Proposal for Mock Objects at ESUG 2011

> Hello!
> I'd like to explore interest to Mock Object in Smalltalk society. I'm
> currently working on the topic, preparing a paper and presentation targeting
> at ESUG 2011.
> I plan to present Mock Objects technique itself and a framework named
> Mocketry as a tool helping to apply it in practice. Of course I'll provide a
> small example to illustrate some of the ideas.
> Apparently, Mocks technique is not popular tool among Smalltalkers. It even
> seems (to me), TDD is not as widely used as it could and should be (despite
> the fact it was born in Smalltalk). I have been using TDD and Mocks for many
> years in different projects with Smalltalk and other languages. Sometimes it
> was hard, sometimes I was even giving it up, but by now I think I have
> sufficient experience to state that TDD in general and Mock Objects
> specifically do deserve (at least) more attention by smalltalkers. Yes,
> Smalltalk is great language and it has great tools. This damps some aspects
> of the problems TDD and Mocks address, but for sure does not remove them
> totally. More than that, I can say I was most productive in Smalltalk when I
> used "classic TDD" and mocks in conjunction.
>
> So, are other Smalltalkers interested in this topic? Do you think it worth
> to be presented at the conference? What are the problems you'd like to
> discuss there?
> TIA
> --
> Dennis Schetinin
>
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org
>
>

> Hello!
>
> I'd like to explore interest to Mock Object in Smalltalk society. I'm
> currently working on the topic, preparing a paper and presentation
> targeting at ESUG 2011.
>
> I plan to present Mock Objects technique itself and a framework named
> Mocketry as a tool helping to apply it in practice. Of course I'll
> provide a small example to illustrate some of the ideas.
>
> Apparently, Mocks technique is not popular tool among Smalltalkers. It
> even seems (to me), TDD is not as widely used as it could and should be
> (despite the fact it was born in Smalltalk). I have been using TDD and
> Mocks for many years in different projects with Smalltalk and other
> languages. Sometimes it was hard, sometimes I was even giving it up, but
> by now I think I have sufficient experience to state that TDD in general
> and Mock Objects specifically do deserve (at least) more attention by
> smalltalkers. Yes, Smalltalk is great language and it has great tools.
> This damps some aspects of the problems TDD and Mocks address, but for
> sure does not remove them totally. More than that, I can say I was most
> productive in Smalltalk when I used "classic TDD" and mocks in conjunction.
>
>
> So, are other Smalltalkers interested in this topic? Do you think it
> worth to be presented at the conference? What are the problems you'd
> like to discuss there?
>
> TIA
>
> --
> Dennis Schetinin
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

> That's interesting. I recently started to use Cucumber with Rails, which
> looks like another step in BDD with specs written in look-alike natural
> language. Hard to beat in terms of readibility, even with the Smalltalk
> syntax. But that's another topic.
> http://cukes.info/
>
> On topic I started to read the GOOS book written by two pioneers of mocks,
> and I think it's a recommended reading on the topic of objects + TDD + mock.
> Just read the first chapters for now but it's in line with my own conception
> of objects yet offers some interesting insights about design. I think Tim
> McKinnon which has been a regular participant of Smalltalk events in the
> past years might have a word or two on the topic :)
>
> http://www.growing-object-oriented-software.com/
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Proposal-for-Mock-Objects-at-ESUG-2011-tp3554367p3554988.html
> Sent from the ESUG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Dennis -
>
> Yes, I would very much like to hear what you've done with Mock Objects.  Niall makes some interesting points in his note about alternatives and I think it would be good to explore these as part of your presentation since they seem to be related to why we haven't seen mocks used more commonly in Smalltalk.
>
> John O'Keefe [|], Principal Smalltalk Architect, Instantiations Inc.
> Skype: john_okeefe2     Mobile:  +1 919 417-3181 (Business hours USA Eastern Time zone (GMT -5))
> [hidden email]
> http://www.instantiations.com
> VA Smalltalk...Onward and Upward!
>
>
> On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 12:36 AM, Dennis Schetinin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hello!
>
> I'd like to explore interest to Mock Object in Smalltalk society. I'm currently working on the topic, preparing a paper and presentation targeting at ESUG 2011.
>
> I plan to present Mock Objects technique itself and a framework named Mocketry as a tool helping to apply it in practice. Of course I'll provide a small example to illustrate some of the ideas.
>
> Apparently, Mocks technique is not popular tool among Smalltalkers. It even seems (to me), TDD is not as widely used as it could and should be (despite the fact it was born in Smalltalk). I have been using TDD and Mocks for many years in different projects with Smalltalk and other languages. Sometimes it was hard, sometimes I was even giving it up, but by now I think I have sufficient experience to state that TDD in general and Mock Objects specifically do deserve (at least) more attention by smalltalkers. Yes, Smalltalk is great language and it has great tools. This damps some aspects of the problems TDD and Mocks address, but for sure does not remove them totally. More than that, I can say I was most productive in Smalltalk when I used "classic TDD" and mocks in conjunction.
>
>
> So, are other Smalltalkers interested in this topic? Do you think it worth to be presented at the conference? What are the problems you'd like to discuss there?
>
> TIA
>
> --
> Dennis Schetinin
>
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org