Support for standard Squeak (was: Starting with an appropriate PRKernel)

> On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 2:51 PM, Gerhard Obermann <[hidden email]> wrote:
> PRDistribution new kernel

To get Pier into my standard Squeak 3.9 image, I originally loaded
Pier from SqueakMap.  However, I can see that this does not obtain
quite a few of the packages available from the Pier squeaksource
repository that are present in the one-click image.

Is there a proper procedure for to loading-up a standard Squeak image
with all of the Pier goodies?

To get PRDistribution I loaded "Pier-Setup" from Lukas' repository.
Doing this exposed PRLoader>>#load loading a bunch of other stuff.
However, I couldn't bring that in because

    ScriptLoader loadLatestPackage: 'Gofer' from: ...

is not part of my ScriptLoader.  The ScriptLoader version in the
one-click image is from the Pharo repository.  Which begs two
important questions for those of us proceeding forward with standard
Squeak images (instead of Pharo images).

1) What is the best way to get a full, proper Pier installed in 3.9 or 3.10?

and.. 2) What are the intentions of the Pier developers, going
forward, for support of the standard Squeak images?

Despite my concern about the Pharo image and its splintering effects
on our community, as the maintainer of Magma, I can say I am
"committed" to maintaining Magma's compatibility with Pharo, even
though I intend to proceed forward with standard Squeak at this time.

I realize you cannot make any guarantee's any more than I can, but may
I at least know what the *intentions* are (as I just have)?  Lukas, it
looks like you are moving forward with Pharo.  But is standard Squeak
compatibility a factor for you at all in any of your decisions
regarding Pier going forward?

Thanks..
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El mié, 09-09-2009 a las 15:50 -0500, Chris Muller escribió:
Hi Chris,

this is unofficially of course as I am not the mantainer of the Pier
(Lukas or Tudor has better answers) but as I see thing, the Seaside and
Pier packages are going to be developed and distributed on Pharo images,
because the developers are most of them very involved in Pharo. So maybe
the best way is to get a Pharo image (either the PharoCore or the Pharo
images prepared by Damien Cassou from
http://pharo-project.org/pharo-download) and use them for your goals.
Also, to load the packages needed, the best way is to look in the
scripts created and used by Damien to build the dev and web pharo
images, they are distributed with the zips of the dev/web images and
adapt them.
With time, and as the Pharo reaches 1.0 even more, the squeak
compatibility effort will fade and the packages that now load in squeak
will be made to load in Pharo but not the other way.


>
> Thanks..
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--
Miguel Cobá
http://miguel.leugim.com.mx

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> 1) What is the best way to get a full, proper Pier installed in 3.9 or 3.10?

It is actually quite simple to load manually. You load Seaside (and
the required dependencies), then Magritte-Core, Magritte-Seaside,
Pier-Core, Pier-Seaside, and the plugins and Pier-All.

> and.. 2) What are the intentions of the Pier developers, going
> forward, for support of the standard Squeak images?

Magritte and Pier probably work in both Pharo and Squeak, in fact the
code runs almost identical on GemStone and VisualWorks. I haven't
tried in Squeak in the past, but I guess it should work there too. I
am certainly willing to include patches if they improve portability,
but I will am not actively maintaining a port to Squeak.

> I realize you cannot make any guarantee's any more than I can, but may
> I at least know what the *intentions* are (as I just have)?  Lukas, it
> looks like you are moving forward with Pharo.  But is standard Squeak
> compatibility a factor for you at all in any of your decisions
> regarding Pier going forward?

The situation is basically the same as for Seaside. Somebody needs to
step up and actively maintain a port, regularly run the tests and
report back problems. For me Squeak is just a platform like VW,
GemStone, GST, VAST, ... for now I chose Pharo as my development
platform of choice.

Cheers,
Lukas

--
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch
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On Thu, 2009-09-10 at 00:11 +0200, Lukas Renggli wrote:
> > 1) What is the best way to get a full, proper Pier installed in 3.9
> or 3.10?
>
> It is actually quite simple to load manually. You load Seaside (and
> the required dependencies), then Magritte-Core, Magritte-Seaside,
> Pier-Core, Pier-Seaside, and the plugins and Pier-All.
Do they need a closure-enabled VM?  Will they eventually?

Ross Boylan


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>> It is actually quite simple to load manually. You load Seaside (and
>> the required dependencies), then Magritte-Core, Magritte-Seaside,
>> Pier-Core, Pier-Seaside, and the plugins and Pier-All.
>
> Do they need a closure-enabled VM?  Will they eventually?

No, it worked in images without closures for years. I don't see a
reason why that should be a problem.

Lukas

--
Lukas Renggli
http://www.lukas-renggli.ch

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