Manager files get "closed" for unknow reason

Hi Guys,

Lately I have seen a problem where the manager file seems to get closed for no reason.  It may happen when I am saving a method or versioning a class.  I get an error message like the one below and then like the one below it.

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: Access denied'

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: No file currently open'

I have to exit VA Smalltalk (I often need to use windows to kill it) and then need to recover changes to the image from the manager.

Has anyone seen anything like this?  Is there something I can do to avoid it?  Thanks in advance for any ideas.

Lou

What I see is the following: whenever Windows comes back from hibernation, the connection to the library is lost and I cannot read source code before I reconnect to the server. But then everything is okay again. On Linux, the image reacts a little different: after hibernation, on first attempt to acces code in the library, it promppts me whether I want to reconnect. Clicking Yes works as expected.

Hi Joachim & Marten,

I think it happens when I'm in the middle of working.  I may have been staring at the screen for a while but I doubt any  hibernation is going on (I am on a desktop computer).

I don't get any prompt to reconnect to the library, just a lot of bitching about the file being closed every time I try to save something.  I think I will try to reconnect to the library and see if that helps.  Hopefully my image won't be hosed.

Thanks for the ideas.

Lou

Hi Lou,

I haven't had your issues, but something similar. Since I am working through emsrv instead of file access, the problems might be related.

What I see is the following: whenever Windows comes back from hibernation, the connection to the library is lost and I cannot read source code before I reconnect to the server. But then everything is okay again. On Linux, the image reacts a little different: after hibernation, on first attempt to acces code in the library, it promppts me whether I want to reconnect. Clicking Yes works as expected.

Do you see these drop-offs after Windows was locked or sleeping? If so, this is probably the same issue.

What I describe here has been there for a few versions, but I remember it was new to me back then. So maybe it is related to the introduction of support for windows events related to power saving (not sure what it's called and whatVAST version it came in).

Joachim

Hi John & Joachim,

Thanks for the replies.  Since you both are suggesting using emsrv, I think I may give it a try.  I am about to upgrade to 8.6, so this maybe it is time to move to emsrv.

My uncle gave me an old (not too old, dual core) computer that I put Ubuntu on just to play with.  Will emsrv be happy on Ubuntu?  If not I can switch to Red Hat or whatever.

Lou

Lou -

Can I assume you are using fileio to access the manager?

I have no idea what is causing your problem -- I've never seen it and I can't remember any support cases for it.

I will suggest that you use emsrv to access the manager since it decouples your image from direct access to the manager file.

John

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 3:35:18 PM UTC-4, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

Hi Guys,

Lately I have seen a problem where the manager file seems to get closed for no reason.  It may happen when I am saving a method or versioning a class.  I get an error message like the one below and then like the one below it.

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: Access denied'

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: No file currently open'

I have to exit VA Smalltalk (I often need to use windows to kill it) and then need to recover changes to the image from the manager.

Has anyone seen anything like this?  Is there something I can do to avoid it?  Thanks in advance for any ideas.

Lou

Lou -

Emsrv will be happy on Ubuntu. But you can also run it on you development machine. Just start emsrv (either manually or as a service) and use 'localhost' as the ServerName in your .ini file.

John

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 2:00:21 PM UTC-4, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

Hi John & Joachim,

Thanks for the replies.  Since you both are suggesting using emsrv, I think I may give it a try.  I am about to upgrade to 8.6, so this maybe it is time to move to emsrv.

My uncle gave me an old (not too old, dual core) computer that I put Ubuntu on just to play with.  Will emsrv be happy on Ubuntu?  If not I can switch to Red Hat or whatever.

Lou

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 1:00:43 PM UTC-4, John O'Keefe wrote:

Lou -

Can I assume you are using fileio to access the manager?

I have no idea what is causing your problem -- I've never seen it and I can't remember any support cases for it.

I will suggest that you use emsrv to access the manager since it decouples your image from direct access to the manager file.

John

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 3:35:18 PM UTC-4, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

Hi Guys,

Lately I have seen a problem where the manager file seems to get closed for no reason.  It may happen when I am saving a method or versioning a class.  I get an error message like the one below and then like the one below it.

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: Access denied'

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: No file currently open'

I have to exit VA Smalltalk (I often need to use windows to kill it) and then need to recover changes to the image from the manager.

Has anyone seen anything like this?  Is there something I can do to avoid it?  Thanks in advance for any ideas.

Lou

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the advice.  I did know that I could run Emsrv on my windows machine, I was just looking for an excuse to do something with the Ubuntu box.

I now have to decide if it is worth having two computers running side by side whenever I want to work with VA Smalltalk (which is most of the time).  I also have to think about backing up the Ubuntu box.  I'm well set to backup my windows system but don't know a lot about it under Ubuntu.

 Joachim has given me an idea with his Atom machine.  I wonder if there is a small single board Atom machine, like the Raspberry Pi, that I could use? 

