databases
Locked
12
12
 
|
Hi,
I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several solutions in both object and relational databases. - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ?
- Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or Python ? How ? - I want to try MySQL too. Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this stuff quite well ?
Thanks for help ! Laurent Laffont _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
Excellent idea!
Stef On Feb 17, 2010, at 7:45 AM, laurent laffont wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several solutions in both object and relational databases. > - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? > - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or Python ? How ? > - I want to try MySQL too. > Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this stuff quite well ? > > Thanks for help ! > > Laurent Laffont > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
PostgreSQL has native drivers. Take a look at Glorp, Magritte and SqueakDBX
On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 11:25 AM, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote: > Excellent idea! > > Stef > > On Feb 17, 2010, at 7:45 AM, laurent laffont wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several solutions in both object and relational databases. >> - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? >> - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or Python ? How ? >> - I want to try MySQL too. >> Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this stuff quite well ? >> >> Thanks for help ! >> >> Laurent Laffont >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by laurent laffont
2010/2/17 laurent laffont <[hidden email]> Cheers.Hi, Magma is the option I select, but not tried yet on Pharo. Germán. _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
On 2/17/10 6:46 AM, Germán Arduino wrote:
Magma 1.0v43 works on Pharo, I'm moving a production system to it (still in development but I haven't had any problems out of the normal kind caused by me mucking around). From what I've seen Magma is the only open source object database in Squeak that is still maintained and actively used. There is also GOODS, but I don't think that's being maintained (so you're on your own getting it to work). As for an object database that can be accessed from BOTH Squeak and Ruby... ? I think you might consider Gemstone/S, because their new Ruby product Maglev also runs on top of their Smalltalk runtime, but I have no idea how objects created using Smalltalk (like from GLASS) would show up in Maglev. Might be an interesting experiment!
-- Dave Woodward ................................................... www.promedmedical.net 317.332.6438 [hidden email] _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by laurent laffont
Hello Laurent,
I assume you are aware of: http://www.seaside.st/documentation/persistence Stephan _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
No :) Thanks for the link !
Laurent Laffont On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 2:23 PM, Stephan Eggermont <[hidden email]> wrote: Hello Laurent, _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
Really great informations :
Scenario’sIn different situations, there are different storage needs
Laurent Laffont On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 3:07 PM, laurent laffont <[hidden email]> wrote: No :) Thanks for the link ! _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
I didn´t know the advantages and disadvantages of Gemstone over Magma, I've found http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2009/03/09/why-glass/ with this comment:
"Denis, the most obvious difference is that magma is used from a smalltalk image (squeak, pharo,…) as a database add-on. Gemstone _is_ the database and the image you run. In gemstone even the system classes are in the image that are persistent. Some parts of gemstone oodb are built in a native language. They are optimized in more traditional way for the speed of objects acquiry. Magma is done in pure smalltalk and should therefor be really flexible in what you can do with it. From the programming side they aren’t that different. You build your object graph in both and you need to attach this graph somewhere that it doesn’t get garbage collected. In Magma you have one database root where you attach your stuff. In Gemstone you can attach things just everywhere because everything is part of the persistent things. I don’t know both that well. But Magma you can download and there you go. It is just a piece of software you load and you have a OO persistence layer. This is very good for deploying along with an image. I never tested to use magma as a server. Lately magma came up with some cool features like distributed databases, offline objects and high availability. I like to do some stuff with it. On the other hand gemstone you must deploy in more server like environment. It eats a certain amount of your memory. But you get a server that performs really well, has proven scalability, cares more about security and user based data separation. It is something fast and solid for me. With the remote debugging features it is the ideal database for my purposes so that were the reasons to choose it. I hope this helps you little bit in understanding. Magma and
gemstone are in principal the same: they are OODBS. But for me the
usage scenarios are completely different." what do you think about it? maybe you can include something of that. 2010/2/17 laurent laffont <[hidden email]> Really great informations : _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by Dave Woodward-2
On 17 Feb 2010, at 13:47, Dave Woodward wrote: > There is also GOODS, but I don't think that's being maintained (so you're on your own getting it to work). GOODS itself is still being maintained and the Squeak interface works just fine in Pharo too. We have it working in a project. ---------------------------- Johan Brichau [hidden email] _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by Dave Woodward-2
2010/2/17 Dave Woodward <[hidden email]>
Good to know. _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by Gaboto
On 2/17/10 9:44 AM, Gabriel Brunstein wrote:
I didn´t know the advantages and disadvantages of Gemstone over Magma, I've found http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2009/03/09/why-glass/ with this comment:I'm using Magma on a project where there is a central server running Seaside & Magma that is the "master" application. There are also a few users who have a one-click Seaside & Magma image running on their local machines that launches Mozilla Prism to the local Seaside using OSProcess. I'm using Magma to maintain a local read-only copy of the master that can catch itself up when online. I'm also using Gjaller-like transactions that are generated against the domain model, and later sent to the master server to be "applied" when the user comes online again. I considered using Gemstone, but the problem with Gemstone for this particular case is its "server-ness". It runs a few different processes that all do different things (the DB, the memory caches, VMs, etc.). So in my situation I couldn't have a nice "one-click" setup that could be deployed on client machines that could also handle being disconnected from the "master" database.
