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Phil B

Status of Unicode support?

I recall there was a lot of discussion a while back about Unicode
support in Cuis and I was just curious if anyone who was in the know
could summarize both what was agreed to and where things stand on this?
Any pointers to example code is also appreciated as I've not done very
much with Unicode personally.

(I was taking a look at porting Nile but of course soon ran into the
issue of it utilizing various Unicode characters for mathematical
notation.)

Thanks,
Phil

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Phil B

Re: Status of Unicode support?

I should probably clarify what I'm looking for: is it possible to use
Unicode characters in the code editors (i.e. method source code)?

On Tue, 2015-06-23 at 21:16 -0400, Phil (list) wrote:

> I recall there was a lot of discussion a while back about Unicode
> support in Cuis and I was just curious if anyone who was in the know
> could summarize both what was agreed to and where things stand on this?
> Any pointers to example code is also appreciated as I've not done very
> much with Unicode personally.
>
> (I was taking a look at porting Nile but of course soon ran into the
> issue of it utilizing various Unicode characters for mathematical
> notation.)
>
> Thanks,
> Phil

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Juan Vuletich-4

Re: Status of Unicode support?

Hi Phil,

On 6/23/2015 10:25 PM, Phil (list) wrote:
> I should probably clarify what I'm looking for: is it possible to use
> Unicode characters in the code editors (i.e. method source code)?

I haven't worked on this, maybe others (Ken?) can comment.

In any case, if the mathematical symbols you want to use are not too
many, I would hijack some of codes in the 128 to 255 range. According to
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO/IEC_8859-15 , there are 33 unused code
points, from 16r7F to 16r9F. Some of them are used by Cuis to store
alternate glyphs for $^ and $_ , and original (small) $, $. $; $: but
you can use them anyway if needed.

Or you can also completely ignore ISO 8859-15, just keep the ASCII part,
and use the 16r80 to 16rFF range at will. You can prepare a new font
family, by copying Bitmap DejaVu, and add the glyps you need.

If you want to be able to save and read proper Unicode files with the
correct code points for these glyps (to be able to edit them outside
Cuis), we'd need a kind of TextConverter, something akin to
#iso8859s15CodeForUnicodeCodePoint: .

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

> On Tue, 2015-06-23 at 21:16 -0400, Phil (list) wrote:
>> I recall there was a lot of discussion a while back about Unicode
>> support in Cuis and I was just curious if anyone who was in the know
>> could summarize both what was agreed to and where things stand on this?
>> Any pointers to example code is also appreciated as I've not done very
>> much with Unicode personally.
>>
>> (I was taking a look at porting Nile but of course soon ran into the
>> issue of it utilizing various Unicode characters for mathematical
>> notation.)
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Phil
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cuis mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
>

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KenDickey

Re: Status of Unicode support?

In reply to this post by Phil B

Sorry, Phil. Hiking in the woods without WiFi.

Not ignoring the mailing list for lack of interest..

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 21:16:30 -0400
"Phil (list)" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I recall there was a lot of discussion a while back about Unicode
> support in Cuis and I was just curious if anyone who was in the know
> could summarize both what was agreed to and where things stand on this?

Cuis can read and write utf-8 codepoints.

I just updated https://github.com/KenDickey/Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode. The README.md file covers the salients.

Note that due to the large size, Unicode support takes a long time to load.

As the Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode package is an add-on, UniString does NOT inherit from String; UniChar does NOT inherit from Character.

Basically you can edit ASCII and do Unicode via cut/paste, which is good enough for web pages.

No font support, but you can see the basic gliphs.

E.g.
(Interval from: 8700 to: 8700 + 300) asArray asUniString edit.
Will give a range of math symbols you can copy.

See the README.md file.

> I should probably clarify what I'm looking for: is it possible to use
> Unicode characters in the code editors (i.e. method source code)?

I believe the answer is NO, but I have not tried this.

Note that I am unable to save an image with Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode loaded. I believe this is due to a bug in the ARM VM version I am using, but don't have access to an Intel architecture machine to check against.

Cheers,
-KenD

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-KenD

Juan Vuletich-4

Re: Status of Unicode support?

Hi Ken,

I tried your Unicode package today, and found a few required changes due
to recent changes in FileDirectory (elimination of #current). Please
consider integrating the attach (or equivalent) in your packages.

With these patches loaded, I could save the image without problems in
Windows 7. HTH.