Lou

P.S.  Sometimes I have to start with a clean image and load an un-versioned app into it.  The app has un-versioned parts that aren't loaded until you load them one at a time.  Is there a menu item or command (smalltalk call) that will load them all at once?

Lou,

While our server runs an ancient version of openSuSE, I've been using emsrv on Ubuntu as well without any problems.

emsrv is a small program. Don't worry about hardware. Our Linux server is quite an old Atom single-core powered machine and emsrv is not taking any noticeable resources.

The benefit of a separate machine and Linux is that it is very easy to use things like a software raid and backup stuff on that machine. We also run our DB2 development server on the same machine. Even with DB2 running and serving a hand full of clients, the server is still able to also server SMB shares to several machines, run subversion and stuff. So emsrv is not taking any butter from your bread (as we say in Germany).

And, of course, you could always run emsrv on your windows box locally, as both John and Richard said. 

Joachim

Am Mittwoch, 12. März 2014 19:00:21 UTC+1 schrieb Louis LaBrunda:

Hi John & Joachim,

Thanks for the replies.  Since you both are suggesting using emsrv, I think I may give it a try.  I am about to upgrade to 8.6, so this maybe it is time to move to emsrv.

My uncle gave me an old (not too old, dual core) computer that I put Ubuntu on just to play with.  Will emsrv be happy on Ubuntu?  If not I can switch to Red Hat or whatever.

Lou

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 1:00:43 PM UTC-4, John O'Keefe wrote:

Lou -

Can I assume you are using fileio to access the manager?

I have no idea what is causing your problem -- I've never seen it and I can't remember any support cases for it.

I will suggest that you use emsrv to access the manager since it decouples your image from direct access to the manager file.

John

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 3:35:18 PM UTC-4, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

Hi Guys,

Lately I have seen a problem where the manager file seems to get closed for no reason.  It may happen when I am saving a method or versioning a class.  I get an error message like the one below and then like the one below it.

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: Access denied'

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: No file currently open'

I have to exit VA Smalltalk (I often need to use windows to kill it) and then need to recover changes to the image from the manager.

Has anyone seen anything like this?  Is there something I can do to avoid it?  Thanks in advance for any ideas.

Lou

Hi Lou,

I don't think there is any command to load unreleased stuff altogether. I have never looked at the snapshotting tool that's described in the Mastering Envy Book, so maybe there is something that can be used, but sure not in the environment.

About the Raspberry or similar machines. I guess you can use one of these mini/micro PCs that come in these ridiculously small boxes and aren't too expensive. You just have to make sure it's not running on an ARM processor. Things like ZOTAC mini pcs or stuff. They are, however, far from being as cheap as the PI. And you can't add a second disk drive if you wanted to.

Having used a NAS (ARM-based) for a while, I would advice against "special" hardware. That machine could only be accessed by SSH and a web interface. And I had troubles because the web interface showed misleading info. I am glad I moved to a real PC which you can plug a keyboard and a monitor into. Not that I ever needed to after the first installation, but I could. I 

But we've come a far distance from your initial question. Since the problem I described seems to be unrelated to your problems, we cannot be sure you are having troubles that would even persist with emsrv.

So I'd be interested if this disconnection stuff happens with a fresh image as well. I don't think I've ever seen this happen, so this is neither a general problem nor heard of often. Is there any specific file system code you're loading into your image? Have you checked your hard drive's health status? Can you compress the library and copy it to some other path and try again (compress in order to make sure you are not copying corrupt parts of the mgr file or such). Maybe putting a file copy on an external drive also helps if this is hardware related. In any case: Don't forget to back up your library! (you know, we all know, but do we?)

I fully understand your feelings about constantly running a second machine. This is only reasonable if you have more jobs to be done by that hardware. Just as an emsrv machine, this is nonsense and makes things more complicated.

Joachim


Am Donnerstag, 13. März 2014 15:02:33 UTC+1 schrieb Louis LaBrunda:

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the advice.  I did know that I could run Emsrv on my windows machine, I was just looking for an excuse to do something with the Ubuntu box.

I now have to decide if it is worth having two computers running side by side whenever I want to work with VA Smalltalk (which is most of the time).  I also have to think about backing up the Ubuntu box.  I'm well set to backup my windows system but don't know a lot about it under Ubuntu.

 Joachim has given me an idea with his Atom machine.  I wonder if there is a small single board Atom machine, like the Raspberry Pi, that I could use? 

Lou

P.S.  Sometimes I have to start with a clean image and load an un-versioned app into it.  The app has un-versioned parts that aren't loaded until you load them one at a time.  Is there a menu item or command (smalltalk call) that will load them all at once?

On Thursday, March 13, 2014 5:18:05 AM UTC-4, [hidden email] wrote:

Lou,

While our server runs an ancient version of openSuSE, I've been using emsrv on Ubuntu as well without any problems.

emsrv is a small program. Don't worry about hardware. Our Linux server is quite an old Atom single-core powered machine and emsrv is not taking any noticeable resources.

