Pharo usage poll

Hi guys, 

I created a small poll to know which versions of pharo are you using and with which purpose... can you be so kind and fill the form? is really small and can provide some insights about further directions :)

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/viewform?fromEmail=true&formkey=dFZKeXUwaG80OWhSOGpZVERrX2ZlVGc6MQ

Thanks,

Esteban

On 22 August 2012 02:55, Hernán Morales Durand <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hi Esteban,
>
> Sorry but I have to say the poll is pretty narrow. It could be hundred of
> interesting questions. I offer myself to help providing more questions,
> let's find what really users want...

can i be first to answer?

i want less annoying polls with hundreds of questions

the number of questions in poll is in reverse proportion to number of
people willing to answer it
:)

> Cheers,
>
> Hernán
>
>
> 2012/8/21 Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]>
>>
>> Hi guys,
>>
>> I created a small poll to know which versions of pharo are you using and
>> with which purpose... can you be so kind and fill the form? is really small
>> and can provide some insights about further directions :)
>>
>>
>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/viewform?fromEmail=true&formkey=dFZKeXUwaG80OWhSOGpZVERrX2ZlVGc6MQ
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Esteban
>
>
>
>

--
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko.

or look at this form another perspective:
 if you know how to make things better, improve them, what you waiting
for and not doing it in a first place?

Pharo is open project after all.
Or at least, if you having a great idea but have no time/resources to
do it, why you don't proposing it or asking around who interested in
implementing it, but sitting there waiting to be asked ..

--
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko.

Am 22.08.2012 um 04:30 schrieb Hernán Morales Durand <[hidden email]>:

Proof?

You offered already to provide questions. Just create a long survey and invite everyone on that list. Then ask Esteban how many answered his poll and compare it with the number you got ;)

Norbert

On 22 August 2012 06:05, Hernán Morales Durand <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> 2012/8/22 Igor Stasenko <[hidden email]>
>>
>> or look at this form another perspective:
>>  if you know how to make things better, improve them, what you waiting
>> for and not doing it in a first place?
>
>
> I'm doing it, saying that a brief poll could be better is pushing Pharo
> developers to make things better. Don't you think so?
>

The main problem with this is that often questions and received answers
will remain to be just a questions and received answers: the results
are never implemented/reflected into something material.
So, as to me it is more useful to do something real instead of asking
around "what something real we should do?" and then unable to do it.

Everyone wants X, but nobody doing it. Do you know how many of those
X's i heard over past few years? More than you can do even if you
spend all of your life doing them.

>>
>> Pharo is open project after all.
>> Or at least, if you having a great idea but have no time/resources to
>> do it, why you don't proposing it or asking around who interested in
>> implementing it, but sitting there waiting to be asked ..
>>
>
> Yes, I'd like to be asked for the right questions. Your questions tell me
> your interests much as your lack of questions. I'm proposing more accurate
> polls... like "which packages do you use often?", "which non-core Collection
> classes do you need more?", "do you use Traits?", etc.
> Nobody is obliged to answer any poll, if too many questions, you just don't
> answer :)
>

Once again, i don't think that showing interest in something in form
of pool is the best way to
communicate..
And polls is one way communication.. and pretty obscure one.

For example, if you ask in poll "do you use Traits" most of people may
answer "no", so that may drive your decision to remove them..
until you discover that most of people actually meant to say is: "i
don't use traits in my current project, but they should stay because
they can be useful and i can see their potential"

> Hernán

--
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko.

Hernan, 

There is always room for improvement, but I think you are missing the point here. 

Of course, the poll is narrow (*all* polls are)... We could collect more data, but there is no poll without a question to answer, and here the real question is "what for?" What questions do you want to answer when making a poll. And then, when you see narrowness, I see clarity: I just have three questions that want answered (well, and a "hidden" one, but that's for later :). In fact, two of your three examples of questions were present in my first draft, and I removed them because they didn't provide more insight in *my* questions, which are pretty straightforward. Yes, I missed some other interesting questions for what I'm looking for, e.g. "why are you still using an older version of Pharo?", but well... you cannot make it perfect :)

Of course, everybody has their own questions, and of course, if you want a "pharo census", we need to make much more questions... but that was off what I was looking for :)

Esteban

ps: yes, we can prepare a "pharo census", that can be interesting information too, and I would really like to have your help on preparing it... but lets complete this one small poll first.

