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abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

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Fernando olivero-2

abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

Hi Ben, i was thinking about the discussion of the menus:

Since you are using menu pragma builder, and have explicit views for
each tool, then the CodeHolder hierarchy is no longer needed. Because
the specialized views get the behavior for answering the actions in
the menus (which currently is spread across the StringHolder
hierarchy).

So this is the main reason why you simple need a pluggable text model,
for the model of the views. And a pluggable TextModel (or StringHolder
in Pharo) would suffice? Is this correct?

Thanks,
Fernando

abergel

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

Hi Guys,

Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"

Cheers,
Alexandre

On 5 Apr 2011, at 08:32, Fernando Olivero wrote:

> Hi Ben, i was thinking about the discussion of the menus:
>
> Since you are using menu pragma builder, and have explicit views for
> each tool, then the CodeHolder hierarchy is no longer needed. Because
> the specialized views get the behavior for answering the actions in
> the menus (which currently is spread across the StringHolder
> hierarchy).
>
> So this is the main reason why you simple need a pluggable text model,
> for the model of the views. And a pluggable TextModel (or StringHolder
> in Pharo) would suffice? Is this correct?
>
> Thanks,
> Fernando
>

--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Stéphane Ducasse

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:

> Hi Guys,
>
> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?

A new browser :)
Supporting
- groups
- package
- declarative menus
- environment selection
- scoped actions
- soon refactoring

but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph

> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>
> Cheers,
> Alexandre

Michael Roberts-2

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?

thanks,
Mike

On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>
>> Hi Guys,
>>
>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>
> A new browser :)
> Supporting
> - groups
> - package
> - declarative menus
> - environment selection
> - scoped actions
> - soon refactoring
>
> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>
>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alexandre
>
>
>

Alain Plantec-3

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse

Le 05/04/2011 20:57, Stéphane Ducasse a écrit :

> A new browser :)
> Supporting
> - groups
> - package
> - declarative menus
> - environment selection
> - scoped actions
> - soon refactoring
>
> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph

yes, maybe MorphTreeMorph is not the good tree to use here.
why not use a simpler one ?
Alain

>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alexandre
>
>

Stéphane Ducasse

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Michael Roberts-2

It is not.
The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
hilighting....

Stef

> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>
> thanks,
> Mike
>
> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Guys,
>>>
>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>
>> A new browser :)
>> Supporting
>> - groups
>> - package
>> - declarative menus
>> - environment selection
>> - scoped actions
>> - soon refactoring
>>
>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>
>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Alexandre
>>
>>
>>
>

Alain Plantec-3

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Alain Plantec-3

Le 05/04/2011 22:03, Alain Plantec a écrit :

> Le 05/04/2011 20:57, Stéphane Ducasse a écrit :
>> A new browser :)
>> Supporting
>> - groups
>> - package
>> - declarative menus
>> - environment selection
>> - scoped actions
>> - soon refactoring
>>
>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees
>> build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
> yes, maybe MorphTreeMorph is not the good tree to use here.
> why not use a simpler one ?

or try with LazyMorphTreeMorph even it should be improved. (it should be
changed to build the list in background).

> Alain
>
>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Alexandre
>>
>>
>
>
>

Tudor Girba

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

Hi,

On 6 Apr 2011, at 08:16, Alain Plantec wrote:

> Le 05/04/2011 22:03, Alain Plantec a écrit :
>> Le 05/04/2011 20:57, Stéphane Ducasse a écrit :
>>> A new browser :)
>>> Supporting
>>> - groups
>>> - package
>>> - declarative menus
>>> - environment selection
>>> - scoped actions
>>> - soon refactoring
>>>
>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>> yes, maybe MorphTreeMorph is not the good tree to use here.
>> why not use a simpler one ?
> or try with LazyMorphTreeMorph even it should be improved. (it should be changed to build the list in background).

That would be super cool :)

Doru

>> Alain
>>
>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Alexandre
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com

"Presenting is storytelling."

Fernando olivero-2

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

what about my initial question? it got buried beneath other
discussions in this thread.
Ben, can you give your opinion ? Im interested because for the SMx
port, this would help in narrowing the classes to import.

Fernando

On Wed, Apr 6, 2011 at 9:08 AM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On 6 Apr 2011, at 08:16, Alain Plantec wrote:
>
>> Le 05/04/2011 22:03, Alain Plantec a écrit :
>>> Le 05/04/2011 20:57, Stéphane Ducasse a écrit :
>>>> A new browser :)
>>>> Supporting
>>>> - groups
>>>> - package
>>>> - declarative menus
>>>> - environment selection
>>>> - scoped actions
>>>> - soon refactoring
>>>>
>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>> yes, maybe MorphTreeMorph is not the good tree to use here.
>>> why not use a simpler one ?
>> or try with LazyMorphTreeMorph even it should be improved. (it should be changed to build the list in background).
>
> That would be super cool :)
>
> Doru
>
>
>>> Alain
>>>
>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
>
> "Presenting is storytelling."
>
>
>

abergel

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

What is SMx?

