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Saving Moose model in MongoDB

jannik laval
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo 7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Nicolas Anquetil

Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
> 7, Moose 8).
> My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
> voyageRoot.
>
> Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
> Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?
>
> Cheers,
> --
> ~~Jannik Laval~~
> Enseignant-chercheur
> Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
> IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
> laboratoire DISP
> +33 4 78 77 43 06
> http://www.jannik-laval.eu
> http://www.phratch.com
> http://www.approchealpes.info
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

jannik laval
The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

> Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
>
> Hi,
>
> what is the goal?
>
> if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
> could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
> visitor).
> So it would be a 1 level tree
>
> nicolas
>
> On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
>> 7, Moose 8).
>> My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
>> voyageRoot.
>>
>> Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
>> Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> --
>> ~~Jannik Laval~~
>> Enseignant-chercheur
>> Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
>> IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
>> laboratoire DISP
>> +33 4 78 77 43 06
>> http://www.jannik-laval.eu
>> http://www.phratch.com
>> http://www.approchealpes.info
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
> --
> Nicolas Anquetil
> RMod team -- Inria Lille
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Stéphane Ducasse
I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
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[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France


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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Jannik Laval-2
In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
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[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Anne Etien-2
But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?

Anne

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

jannik laval
to save it outside the image :)

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:18, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> a écrit :

But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?

Anne

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
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[hidden email]
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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

demarey
In reply to this post by Jannik Laval-2
Hi Jannik,

Did you think to use a graph database?
No need to solve circular dependencies and probably more efficient for querying.
I did not try but there is an example here: https://github.com/quentinplessis/smalltalk-neo4j

Cheers,
Christophe.

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

_______________________________________________
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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

jannik laval
Hum, probably better than mongoDB.

I will try. Thank you
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:29, Christophe Demarey <[hidden email]> a écrit :

Hi Jannik,

Did you think to use a graph database?
No need to solve circular dependencies and probably more efficient for querying.
I did not try but there is an example here: https://github.com/quentinplessis/smalltalk-neo4j

Cheers,
Christophe.

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
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FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Stéphane Ducasse
In reply to this post by jannik laval
This is not clear to me.
you can save a model in Ston or other 
and you can query it in Moose. 

What are the size of your models because you can load them all and query them. 


to save it outside the image :)

But that you can do it in MSE, STON (with one line), Fuel, 


--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:18, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> a écrit :

But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?

Anne

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
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--
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RMod team -- Inria Lille

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--------------------------------------------
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03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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--------------------------------------------
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03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France


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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

jannik laval


Le 16 sept. 2019 à 22:02, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

This is not clear to me.
you can save a model in Ston or other 
and you can query it in Moose. 

What is Ston. I am not sure to know it.


What are the size of your models because you can load them all and query them. 

I would like to have a lazy loading. Not all the model.
We are using Orion, which makes the model partial.

In fact, we don’t need it for now, but we want to have this perspective.

Jannik



to save it outside the image :)

But that you can do it in MSE, STON (with one line), Fuel, 


--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:18, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> a écrit :

But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?

Anne

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
-- 
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RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
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--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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--------------------------------------------
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03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Stéphane Ducasse


On 17 Sep 2019, at 10:23, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:



Le 16 sept. 2019 à 22:02, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

This is not clear to me.
you can save a model in Ston or other 
and you can query it in Moose. 

What is Ston. I am not sure to know it.

Check the book you are author :)
STON is  textual serialisation format. 


What are the size of your models because you can load them all and query them. 

I would like to have a lazy loading. Not all the model.

This is not stroing in mongo that will give you that. 
You will have to change the loading of model parts and Moose does not support it. 

In addition if you have a graph how to you specify that an entity that is referenced should not be loaded (transitively)

We are using Orion, which makes the model partial.

I do not get this.


In fact, we don’t need it for now, but we want to have this perspective.

Only suffer when really needed is my doctrine. 



Jannik



to save it outside the image :)

But that you can do it in MSE, STON (with one line), Fuel, 


--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:18, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> a écrit :

But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?