On Aug 22, 2012, at 6:05 AM, Hernán Morales Durand <[hidden email]> wrote:

2012/8/22 Igor Stasenko <[hidden email]>

or look at this form another perspective:
 if you know how to make things better, improve them, what you waiting
for and not doing it in a first place?

I'm doing it, saying that a brief poll could be better is pushing Pharo developers to make things better. Don't you think so?
 

Pharo is open project after all.
Or at least, if you having a great idea but have no time/resources to
do it, why you don't proposing it or asking around who interested in
implementing it, but sitting there waiting to be asked ..

Yes, I'd like to be asked for the right questions. Your questions tell me your interests much as your lack of questions. I'm proposing more accurate polls... like "which packages do you use often?", "which non-core Collection classes do you need more?", "do you use Traits?", etc.
Nobody is obliged to answer any poll, if too many questions, you just don't answer :)

Hernán
 

--
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko.

--
Hernán Morales
Institute of Veterinary Genetics.
National Scientific and Technical Research Council (CONICET).
La Plata (1900), Buenos Aires, Argentina.
Telephone: +54 (0221) 421-1799.
Internal: 422
Fax: 425-7980 or 421-1799.

Hi Esteban.
Thanks for clarifying. For me it doesn't need to be perfect. Answering polls is fun actually if you know how to enjoy.
So I'm looking forward to more questions :)
Cheers,

Hernán

2012/8/22 Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]>

Hernan, 

There is always room for improvement, but I think you are missing the point here. 

Of course, the poll is narrow (*all* polls are)... We could collect more data, but there is no poll without a question to answer, and here the real question is "what for?" What questions do you want to answer when making a poll. And then, when you see narrowness, I see clarity: I just have three questions that want answered (well, and a "hidden" one, but that's for later :). In fact, two of your three examples of questions were present in my first draft, and I removed them because they didn't provide more insight in *my* questions, which are pretty straightforward. Yes, I missed some other interesting questions for what I'm looking for, e.g. "why are you still using an older version of Pharo?", but well... you cannot make it perfect :)

Of course, everybody has their own questions, and of course, if you want a "pharo census", we need to make much more questions... but that was off what I was looking for :)

Esteban

ps: yes, we can prepare a "pharo census", that can be interesting information too, and I would really like to have your help on preparing it... but lets complete this one small poll first.

On Aug 22, 2012, at 6:05 AM, Hernán Morales Durand <[hidden email]> wrote:

2012/8/22 Igor Stasenko <[hidden email]>

or look at this form another perspective:
 if you know how to make things better, improve them, what you waiting
for and not doing it in a first place?

I'm doing it, saying that a brief poll could be better is pushing Pharo developers to make things better. Don't you think so?
 

Pharo is open project after all.
Or at least, if you having a great idea but have no time/resources to
do it, why you don't proposing it or asking around who interested in
implementing it, but sitting there waiting to be asked ..

Yes, I'd like to be asked for the right questions. Your questions tell me your interests much as your lack of questions. I'm proposing more accurate polls... like "which packages do you use often?", "which non-core Collection classes do you need more?", "do you use Traits?", etc.
Nobody is obliged to answer any poll, if too many questions, you just don't answer :)

Hernán
 

--
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko.

--
Hernán Morales
Institute of Veterinary Genetics.
National Scientific and Technical Research Council (CONICET).
La Plata (1900), Buenos Aires, Argentina.
Telephone: <a href="tel:%2B54%20%280221%29%20421-1799" value="+542214211799" target="_blank">+54 (0221) 421-1799.
Internal: 422
Fax: 425-7980 or 421-1799.