Alexandre

Le 6 avr. 2011 à 04:17, Fernando Olivero <[hidden email]> a écrit :

> what about my initial question? it got buried beneath other
> discussions in this thread.
> Ben, can you give your opinion ? Im interested because for the SMx
> port, this would help in narrowing the classes to import.
>
> Fernando
>
> On Wed, Apr 6, 2011 at 9:08 AM, Tudor Girba <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> On 6 Apr 2011, at 08:16, Alain Plantec wrote:
>>
>>> Le 05/04/2011 22:03, Alain Plantec a écrit :
>>>> Le 05/04/2011 20:57, Stéphane Ducasse a écrit :
>>>>> A new browser :)
>>>>> Supporting
>>>>> - groups
>>>>> - package
>>>>> - declarative menus
>>>>> - environment selection
>>>>> - scoped actions
>>>>> - soon refactoring
>>>>>
>>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>>> yes, maybe MorphTreeMorph is not the good tree to use here.
>>>> why not use a simpler one ?
>>> or try with LazyMorphTreeMorph even it should be improved. (it should be changed to build the list in background).
>>
>> That would be super cool :)
>>
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>>> Alain
>>>>
>>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>
>> "Presenting is storytelling."
>>
>>
>>
>

Michael Roberts-2

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse

Ok. And is the idea to build a new core debugger in this effort? I wanted to check we would only build 1 debugger model; and to know where it is. (I only see one in glamourst source).

Thanks
Mike

On 6 Apr 2011, at 07:01, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It is not.
> The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
> in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
> After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
> In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
> hilighting....
>
> Stef
>
>> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>>
>> thanks,
>> Mike
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Guys,
>>>>
>>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>>
>>> A new browser :)
>>> Supporting
>>> - groups
>>> - package
>>> - declarative menus
>>> - environment selection
>>> - scoped actions
>>> - soon refactoring
>>>
>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>>
>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Alexandre
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>

Denis Kudriashov

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse

Why omnibrowser is bad?
Is omnibrowser idea for building browsers failed?

2011/4/6 Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]>

It is not.
The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
hilighting....

Stef

> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>
> thanks,
> Mike
>
> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Guys,
>>>
>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>
>> A new browser :)
>> Supporting
>> - groups
>> - package
>> - declarative menus
>> - environment selection
>> - scoped actions
>> - soon refactoring
>>
>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>
>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Alexandre
>>
>>
>>
>

Geert Claes

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

Administrator

In reply to this post by abergel

How does one load Nautilus? I tried by adding the nautilus repository and using the ConfigurationOf on a clean 1.2 OneClick but I get a DNU readStream?

Tudor Girba

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Michael Roberts-2

Hi,

Indeed, it would be great to have a Debugger model. Toon produced one in the context of the Glamorous Toolkit. Perhaps it would be good if we merged it in the Core.

Cheers,
Doru

On 6 Apr 2011, at 12:54, Michael Roberts wrote:

> Ok. And is the idea to build a new core debugger in this effort? I wanted to check we would only build 1 debugger model; and to know where it is. (I only see one in glamourst source).
>
> Thanks
> Mike
>
> On 6 Apr 2011, at 07:01, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> It is not.
>> The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
>> in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
>> After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
>> In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
>> hilighting....
>>
>> Stef
>>
>>> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Guys,
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>>>
>>>> A new browser :)
>>>> Supporting
>>>> - groups
>>>> - package
>>>> - declarative menus
>>>> - environment selection
>>>> - scoped actions
>>>> - soon refactoring
>>>>
>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>>>
>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com

"Being happy is a matter of choice."

Stéphane Ducasse

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Tudor Girba

Because once people are dependent and drug addict then they will spend time fixing it :)

No seriously this is mega hyper hyper important that we get
- solid scalable listMorph and treeMorph
So the best way is to stress it.

The second answer is that nautilus is cool and needs tree :)

>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>> yes, maybe MorphTreeMorph is not the good tree to use here.
>>> why not use a simpler one ?
>> or try with LazyMorphTreeMorph even it should be improved. (it should be changed to build the list in background).
>
> That would be super cool :)
>
> Doru
>
>
>>> Alain
>>>
>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
>
> "Presenting is storytelling."
>
>

Stéphane Ducasse

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Michael Roberts-2

On Apr 6, 2011, at 12:54 PM, Michael Roberts wrote:

> Ok. And is the idea to build a new core debugger in this effort? I wanted to check we would only build 1 debugger model; and to know where it is. (I only see one in glamourst source).

yes we want to join forces with glamour: one model several tools.