Anne

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
-- 
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

_______________________________________________
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--------------------------------------------
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03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France


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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Jannik Laval-2


Le 17 sept. 2019 à 10:28, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :



On 17 Sep 2019, at 10:23, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:



Le 16 sept. 2019 à 22:02, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

This is not clear to me.
you can save a model in Ston or other 
and you can query it in Moose. 

What is Ston. I am not sure to know it.

Check the book you are author :)
STON is  textual serialisation format. 

Ok, I already use it : STONJSON :)



What are the size of your models because you can load them all and query them. 

I would like to have a lazy loading. Not all the model.

This is not stroing in mongo that will give you that. 
You will have to change the loading of model parts and Moose does not support it. 

In addition if you have a graph how to you specify that an entity that is referenced should not be loaded (transitively)

That is a question I have not solved.


We are using Orion, which makes the model partial.

I do not get this.


In fact, we don’t need it for now, but we want to have this perspective.

Only suffer when really needed is my doctrine. 

:D 
Ok, I will do it for this task




Jannik



to save it outside the image :)

But that you can do it in MSE, STON (with one line), Fuel, 


--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:18, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> a écrit :

But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?

Anne

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :

In fact, I need to save models and query them. 
I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.

In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?

Cheers
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :

I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston. 

Stef

On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:

The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
But the idea of MSE serialization is good.

Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…

--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :


Hi,

what is the goal?

if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
visitor).
So it would be a 1 level tree

nicolas

On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
Hi everyone,

I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
7, Moose 8).
My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
voyageRoot.

Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?

Cheers,
--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
[hidden email]
https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
-- 
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

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--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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--------------------------------------------
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03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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--------------------------------------------
Stéphane Ducasse
03 59 35 87 52
Assistant: Julie Jonas 
FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
40, avenue Halley, 
Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
France

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Nicolas Anquetil


Yann Lesage at synectique tried to do external storage of moose models.

He spent a lot of time on it, did several experiments.
MongoDB was not the solution he chose in the end (cyril told yesterday
me what it was but I already forgot :-) )

It was still very slow when he left the company (prior to it going
bankrupt) and speedup was involving analyses to try to reduce the
number of request to the DB.

Bottom line is: do you have months of full time development to put in
it?

nicolas

--
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RMod team -- Inria Lille

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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

Stéphane Ducasse
And it did not work when you have a graph…. 
And it was cyril (the other delaunay that did it ).

Stef

On 17 Sep 2019, at 13:52, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> wrote:



Yann Lesage at synectique tried to do external storage of moose models.

He spent a lot of time on it, did several experiments.
MongoDB was not the solution he chose in the end (cyril told yesterday
me what it was but I already forgot :-) )

It was still very slow when he left the company (prior to it going
bankrupt) and speedup was involving analyses to try to reduce the
number of request to the DB.

Bottom line is: do you have months of full time development to put in
it?

nicolas

--
Nicolas Anquetil
RMod team -- Inria Lille

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FAX 03 59 57 78 50
TEL 03 59 35 86 16
S. Ducasse - Inria
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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

tinchodias
In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse
On Mon, Sep 16, 2019 at 5:02 PM Stéphane Ducasse
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> This is not clear to me.
> you can save a model in Ston or other
> and you can query it in Moose.
>
> What are the size of your models because you can load them all and query them.
>
>
> to save it outside the image :)
>
>
> But that you can do it in MSE, STON (with one line), Fuel,

~2011 we created a Fuel exporter/importer for Moose models, which was
available for some versions (I think was removed later because of a
bug with huge files that couldn't fix). If I remember well, all the
effort was in customizations to avoid serializing generated/derivative
objects that could be regenerated on materialization. But no problem
with circular references in the object graph. Now I have no idea how
different could it be with the new Moose.

