So double-clicking on NBCog.exe a second time successfully opened Pharo. _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #1 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 almost sure this is because the download of the sources file. can you check if that is the case? _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #2 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 If it worked the second time, that means the download worked ;-) I just tried on my machine (mac): I deleted the .sources and started a #20511 image: the main window was blank for a couple of seconds and then came up as usual. Which is a cool service. We should find some way to provide feedback as to what is happening. And putting up a dialog is no option headless, unless the image knows whether it is headerless... But maybe this windows ini things is some other problem ? _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #3 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 The windows ini is created (by the VM) if the VM does not find one. At least this is the behavior since Andreas initial "Squeak.exe" VM. I'm sure the problem is because the source file is downloaded. It's a nice idea to download it if it is not there - but since nothing is shown meanwhile the user is helpless since he thinks Pharo does not start. You can check the Task manager to see if Pharo VM is running. I would vote for that if the source file is not there then a message box should open to inform the user. If the Pharo window/Morphic it not available yet one can use NativeBoost to open a native windows message box: NBWin32MessageBox messageBox: NBWin32Window getFocus text: 'Pharo will download the source file. Click OK to continue.' title: 'Pharo' flags: 0 Note that this is Win-platform only. _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
In reply to this post by pharo
Comment #5 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 I just tried this myself on Windows 8, and yes it is slower there, with no visual indication that something is happening, on Mac there is a blank window. But you do see the .sources appearing in the VM directory, while its size increases ;-) _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Updates:
Cc: [hidden email] [hidden email] Comment #6 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 "I just tried this myself on Windows 8, and yes it is slower there, with no visual indication that something is happening, on Mac there is a blank window." Neither of these is a great user experience. It's fine for us developers, but it would be awesome to provide visual feedback for newer users. _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #7 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 I didn't notice before but Yes it is the sources. For 30 seconds while I watch the .sources file size increasing, there is no visible application. What was doubly-confusing was my perception that VM had immediately exited and that immediately clicking again on Pharo.exe was "re-starting" Pharo - when actually this started a second VM for which the window appeared straight away - 28 seconds before the first VM window appears. At first glance it seemed this second Window worked okay. The quick fix for this would be to just include the .sources file - especially for the OneClick which is probably more sued by newbies. Automatically downloading .sources is "really cool", but is it really a critical for 2.0? Bandwidth is massive nowdays and ultimately the same amount of bytes are downloaded. My usual download process (perhaps the same with a lot of others) is to browse other sites while a download is running. So I don't lose any "real time" since I fill the gap productively. Whereas once I go to start Pharo, any delay is burning my "real time". _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #8 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 Of course, a .sources will be included in the one-click, which is specifically for beginners. Now, this auto download does safe space and bandwidth because the .sources is download in the same directory of the VM, to increase the chance that it is shared by images started in different directories. Not including a .sources in a download of version X (.image + .changes pair) saves on storage and bandwidth for the whole community, especially those downloading versions all the time. Again, the fix to this isssue is in some sort of UI indication that works in both headless and UI situations. Note that before, you got an error: .sources missing ;-) _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #9 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 <correction> Now, this auto download does save space and bandwidth because the .sources is downloaded in the same directory of the VM, to increase the chance that it is shared by images started in different directories. </correction> _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #10 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 Looking at Pharo20510.zip, it is 17MB without .sources and with .sources it is 20MB. In terms of today's bandwidth that doesn't seem so great that it should should divert resources from releasing 2.0. Including the .sources only with the .image/.changes 2.0-release wont affect those downloading other new versions all the time. Just trying to reduce the work needed for you guys to get over with 2.0. IF you run out of time this could be looked at further after 2.0 release. _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #11 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 In 3.0 I want to have just one file: The Image. Maybe called .pharo? -> sources are compressed inside (and for all those yelling: too large!, no, it is not). -> history is kept for every save inside until you commit to MC -> a log file is written for code changes if wanted (in case of image crash) -> maybe we will even compress small images (<25MB) automatically on save (lz4 is fast...). This then allows us to simplify the story quite a lot: -> installers for all three oses that install the VM with a read-only master image as an Application. -> When starting that is starts the fresh image, on save it saves it like a document to the users files -> .pharo files then can be started by double click or dragging them on the VM. _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Comment #12 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 Excellent strategy / future to look forward to ! _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Updates:
Status: Closed Comment #13 on issue 7394 by [hidden email]: Pharo does not start on first run after downloading on Windows http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7394 The ini realted problem should be fixed with Issue 7484 For the source code dowload, there is Issue 7129 I close this one _______________________________________________ Pharo-bugtracker mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-bugtracker |
Free forum by Nabble | Edit this page |