>
> Thanks
> Mike
>
> On 6 Apr 2011, at 07:01, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> It is not.
>> The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
>> in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
>> After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
>> In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
>> hilighting....
>>
>> Stef
>>
>>> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Guys,
>>>>>
>>>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>>>
>>>> A new browser :)
>>>> Supporting
>>>> - groups
>>>> - package
>>>> - declarative menus
>>>> - environment selection
>>>> - scoped actions
>>>> - soon refactoring
>>>>
>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>>>
>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>

Stéphane Ducasse

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Tudor Girba

On Apr 6, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Tudor Girba wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Indeed, it would be great to have a Debugger model. Toon produced one in the context of the Glamorous Toolkit. Perhaps it would be good if we merged it in the Core.

As soon as it works I want that in the core :)
imagine a model not mixed with UI concerned :)
Stef

>
> Cheers,
> Doru
>
>
> On 6 Apr 2011, at 12:54, Michael Roberts wrote:
>
>> Ok. And is the idea to build a new core debugger in this effort? I wanted to check we would only build 1 debugger model; and to know where it is. (I only see one in glamourst source).
>>
>> Thanks
>> Mike
>>
>> On 6 Apr 2011, at 07:01, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> It is not.
>>> The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
>>> in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
>>> After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
>>> In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
>>> hilighting....
>>>
>>> Stef
>>>
>>>> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>>>>
>>>> thanks,
>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Guys,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>>>>
>>>>> A new browser :)
>>>>> Supporting
>>>>> - groups
>>>>> - package
>>>>> - declarative menus
>>>>> - environment selection
>>>>> - scoped actions
>>>>> - soon refactoring
>>>>>
>>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>>>>
>>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
>
> "Being happy is a matter of choice."
>
>
>
>

Geert Claes

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

Administrator

In reply to this post by Geert Claes

Geert Claes wrote

How does one load Nautilus? I tried by adding the nautilus repository and using the ConfigurationOf on a clean 1.2 OneClick but I get a DNU readStream?

Mmm, seems to be a network issue because I get the same message for other stuff :(

Stéphane Ducasse

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Fernando olivero-2

On Apr 5, 2011, at 2:32 PM, Fernando Olivero wrote:

> Hi Ben, i was thinking about the discussion of the menus:
>
> Since you are using menu pragma builder, and have explicit views for
> each tool, then the CodeHolder hierarchy is no longer needed. Because
> the specialized views get the behavior for answering the actions in
> the menus (which currently is spread across the StringHolder
> hierarchy).

I would say yes but I will let ben replied with more depth if necessary.

> So this is the main reason why you simple need a pluggable text model,
> for the model of the views. And a pluggable TextModel (or StringHolder
> in Pharo) would suffice? Is this correct?

>
> Thanks,
> Fernando
>

Tudor Girba

Re: abouth nautilus and the removal of CodeHolder hierarchy

In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse

It works.

Toon, am I wrong?

Cheers,
Doru

On 6 Apr 2011, at 13:18, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:

>
> On Apr 6, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Tudor Girba wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Indeed, it would be great to have a Debugger model. Toon produced one in the context of the Glamorous Toolkit. Perhaps it would be good if we merged it in the Core.
>
> As soon as it works I want that in the core :)
> imagine a model not mixed with UI concerned :)
> Stef
>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>> On 6 Apr 2011, at 12:54, Michael Roberts wrote:
>>
>>> Ok. And is the idea to build a new core debugger in this effort? I wanted to check we would only build 1 debugger model; and to know where it is. (I only see one in glamourst source).
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> On 6 Apr 2011, at 07:01, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> It is not.
>>>> The idea is to have a default browser and set of tools that we can use
>>>> in bare core image and that are not based on toolBuilder or stringHolder.
>>>> After if Glamour produces a nice IDE then we can load it and use it.
>>>> In addition benjamin is fixing a lot of problems in default widgets like multiple selection,
>>>> hilighting....
>>>>
>>>> Stef
>>>>
>>>>> Hi, how does it relate to glamourost?
>>>>>
>>>>> thanks,
>>>>> Mike
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Stéphane Ducasse
>>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:31 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Guys,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Maybe I missed part of the discussion, but what is Nautilus?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A new browser :)
>>>>>> Supporting
>>>>>> - groups
>>>>>> - package
>>>>>> - declarative menus
>>>>>> - environment selection
>>>>>> - scoped actions
>>>>>> - soon refactoring
>>>>>>
>>>>>> but right now a bit too slow because of the HUGGGGGGEEEEEE trees build by TreeMorphTreeMorph
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Squeaksource simply says "A new browser"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>
>> "Being happy is a matter of choice."
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

--
www.tudorgirba.com

"We are all great at making mistakes."