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Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

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sebastianconcept

Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

Hi guys,

I hope this get you doing great!

can you give me some ammunition?

In what Amber outperforms this claims?

http://java.dzone.com/articles/10-reasons-web-developers?page=0,0

Does Amber address those?

Thanks!

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Joe Shirk

Re: Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

That's a very interesting article. I can't wait to see the responses to this.

On Monday, March 17, 2014 9:01:40 PM UTC-3, Sebastian Sastre wrote:

can you give me some ammunition?

In what Amber outperforms this claims?
<a href="http://java.dzone.com/articles/10-reasons-web-developers?page=0,0" target="_blank" onmousedown="this.href='http://www.google.com/url?q\75http%3A%2F%2Fjava.dzone.com%2Farticles%2F10-reasons-web-developers%3Fpage%3D0%2C0\46sa\75D\46sntz\0751\46usg\75AFQjCNElUsjvq_yQkgI-n4w38y8rotSIEA';return true;" onclick="this.href='http://www.google.com/url?q\75http%3A%2F%2Fjava.dzone.com%2Farticles%2F10-reasons-web-developers%3Fpage%3D0%2C0\46sa\75D\46sntz\0751\46usg\75AFQjCNElUsjvq_yQkgI-n4w38y8rotSIEA';return true;">http://java.dzone.com/articles/10-reasons-web-developers?page=0,0

kilon.alios

Re: Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

isn't Amber and AngularJS two things moving to opposite directions ?

Amber focusing on JS side while AngularJS on HTML side ?

On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 12:19 AM, Joe Shirk <[hidden email]> wrote:

That's a very interesting article. I can't wait to see the responses to this.

On Monday, March 17, 2014 9:01:40 PM UTC-3, Sebastian Sastre wrote:

can you give me some ammunition?

In what Amber outperforms this claims?
http://java.dzone.com/articles/10-reasons-web-developers?page=0,0

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sebastianconcept

Re: Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

On Mar 24, 2014, at 5:46 AM, kilon alios <[hidden email]> wrote:

isn't Amber and AngularJS two things moving to opposite directions ?

Amber focusing on JS side while AngularJS on HTML side ?

well, that’s not the point.

Kick ass productivity is the point.

And easy collaboration with designers.

And snappy single page applications.

(the list is actually a bit longer, watch the first 10m of this presentation to know it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9MHigUZKEM)

I have no problem in going in a different direction than mainstream on the technical part as long as we can address the point

Otherwise the investment wouldn’t be as competitive

Does my question make sense?

philippeback

Re: Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

Perfectly.

I am asking myself the same before ambarking on Amber or Angular ...

Now more into Ember.js ...but well, as you say: competitive.

Phil

On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 1:13 PM, sebastian <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Mar 24, 2014, at 5:46 AM, kilon alios <[hidden email]> wrote:

isn't Amber and AngularJS two things moving to opposite directions ?

Amber focusing on JS side while AngularJS on HTML side ?

well, that’s not the point.

Kick ass productivity is the point.

And easy collaboration with designers.

And snappy single page applications.

(the list is actually a bit longer, watch the first 10m of this presentation to know it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9MHigUZKEM)

I have no problem in going in a different direction than mainstream on the technical part as long as we can address the point

Otherwise the investment wouldn’t be as competitive

Does my question make sense?

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sebastianconcept

Re: Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

Yesterday I saw this... and if you love Amber watch it completely and imagine you doing the same demo and end result on Amber in the same duration:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbZnf9Fa8UE

I kept wondering how to make a similar demo with Amber + Pharo or an Amber + node stack.

Some thoughts:

If we put aside things like

- Reactivity. Automatic refresh/invalidation of a component (re-rendering) on server side data/model chance

- Instant feedback. Smalltalk used to champion instant feedback. I'm surprised that now Meteor has it even better than Amber.

- Latency compensation

We still have many annoying productivity bumps to make the design process smoother

Bumps that will scare the hell out of 99.99% designers

The thing is, I have many chances to demo stuff like this, but I can't if does not produce a kickass effect

Can something be done about that? ideas?

On Monday, March 24, 2014 9:35:23 AM UTC-3, [hidden email] wrote:

Perfectly.

