Writing a book on Seaside

Hello,

I'm writing a book on Seaside. Here is the plan and some ideas:
http://www.enseirb.fr/~cassou/SeasideBook.pdf

*Please please* comment and give me advices and new ideas. I need you to
force me working on this very (too?) big project.

I would really like a book on Seaside to help the community amd make
Seaside a killer app.


Thanks
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Looks great! As a smalltalk and seaside newby (and currently lite user
- unless someone hires me for a seaside project any time soon ;) I'd
be happy to do proofing etc.

My first comments on your outline are:

In the "what problems does it solve" section, I would talk about
business model mapping as well - some how tie in a discussion of how
the problems with traditional web application development paradigns
have not only technical limitations, but also make business problem
mapping weaknesses.

In the "how to get started" section, I would suggest that either you,
or someone you can collaborate with, creates a one step installer. It
would be very easy since all you really need to do is make a
pre-prepared squeak image (with seaside, plus all your sample code)
and bundle that in with a runtime. You would also want to make it easy
to run as a daemon/service as well as in gui mode. A good idea might
be for the default image to run two servers - one being a basic
seaside install (with scriptaculous etc) and the other being the
finished product of all the examples in your book.

I think the idea of going for a whole app (the blog) first and then
discussing continutions etc. afterwards is great. Once people see the
blog working it will really help them to "get" it.

Can't wait to see more!

Cheers,

/Mark

On 7/1/06, Damien Cassou <[hidden email]> wrote:

--
Mark Aufflick
 e: [hidden email]
 w: mark.aufflick.com
 p: +61 438 700 647
 f: +61 2 9436 4737
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Mark Aufflick wrote:
> Looks great! As a smalltalk and seaside newby (and currently lite user
> - unless someone hires me for a seaside project any time soon ;) I'd
> be happy to do proofing etc.


I've planned to post here when I update the book so that everybody can
follow its evolution.


> My first comments on your outline are:
>
> In the "what problems does it solve" section, I would talk about
> business model mapping as well - some how tie in a discussion of how
> the problems with traditional web application development paradigns
> have not only technical limitations, but also make business problem
> mapping weaknesses.


What do you mean by 'model mapping' ? Are you talking about
Domain-Driven design ?


> In the "how to get started" section, I would suggest that either you,
> or someone you can collaborate with, creates a one step installer. It
> would be very easy since all you really need to do is make a
> pre-prepared squeak image (with seaside, plus all your sample code)
> and bundle that in with a runtime. You would also want to make it easy
> to run as a daemon/service as well as in gui mode. A good idea might
> be for the default image to run two servers - one being a basic
> seaside install (with scriptaculous etc) and the other being the
> finished product of all the examples in your book.


We plan to prepare an image with everything installed and ready to use
for the reader. Your comment gives new idea on what to put in the image,
thank you.


> I think the idea of going for a whole app (the blog) first and then
> discussing continutions etc. afterwards is great. Once people see the
> blog working it will really help them to "get" it.


I' trying to be as didactic as possible and I thought it was a good idea
to make things work and then explain the 'how' !



Thank you for your comments
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On 7/2/06, Damien Cassou <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> What do you mean by 'model mapping' ? Are you talking about
> Domain-Driven design ?

I was talking about the more generic issue that many software projects
get into a state where the business model simply cannot be implemented
with what the designers/developers have produced. Domain driven design
is certainly one way to avoid that outcome (probably the best way),
but any design/project methodology that is going to be successful will
always be easier to realise with an environment like
smalltalk/seaside.

> We plan to prepare an image with everything installed and ready to use
> for the reader. Your comment gives new idea on what to put in the image,
> thank you.

Great. One of the real boosts to the initial Ruby on Rails launch was
those screencasts that people could follow and have a website running
from scratch (that they coded) in only 20 minutes.

> I' trying to be as didactic as possible and I thought it was a good idea
> to make things work and then explain the 'how' !

Not only is that a good general approach, it is also the best to
showcase the advantage of an environment like smalltalk (or Ruby) over
something like a standard Java environment.

I look forward to seeing what comes next!


--
Mark Aufflick
 e: [hidden email]
 w: mark.aufflick.com
 p: +61 438 700 647
 f: +61 2 9436 4737
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Mark Aufflick wrote:
Ok, I will try to write something about this.


> I look forward to seeing what comes next!

You can always grab the last version here:
http://www.enseirb.fr/~cassou/SeasideBook.pdf
I update it everyday

Bye
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