-- Dave Woodward ................................................... www.promedmedical.net 317.332.6438 [hidden email] _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by laurent laffont
Laurent,
you might want to have a look at SqueakSave http://www.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/hirschfeld/projects/squeaksave/index.html an object-relational (O/R) mapping framework. It looks similar to the rails ActiveRecord framework (from what I have seen so far) so it might be fine in scenarios where you absolutely want a relational database. A bit older: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5024583807516452190&hl=en# 2010/2/17 laurent laffont <[hidden email]>: > Hi, > I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several > solutions in both object and relational databases. > - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? > - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or Python ? > How ? > - I want to try MySQL too. > Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this stuff > quite well ? > Thanks for help ! > Laurent Laffont > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by garduino
Gofer new squeaksource: 'MetacelloRepository'; package: 'ConfigurationOfMagma';
load. (Smalltalk at:#ConfigurationOfMagma) project latestVersion load Fantastic ! and there's also:
ConfigurationOfGlorpDBX ConfigurationOfSQLite3 Laurent Laffont 2010/2/17 Germán Arduino <[hidden email]>
_______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by Matthias Berth-2
On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Matthias Berth
<[hidden email]> wrote: > Laurent, > > you might want to have a look at SqueakSave > > http://www.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/hirschfeld/projects/squeaksave/index.html > > an object-relational (O/R) mapping framework. It looks similar to the > rails ActiveRecord framework (from what I have seen so far) so it > might be fine in scenarios where you absolutely want a relational > database. > > A bit older: > > http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5024583807516452190&hl=en# this is a video of Seaside Persistence Options Randal Schwartz' keynote address from Smalltalk Solutions 2008 on Seaside, and Seaside persistence options I remember I saw the slides online somewhere. HTH Matthias > 2010/2/17 laurent laffont <[hidden email]>: >> Hi, >> I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several >> solutions in both object and relational databases. >> - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? >> - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or Python ? >> How ? >> - I want to try MySQL too. >> Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this stuff >> quite well ? >> Thanks for help ! >> Laurent Laffont >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by laurent laffont
Hi!
Since object databases and other databases are a dear subject to me I must reply with some "hints" :) laurent laffont wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several > solutions in both object and relational databases. > - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? Magma is in that case what you want. GOODS was mentioned, but I have not used it. We use Magma in Gjallar and while I am now leaning to try another solution it has worked quite fine, but a tad slow. Note though that the slowness can probably be fixed. > - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or > Python ? How ? Well, if this is an important aspect I would look at CouchDB or MongoDB (but so far there is no working driver for Pharo/Squeak - but Kent Beck is working on one, and I wanted to do it - but haven't had the time). These new "document databases" like CouchDB and MongoDB are quite object database-ish, and they work perfectly fine in a mixed environment and have very good Ruby/Python support. For CouchDB we have two drivers at this point, one based on Curl and one using straight SocketStream directly that Igor works on. > - I want to try MySQL too. > Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this > stuff quite well ? Not sure. SqueakSave was mentioned and I think it probably is a very interesting GLORP alternative. regards, Göran _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by garduino
All those interesting pieces of information about what works and what does not is very valuable.