I am asking myself the same before ambarking on Amber or Angular ...

Now more into Ember.js ...but well, as you say: competitive.

Phil

On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 1:13 PM, sebastian <<a href="javascript:" target="_blank" gdf-obfuscated-mailto="H9w_E7Fi8jsJ" onmousedown="this.href='javascript:';return true;" onclick="this.href='javascript:';return true;">sebastia...@...> wrote:

On Mar 24, 2014, at 5:46 AM, kilon alios <<a href="javascript:" target="_blank" gdf-obfuscated-mailto="H9w_E7Fi8jsJ" onmousedown="this.href='javascript:';return true;" onclick="this.href='javascript:';return true;">kilon...@...> wrote:

isn't Amber and AngularJS two things moving to opposite directions ?

Amber focusing on JS side while AngularJS on HTML side ?

well, that’s not the point.

Kick ass productivity is the point.

And easy collaboration with designers.

And snappy single page applications.

(the list is actually a bit longer, watch the first 10m of this presentation to know it <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9MHigUZKEM" target="_blank" onmousedown="this.href='http://www.youtube.com/watch?v\75i9MHigUZKEM';return true;" onclick="this.href='http://www.youtube.com/watch?v\75i9MHigUZKEM';return true;">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9MHigUZKEM)

I have no problem in going in a different direction than mainstream on the technical part as long as we can address the point

Otherwise the investment wouldn’t be as competitive

Does my question make sense?

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sebastianconcept

Re: Why Amber? (and lets say.... AngularJS)

This might add something to this conversation and to (re)discover what could our contribution to the world with this technology could be all about:

The web is a total mess, and this guy critiques templates quite right:

http://www.boronine.com/2012/09/07/Cult-Of-Logic-less-Templates/

Also this to find a powerful metaphor that could rescue us from the mess:

http://sebastianconcept.com/brandIt/in-search-of-the-right-metaphor-for-amber

Note to future self:

Meteor is actually getting the point about how to deal with that mess so you better kick your ass (or move to it)

On Saturday, March 29, 2014 12:27:25 PM UTC-3, Sebastian Sastre wrote:

Yesterday I saw this... and if you love Amber watch it completely and imagine you doing the same demo and end result on Amber in the same duration:
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbZnf9Fa8UE" target="_blank" onmousedown="this.href='https://www.youtube.com/watch?v\75MbZnf9Fa8UE';return true;" onclick="this.href='https://www.youtube.com/watch?v\75MbZnf9Fa8UE';return true;">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbZnf9Fa8UE

I kept wondering how to make a similar demo with Amber + Pharo or an Amber + node stack.

Some thoughts:

If we put aside things like
- Reactivity. Automatic refresh/invalidation of a component (re-rendering) on server side data/model chance
- Instant feedback. Smalltalk used to champion instant feedback. I'm surprised that now Meteor has it even better than Amber.
- Latency compensation

We still have many annoying productivity bumps to make the design process smoother

Bumps that will scare the hell out of 99.99% designers

The thing is, I have many chances to demo stuff like this, but I can't if does not produce a kickass effect

Can something be done about that? ideas?

On Monday, March 24, 2014 9:35:23 AM UTC-3, [hidden email] wrote:
Perfectly.

I am asking myself the same before ambarking on Amber or Angular ...

Now more into Ember.js ...but well, as you say: competitive.

Phil

On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 1:13 PM, sebastian <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Mar 24, 2014, at 5:46 AM, kilon alios <[hidden email]> wrote:

isn't Amber and AngularJS two things moving to opposite directions ?

Amber focusing on JS side while AngularJS on HTML side ?

well, that’s not the point.

Kick ass productivity is the point.

And easy collaboration with designers.

And snappy single page applications.

(the list is actually a bit longer, watch the first 10m of this presentation to know it <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9MHigUZKEM" target="_blank" onmousedown="this.href='http://www.youtube.com/watch?v\75i9MHigUZKEM';return true;" onclick="this.href='http://www.youtube.com/watch?v\75i9MHigUZKEM';return true;">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9MHigUZKEM)

I have no problem in going in a different direction than mainstream on the technical part as long as we can address the point

Otherwise the investment wouldn’t be as competitive

Does my question make sense?

--
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