Re: Home Context Button

-1. Obviously I think configurable toolbars would be lovely, both for me
using VW and for me to provide to our app's users. But they don't solve
this problem: what should be on the toolbar by default. Developers can't
duck out of that question by providing configurability.

Since in this case we're talking about a toolbar button used only by
Smalltalkers, we already have the configurability - probably a single
extension method with a pragma would bring back the button. That's a
more familiar and build-automation-friendly method than some new
"Settings > Debugger > Toolbar Buttons" pane.

Steve

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of Andres Valloud
> Sent: 3. syyskuuta 2010 14:47
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [vwnc] Home Context Button [was: [vw771] dead in the
water]
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As I understand it, the reason Cincom removed buttons from
the bar was to simplify it. However, the problem is that people
have different usage patterns and what is simple to one person
may be deficient to another. Example;

There were two buttons, intended to operate together,
"Run this context"(also called "Run until return") and
"Run with break again". But, in 7.7.1 "Run with break again"
was removed from the button bar. This essentially makes the
operation useless as the point of the command is to run
until the break occurs. Another way of thinking about this
is "step the next loop iteration".

The problem is that not many people really know how to use
it, so it was removed. Even I don't use it very often but
when needed, it is a great time saver. So, should it be removed
or kept?

You can read about these commands in the documentation under
"Iteration debugging".

I would very much prefer to have the toolbars configurable.
This way a newbie can start with a simple toolbar but an
expert can have all the power at his mouse click.

Terry
 
===========================================================
Terry Raymond
Crafted Smalltalk
80 Lazywood Ln.
Tiverton, RI  02878
(401) 624-4517      [hidden email]
<http://www.craftedsmalltalk.com>
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<disclaimer>
The following is my private opinion and may not be taken to represent the opinion of Cincom Smalltalk product management or engineering
</disclaimer>

Adding to the discussion: when I start to use a program (or anything else) I don't read manuals but start experimenting with the UI. That is: what the UI doesn't present isn't there. When I am hitting a barrier I search the UI at deeper levels, i. e. in settings pages, online help etc.. That is: what the settings don't present isn't there. Only when I am really stuck I will use the manuals and may, or may not, find interesting feature described there. IMHO "Smalltalk typical" extensibility by adding "probably a single extension method with a pragma" as suggested by Steve isn't a solution. Especially not for newbies who aren't used to examining the source of the system to find features.

Thus I agree to the synthesis of the opinions expressed:
- usability testing to find the 80/20 usage scenario
- configurability by settings in a settings tool
- providing code driven setting of settings for automation as suggested by Steve
- extensive descriptions in context sensitive online help and the manuals

Cheers
Helge

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Terry Raymond
Gesendet: Freitag, 3. September 2010 17:09
An: [hidden email]
Betreff: Re: [vwnc] Home Context Button

As I understand it, the reason Cincom removed buttons from
the bar was to simplify it. However, the problem is that people
have different usage patterns and what is simple to one person
may be deficient to another. Example;

There were two buttons, intended to operate together,
"Run this context"(also called "Run until return") and
"Run with break again". But, in 7.7.1 "Run with break again"
was removed from the button bar. This essentially makes the
operation useless as the point of the command is to run
until the break occurs. Another way of thinking about this
is "step the next loop iteration".

The problem is that not many people really know how to use
it, so it was removed. Even I don't use it very often but
when needed, it is a great time saver. So, should it be removed
or kept?

You can read about these commands in the documentation under
"Iteration debugging".

I would very much prefer to have the toolbars configurable.
This way a newbie can start with a simple toolbar but an
expert can have all the power at his mouse click.

Terry
 
===========================================================
Terry Raymond
Crafted Smalltalk
80 Lazywood Ln.
Tiverton, RI  02878
(401) 624-4517      [hidden email]
<http://www.craftedsmalltalk.com>
===========================================================
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vwnc mailing list
[hidden email]
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