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Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

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Aliaksei Syrel

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:

http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html

It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.

Cheers,

Alex

EstebanLM

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

But next year we will have an Athens based UI, so the performance will improve dramatically :)
Real problem is to invest time (and talent) to improve current design... It costs much more than you could believe.

Esteban

> On 25/1/2015, at 15:42, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 03:35:40PM +0100, Aliaksei Syrel wrote:
>>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html
>>
>>
>> It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low
>> drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.
>
> thanks for the note.
>
> per you, how long would this low drawing performance and bad support for
> animations issue hold true?
>
> ~mayuresh
>
>

kilon.alios

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

In reply to this post by Aliaksei Syrel

frankly I dont see why people keep linking this design document. Google has no clue about good design as most software companies, they definitely droped the ball in that area with Android. But that is my opinion. Pharo can be definetly be improved in several areas but it has been already a huge improvement over Squeak. So I am not afraid of Pharo design wise its on a good road and I try to also give it a helping hand :)

Then on the other hand design is a matter of taste.

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:

while i admire what the pharo team has done with it's user interface, i believe it can be improved.
has google's "material design" been considered off-late?
do take a look at; http://www.google.com/design/

~mayuresh

Nicolai Hess

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

In reply to this post by EstebanLM

Am 25.01.2015 16:20 schrieb "Esteban Lorenzano" <[hidden email]>:
>
> But next year we will have an Athens based UI, so the performance will improve dramatically :)

Yes? What? Bloc or morphic on top of athens ?
And what makes you think, Athens is fast er?

> Real problem is to invest time (and talent) to improve current design... It costs much more than you could believe.
>
> Esteban
>
>
>
> > On 25/1/2015, at 15:42, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 03:35:40PM +0100, Aliaksei Syrel wrote:
> >>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html
> >>
> >>
> >> It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low
> >> drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.
> >
> > thanks for the note.
> >
> > per you, how long would this low drawing performance and bad support for
> > animations issue hold true?
> >
> > ~mayuresh
> >
> >
>

EstebanLM

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

On 25 Jan 2015, at 17:39, Nicolai Hess <[hidden email]> wrote:

Am 25.01.2015 16:20 schrieb "Esteban Lorenzano" <[hidden email]>:
>
> But next year we will have an Athens based UI, so the performance will improve dramatically :)
Yes? What? Bloc or morphic on top of athens ?

both

And what makes you think, Athens is fast er?

Athens directly in the screen (using SDL2) is faster (according all my experiments)

you cannot perceive it now because a surface is mapped to a bitmap to be displayed with current bitblt… but we plan to move away from that :)

> Real problem is to invest time (and talent) to improve current design... It costs much more than you could believe.
>
> Esteban
>
>
>
> > On 25/1/2015, at 15:42, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 03:35:40PM +0100, Aliaksei Syrel wrote:
> >>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html
> >>
> >>
> >> It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low
> >> drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.
> >
> > thanks for the note.
> >
> > per you, how long would this low drawing performance and bad support for
> > animations issue hold true?
> >
> > ~mayuresh
> >
> >
>

Aliaksei Syrel

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

Hi,

What will happen with Athens when Pharo moves to Spur? As I know NativeBoost doesn't work in Spur yet

Cheers,

Alex

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 6:40 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 25 Jan 2015, at 17:39, Nicolai Hess <[hidden email]> wrote:

Am 25.01.2015 16:20 schrieb "Esteban Lorenzano" <[hidden email]>:
>
> But next year we will have an Athens based UI, so the performance will improve dramatically :)
Yes? What? Bloc or morphic on top of athens ?
both

And what makes you think, Athens is fast er?
Athens directly in the screen (using SDL2) is faster (according all my experiments)
you cannot perceive it now because a surface is mapped to a bitmap to be displayed with current bitblt… but we plan to move away from that :)

> Real problem is to invest time (and talent) to improve current design... It costs much more than you could believe.
>
> Esteban
>
>
>
> > On 25/1/2015, at 15:42, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 03:35:40PM +0100, Aliaksei Syrel wrote:
> >>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html
> >>
> >>
> >> It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low
> >> drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.
> >
> > thanks for the note.
> >
> > per you, how long would this low drawing performance and bad support for
> > animations issue hold true?
> >
> > ~mayuresh
> >
> >
>

Sven Van Caekenberghe-2

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

These are pharo-dev discussions, not pharo-users discussions.
This is about stuff (far) in the future, not current usage.

> On 25 Jan 2015, at 18:51, Aliaksei Syrel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> What will happen with Athens when Pharo moves to Spur? As I know NativeBoost doesn't work in Spur yet
>
> Cheers,
> Alex
>
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 6:40 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On 25 Jan 2015, at 17:39, Nicolai Hess <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Am 25.01.2015 16:20 schrieb "Esteban Lorenzano" <[hidden email]>:
>> >
>> > But next year we will have an Athens based UI, so the performance will improve dramatically :)
>>
>> Yes? What? Bloc or morphic on top of athens ?
>>
> both
>
>> And what makes you think, Athens is fast er?
>>
> Athens directly in the screen (using SDL2) is faster (according all my experiments)
> you cannot perceive it now because a surface is mapped to a bitmap to be displayed with current bitblt… but we plan to move away from that :)
>
>> > Real problem is to invest time (and talent) to improve current design... It costs much more than you could believe.
>> >
>> > Esteban
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > > On 25/1/2015, at 15:42, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 03:35:40PM +0100, Aliaksei Syrel wrote:
>> > >>> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> > >>>
>> > >>> http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low
>> > >> drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.
>> > >
>> > > thanks for the note.
>> > >
>> > > per you, how long would this low drawing performance and bad support for
>> > > animations issue hold true?
>> > >
>> > > ~mayuresh
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>
>

stepharo

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

In reply to this post by Aliaksei Syrel

Did you see the animation roassal is doing.

Le 25/1/15 15:35, Aliaksei Syrel a écrit :

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:

http://www.google.com/design/spec/material-design/introduction.html

It is almost impossible to do it like this in Pharo now because of low drawing performance and bad support of animations. Sad but true.

Cheers,
Alex

stepharo

Re: pharo _looks_ good, but can be improved ...

In reply to this post by kilon.alios

Le 25/1/15 16:57, kilon alios a écrit :

frankly I dont see why people keep linking this design document. Google has no clue about good design as most software companies, they definitely droped the ball in that area with Android. But that is my opinion. Pharo can be definetly be improved in several areas but it has been already a huge improvement over Squeak. So I am not afraid of Pharo design wise its on a good road and I try to also give it a helping hand :)

Then on the other hand design is a matter of taste.

On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Mayuresh Kathe <[hidden email]> wrote:

while i admire what the pharo team has done with it's user interface, i believe it can be improved.
has google's "material design" been considered off-late?
do take a look at; http://www.google.com/design/

~mayuresh