Is there a means of having a place in Pharo Wiki where we could publish and update this? -- Cesar Rabak Em 17/02/2010 13:05, Germán Arduino < [hidden email] > escreveu: 2010/2/17 Dave Woodward <[hidden email]> On 2/17/10 6:46 AM, Germán Arduino wrote: 2010/2/17 laurent laffont <[hidden email]> Hi, I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several solutions in both object and relational databases. - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? Magma is the option I select, but not tried yet on Pharo. Magma 1.0v43 works on Pharo, Good to know. _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by Göran Krampe
El jue, 18-02-2010 a las 00:40 +0100, Göran Krampe escribió:
> Hi! > > Since object databases and other databases are a dear subject to me I > must reply with some "hints" :) > > laurent laffont wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several > > solutions in both object and relational databases. > > - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? > > Magma is in that case what you want. GOODS was mentioned, but I have not > used it. We use Magma in Gjallar and while I am now leaning to try > another solution it has worked quite fine, but a tad slow. Note though > that the slowness can probably be fixed. > > > - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or > > Python ? How ? > > Well, if this is an important aspect I would look at CouchDB or MongoDB > (but so far there is no working driver for Pharo/Squeak - but Kent Beck > is working on one, and I wanted to do it - but haven't had the time). > Also don't forget Cassandra, as the code to connect to cassandra from Squeak/Pharo is working again (even only through the thrift interface, as there isn't a native interface). http://incubator.apache.org/cassandra/ I made some fixes to the code and tested it in Pharo RC1. I was testing Cassandra for storage for a demo app, but I left that on the side. Nevertheless, the code worked correctly in storing and retrieving data from Cassandra. Cheers -- Miguel Cobá http://miguel.leugim.com.mx _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by Göran Krampe
Hi Göran, since this is at least the second time you've indicated
having a performance issue with Magma, I'd like to reiterate my offer of assistance. I know it takes time to evaluate other persistence options, so I would be surprised if you've already started off in another direction merely because you thought nothing could be done. Indeed, and you even indicated optimism that the slowness can probably be fixed. Given my limited knowledge of Gjaller, it seems to me that Magma should be a perfect fit for it, especially in terms of performance and scalability. My own curiousity is brimming, you are having a performance issue, there are many many opportunities for optimization, wouldn't you like to talk about it? - Chris 2010/2/17 Göran Krampe <[hidden email]>: > Hi! > > Since object databases and other databases are a dear subject to me I > must reply with some "hints" :) > > laurent laffont wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several >> solutions in both object and relational databases. >> - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? > > Magma is in that case what you want. GOODS was mentioned, but I have not > used it. We use Magma in Gjallar and while I am now leaning to try > another solution it has worked quite fine, but a tad slow. Note though > that the slowness can probably be fixed. > >> - Which object database can be accessed from Smalltalk AND Ruby or >> Python ? How ? > > Well, if this is an important aspect I would look at CouchDB or MongoDB > (but so far there is no working driver for Pharo/Squeak - but Kent Beck > is working on one, and I wanted to do it - but haven't had the time). > > These new "document databases" like CouchDB and MongoDB are quite object > database-ish, and they work perfectly fine in a mixed environment and > have very good Ruby/Python support. > > For CouchDB we have two drivers at this point, one based on Curl and one > using straight SocketStream directly that Igor works on. > >> - I want to try MySQL too. >> Is there up to date small applications on squeaksource which show this >> stuff quite well ? > > Not sure. SqueakSave was mentioned and I think it probably is a very > interesting GLORP alternative. > > regards, Göran > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
|
|
In reply to this post by csrabak
On Feb 18, 2010, at 00:43 , [hidden email] wrote:
> All those interesting pieces of information about what works and what does not is very valuable. > > Is there a means of having a place in Pharo Wiki where we could publish and update this? Yes, sure. Please add a page to the wiki http://code.google.com/p/pharo/w/list (if you don't have access, please send me the mail address of your google account). Some of the mentioned DB clients are also listed here: http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/PackagesTestedInPharo Cheers, Adrian > > -- > Cesar Rabak > > > Em 17/02/2010 13:05, Germán Arduino < [hidden email] > escreveu: > > > > 2010/2/17 Dave Woodward <[hidden email]> > > > > > On 2/17/10 6:46 AM, Germán Arduino wrote: > > > > 2010/2/17 laurent laffont <[hidden email]> > > Hi, > > I would like to learn on Pharo + databases. I've seen there's several solutions in both object and relational databases. > - Which (open source) object database should I start with (most used) ? > > > > Magma is the option I select, but not tried yet on Pharo. > > > > > Magma 1.0v43 works on Pharo, > > > > Good to know. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project |
«
Return to Pharo Smalltalk Developers
|
1 view|%1 views
| Free forum by Nabble | Edit this page |