Regards,
Martín

>
>
> --
> ~~Jannik Laval~~
> Enseignant-chercheur
> Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
> IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
> laboratoire DISP
> +33 4 78 77 43 06
> http://www.jannik-laval.eu
> http://www.phratch.com
> http://www.approchealpes.info
>
> Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:18, Anne Etien <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
> But you can query a model with MooseQuery. Why do you need something else?
>
> Anne
>
> Le 16 sept. 2019 à 18:04, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
> In fact, I need to save models and query them.
> I think we can do it with Gemstone. But I thought we can have something similar with MongoDB.
>
> In fact, the point is « how to identify circular references » to avoid infinite loop in Voyage ?
>
> Cheers
> --
> ~~Jannik Laval~~
> Enseignant-chercheur
> Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
> IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
> laboratoire DISP
> +33 4 78 77 43 06
> http://www.jannik-laval.eu
> http://www.phratch.com
> http://www.approchealpes.info
>
> Le 16 sept. 2019 à 17:24, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
> I’m confused by what you want to do but you can try ston.
>
> Stef
>
> On 16 Sep 2019, at 16:58, Jannik Laval <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> The idea is to use it at runtime. So need to make queries.
> But the idea of MSE serialization is good.
>
> Now I don’t know how we can manage the serialization strategy of MSE with the one of Voyage…
>
> --
> ~~Jannik Laval~~
> Enseignant-chercheur
> Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
> IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
> laboratoire DISP
> +33 4 78 77 43 06
> http://www.jannik-laval.eu
> http://www.phratch.com
> http://www.approchealpes.info
>
> Le 16 sept. 2019 à 16:46, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
>
> Hi,
>
> what is the goal?
>
> if it is only a backup store (to later retreive the entire model), you
> could try something similar to the MSE serialization (done with a
> visitor).
> So it would be a 1 level tree
>
> nicolas
>
> On Mon, 2019-09-16 at 15:22 +0200, Jannik Laval wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I am trying to save a moose model into MongoDB, using Voyage (Pharo
> 7, Moose 8).
> My problem is that it is not a tree. So I declared MooseEntity as
> voyageRoot.
>
> Now, it seems I have a loop into my graph.
> Do you have any idea of ho to debug that ?
>
> Cheers,
> --
> ~~Jannik Laval~~
> Enseignant-chercheur
> Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
> IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
> laboratoire DISP
> +33 4 78 77 43 06
> http://www.jannik-laval.eu
> http://www.phratch.com
> http://www.approchealpes.info
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
> --
> Nicolas Anquetil
> RMod team -- Inria Lille
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> --------------------------------------------
> Stéphane Ducasse
> http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr
> http://www.synectique.eu / http://www.pharo.org
> 03 59 35 87 52
> Assistant: Julie Jonas
> FAX 03 59 57 78 50
> TEL 03 59 35 86 16
> S. Ducasse - Inria
> 40, avenue Halley,
> Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
> Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
> France
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> --------------------------------------------
> Stéphane Ducasse
> http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr
> http://www.synectique.eu / http://www.pharo.org
> 03 59 35 87 52
> Assistant: Julie Jonas
> FAX 03 59 57 78 50
> TEL 03 59 35 86 16
> S. Ducasse - Inria
> 40, avenue Halley,
> Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza
> Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650
> France
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
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> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
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Re: Saving Moose model in MongoDB

jannik laval
In reply to this post by Nicolas Anquetil
Ok, thank you for the feedback.
I will use mse files :)


--
~~Jannik Laval~~
Enseignant-chercheur
Responsable Pédagogique Licence Coordonnateur de Projet
IUT Lumière, Université Lumière Lyon 2
laboratoire DISP
+33 4 78 77 43 06
http://www.jannik-laval.eu
http://www.phratch.com
http://www.approchealpes.info

> Le 17 sept. 2019 à 13:52, Nicolas Anquetil <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
>
>
> Yann Lesage at synectique tried to do external storage of moose models.
>
> He spent a lot of time on it, did several experiments.
> MongoDB was not the solution he chose in the end (cyril told yesterday
> me what it was but I already forgot :-) )
>
> It was still very slow when he left the company (prior to it going
> bankrupt) and speedup was involving analyses to try to reduce the
> number of request to the DB.
>
> Bottom line is: do you have months of full time development to put in
> it?
>
> nicolas
>
> --
> Nicolas Anquetil
> RMod team -- Inria Lille
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev

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