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

On 6/26/2015 5:32 PM, Ken.Dickey wrote:

> Sorry, Phil. Hiking in the woods without WiFi.
>
> Not ignoring the mailing list for lack of interest..
>
>
> On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 21:16:30 -0400
> "Phil (list)"<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I recall there was a lot of discussion a while back about Unicode
>> support in Cuis and I was just curious if anyone who was in the know
>> could summarize both what was agreed to and where things stand on this?
> Cuis can read and write utf-8 codepoints.
>
> I just updated https://github.com/KenDickey/Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode. The README.md file covers the salients.
>
> Note that due to the large size, Unicode support takes a long time to load.
>
> As the Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode package is an add-on, UniString does NOT inherit from String; UniChar does NOT inherit from Character.
>
> Basically you can edit ASCII and do Unicode via cut/paste, which is good enough for web pages.
>
> No font support, but you can see the basic gliphs.
>
> E.g.
> (Interval from: 8700 to: 8700 + 300) asArray asUniString edit.
> Will give a range of math symbols you can copy.
>
> See the README.md file.
>
>> I should probably clarify what I'm looking for: is it possible to use
>> Unicode characters in the code editors (i.e. method source code)?
> I believe the answer is NO, but I have not tried this.
>
> Note that I am unable to save an image with Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode loaded. I believe this is due to a bug in the ARM VM version I am using, but don't have access to an Intel architecture machine to check against.
>
> Cheers,
> -KenD
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cuis mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://jvuletich.org/mailman/listinfo/cuis_jvuletich.org
>

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unicode-ropes-jmv.zip (4K) Download Attachment

KenDickey

Re: Status of Unicode support?

On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 10:35:26 -0300
Juan Vuletich <[hidden email]> wrote:
..
> I tried your Unicode package today, and found a few required changes due
> to recent changes in FileDirectory (elimination of #current). Please
> consider integrating the attach (or equivalent) in your packages.

Thanks much! Just pushed the updated files.

Image w UniCodes saves on ARM now as well!

Wow!

-KenD

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-KenD

Phil B

Re: Status of Unicode support?

In reply to this post by KenDickey

On Fri, 2015-06-26 at 14:32 -0600, Ken.Dickey wrote:
> Sorry, Phil. Hiking in the woods without WiFi.
>
> Not ignoring the mailing list for lack of interest..
>

No worries, though you might think about getting a 'friends and forests'
plan on your phone :-)

>
> On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 21:16:30 -0400
> "Phil (list)" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > I recall there was a lot of discussion a while back about Unicode
> > support in Cuis and I was just curious if anyone who was in the know
> > could summarize both what was agreed to and where things stand on this?
>
> Cuis can read and write utf-8 codepoints.
>
> I just updated https://github.com/KenDickey/Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode. The README.md file covers the salients.
>
> Note that due to the large size, Unicode support takes a long time to load.
>
> As the Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode package is an add-on, UniString does NOT inherit from String; UniChar does NOT inherit from Character.
>
> Basically you can edit ASCII and do Unicode via cut/paste, which is good enough for web pages.
>
> No font support, but you can see the basic gliphs.
>
> E.g.
> (Interval from: 8700 to: 8700 + 300) asArray asUniString edit.
> Will give a range of math symbols you can copy.
>
> See the README.md file.
>

Excellent, I'll take a look.

> > I should probably clarify what I'm looking for: is it possible to use
> > Unicode characters in the code editors (i.e. method source code)?
>
> I believe the answer is NO, but I have not tried this.
>

Fair enough. I'm flip-flopping on whether or not this is even a
desirable feature. On the pro side: sure, things like mathematical
notation would be nice to have for reading code where it's appropriate.
(see this screenshot for an example:
https://youtu.be/HAT4iewOHDs?t=29m20s) On the con side, writing it
becomes a bit of a pain as you get into hard to remember key combos for
unicode characters. (to warp an interview response I saw a while back
with former Star Wars cast members re: George Lucas' dialog: 'you can
read this sh*t, but you can't write it!')

> Note that I am unable to save an image with Cuis-Smalltalk-Unicode loaded. I believe this is due to a bug in the ARM VM version I am using, but don't have access to an Intel architecture machine to check against.
>

I was going to look at this but Juan has already fixed it. Man he's
fast...

> Cheers,
> -KenD

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KenDickey

Re: Status of Unicode support?

On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 19:45:00 -0400
"Phil (list)" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Fri, 2015-06-26 at 14:32 -0600, Ken.Dickey wrote:
> > Sorry, Phil. Hiking in the woods without WiFi.
..
> No worries, though you might think about getting a 'friends and forests'
> plan on your phone :-)

I don't use a cell phone.

Hey. Old hacker, old tech. I read books too. ;^)

--
-KenD

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-KenD

Phil B

Re: Status of Unicode support?

On Sat, 2015-06-27 at 21:20 -0700, Ken.Dickey wrote:

> On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 19:45:00 -0400
> "Phil (list)" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 2015-06-26 at 14:32 -0600, Ken.Dickey wrote:
> > > Sorry, Phil. Hiking in the woods without WiFi.
> ..
> > No worries, though you might think about getting a 'friends and forests'
> > plan on your phone :-)
>
> I don't use a cell phone.
>
> Hey. Old hacker, old tech. I read books too. ;^)
>

On, like... paper? I've heard people like you existed but never
believed... :-)

I actually have multiple cell phones but no data plan (and barely a
calling plan)... so I'm right there with you

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