The benefit of a separate machine and Linux is that it is very easy to use things like a software raid and backup stuff on that machine. We also run our DB2 development server on the same machine. Even with DB2 running and serving a hand full of clients, the server is still able to also server SMB shares to several machines, run subversion and stuff. So emsrv is not taking any butter from your bread (as we say in Germany).

And, of course, you could always run emsrv on your windows box locally, as both John and Richard said. 

Joachim

Am Mittwoch, 12. März 2014 19:00:21 UTC+1 schrieb Louis LaBrunda:

Hi John & Joachim,

Thanks for the replies.  Since you both are suggesting using emsrv, I think I may give it a try.  I am about to upgrade to 8.6, so this maybe it is time to move to emsrv.

My uncle gave me an old (not too old, dual core) computer that I put Ubuntu on just to play with.  Will emsrv be happy on Ubuntu?  If not I can switch to Red Hat or whatever.

Lou

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 1:00:43 PM UTC-4, John O'Keefe wrote:

Lou -

Can I assume you are using fileio to access the manager?

I have no idea what is causing your problem -- I've never seen it and I can't remember any support cases for it.

I will suggest that you use emsrv to access the manager since it decouples your image from direct access to the manager file.

John

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 3:35:18 PM UTC-4, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

Hi Guys,

Lately I have seen a problem where the manager file seems to get closed for no reason.  It may happen when I am saving a method or versioning a class.  I get an error message like the one below and then like the one below it.

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: Access denied'

'Error accessing C:\Program Files\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.0\manager\mgr80.dat: No file currently open'

I have to exit VA Smalltalk (I often need to use windows to kill it) and then need to recover changes to the image from the manager.

Has anyone seen anything like this?  Is there something I can do to avoid it?  Thanks in advance for any ideas.

Lou

P.S.  Sometimes I have to start with a clean image and load an un-versioned app into it.  The app has un-versioned parts that aren't loaded until you load them one at a time.  Is there a menu item or command (smalltalk call) that will load them all at once?

Hi Richard,

I have figured out how to do this with:

MyApplication withAllSubApplications do: [:app | | classEditions |
EmClassDevelopment imageBuilder loadApplications: (OrderedCollection with: app shadows first).
classEditions := app stsMoreRecentClassEditions collect: [:ces | ces first].
EmClassDevelopment imageBuilder loadClasses: classEditions.
].

I would like to add a menu item that would run the code for the selected application.  I'm still trying to figure out how to add the menu item and pick of the application to pass into the code.  Any help with this part is greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance.

Lou

On Thursday, March 13, 2014 7:02:33 AM UTC-7, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

P.S.  Sometimes I have to start with a clean image and load an un-versioned app into it.  The app has un-versioned parts that aren't loaded until you load them one at a time.  Is there a menu item or command (smalltalk call) that will load them all at once?

Yes, this is quite easy. I have a tool to do so, but it involves someone else's code. So I cannot release it. Over the weekend, I will see about creating a subset that would be free of restrictions.

However, the process is quite simple. You need to record the application, the class, and the class edition's timestamp (in seconds).
To load the changes, you just need to reverse the process, asking for the edition of the class with the specified timestamp in the application, and load that edition.

I have figured out how to do this with:

<snip>

I would like to add a menu item that would run the code for the selected application.  I'm still trying to figure out how to add the menu item and pick of the application to pass into the code.  Any help with this part is greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance. 

On Friday, March 14, 2014 3:12:36 PM UTC-7, Louis LaBrunda wrote:

I have figured out how to do this with:

<snip>

I would like to add a menu item that would run the code for the selected application.  I'm still trying to figure out how to add the menu item and pick of the application to pass into the code.  Any help with this part is greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance. 

Hi Lou,
Good for you. :-)
The problem with loading the "first" edition is that, eventually, it will get you in trouble. Guaranteed. Be there, done that. :-)
That's why I suggested writing out the timestamps of the loaded editions, so you can be sure to load the one you had.
Additionally, I recommend opening the edition of the application and the sub-applications as you touch them, and release the open editions of the sub-apps. It makes it much easier to manage when you have more than a few applications and sub-applications involved.

Over the weekend, I'll put together an example with the menu hook up. It's not difficult, just involved.
 

Hi Richard,

Thanks for the help.  I went a slightly different way.  I normally don't have multiple open versions of apps or parts.  In fact the main reason for adding this feature it to prevent opening more than one version.

I added a menu item to the main "Applications>Load" drop down and pop up menus of the organizer.  I cheated a little with a small hack to connect the #enabled value of one of the menu items so my menu item would only be enabled when one or more apps were selected.  Not that it would matter if you clicked the menu item without any app selected, it just looks better.

So, thanks again and if anyone is interested, I'll share the code.

Lou