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discord channel request

Ben Coman
Could we have additional channels: 

  #welcome - which would be the generally advertised invite URL.  A read-only channel that informs about community rules and summaries available channels etc (maybe including hidden channels and who to ask for invite)

  #help - To be referenced from in-Image Help Browser. Maybe later have an in-Image chat tool that connects to this channel.  How cool would it be to have live help from within the IDE?
 
  #mooc - So people can maybe look back through history before asking questions, and also people further along might help others less advanced ==> more participation

cheers -ben
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Re: discord channel request

kilon.alios
#welcome is not necessary there is already a bot in place that provides a welcome message and displays a command for help for newcomers

#help is not necessary too, Discord has a search capability which could be potentially used from inside a Pharo image but again the question is who is going to do this

#mooc , I am not against this idea but again we had a student yesterday asking for help that is following Mooc , I had no problem providing it and he had not issues with the process of getting his question aswered in #general channel. If he asked at #mooc I would have missed it because I am not going to keep a mind in all channels. 

For general questions I would prefer , even if they are mooc related , to be at #general channel, lets not fragment our discussions for little justification, but for very mooc discusions, like where to find a specific teach or reports of errors in mooc it makes sense to have a mooc channel.

My policy is to point an admin for each channel , channel admis are diffirent than us general admins, we have full power they can only

1)manage message in a specific channel
2) manage webhooks (for example github commits or rss feeds)
3) create instant invites

so if there is one person that is willing to become a mooc admin i will create the channel and add his as admin

On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 5:33 AM Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
Could we have additional channels: 

  #welcome - which would be the generally advertised invite URL.  A read-only channel that informs about community rules and summaries available channels etc (maybe including hidden channels and who to ask for invite)

  #help - To be referenced from in-Image Help Browser. Maybe later have an in-Image chat tool that connects to this channel.  How cool would it be to have live help from within the IDE?
 
  #mooc - So people can maybe look back through history before asking questions, and also people further along might help others less advanced ==> more participation

cheers -ben
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Re: discord channel request

Juraj Kubelka-2
Hi,

El 09-04-2017, a las 09:09, Dimitris Chloupis <[hidden email]> escribió:

#welcome is not necessary there is already a bot in place that provides a welcome message and displays a command for help for newcomers

#help is not necessary too, Discord has a search capability which could be potentially used from inside a Pharo image but again the question is who is going to do this

I like the idea. What is necessary to make it work? Can you describe a bit more in detail the use case and required infrastructure? Do we have any code I could reuse?

Juraj


#mooc , I am not against this idea but again we had a student yesterday asking for help that is following Mooc , I had no problem providing it and he had not issues with the process of getting his question aswered in #general channel. If he asked at #mooc I would have missed it because I am not going to keep a mind in all channels. 

For general questions I would prefer , even if they are mooc related , to be at #general channel, lets not fragment our discussions for little justification, but for very mooc discusions, like where to find a specific teach or reports of errors in mooc it makes sense to have a mooc channel.

My policy is to point an admin for each channel , channel admis are diffirent than us general admins, we have full power they can only

1)manage message in a specific channel
2) manage webhooks (for example github commits or rss feeds)
3) create instant invites

so if there is one person that is willing to become a mooc admin i will create the channel and add his as admin

On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 5:33 AM Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
Could we have additional channels: 

  #welcome - which would be the generally advertised invite URL.  A read-only channel that informs about community rules and summaries available channels etc (maybe including hidden channels and who to ask for invite)

  #help - To be referenced from in-Image Help Browser. Maybe later have an in-Image chat tool that connects to this channel.  How cool would it be to have live help from within the IDE?
 
  #mooc - So people can maybe look back through history before asking questions, and also people further along might help others less advanced ==> more participation

cheers -ben
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Re: discord channel request

Ben Coman
In reply to this post by kilon.alios
On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 8:09 PM, Dimitris Chloupis <[hidden email]> wrote:
> #welcome is not necessary there is already a bot in place that provides a
> welcome message and displays a command for help for newcomers

There have been some requests to remove the bot.
But I see that you've responded to feedback to tune its behaviour,
so I'm happy to wait to see how that panes out.
But oh! the irony...

   jecisc-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   Can you delete this level thing with the bot please?(edited)

   Mee6BOT-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   GG @jecisc, you just advanced to level 3 !


btw, where is the bot hosted?


> #help is not necessary too, Discord has a search capability which could be
> potentially used from inside a Pharo image but again the question is who is
> going to do this

Its not just about searchability.  Its a social barrier thing.
If the regulars are rolling through some deep discussion,
a newcomer may hesitate to jump in with a side topic.

If you want to condense channels, then probably the #mooc and #help
could be rolled into one.

cheers -ben

>
> #mooc , I am not against this idea but again we had a student yesterday
> asking for help that is following Mooc , I had no problem providing it and
> he had not issues with the process of getting his question aswered in
> #general channel. If he asked at #mooc I would have missed it because I am
> not going to keep a mind in all channels.
>
> For general questions I would prefer , even if they are mooc related , to be
> at #general channel, lets not fragment our discussions for little
> justification,
> but for very mooc discusions, like where to find a specific
> teach or reports of errors in mooc it makes sense to have a mooc channel.
>
> My policy is to point an admin for each channel , channel admis are
> different than us general admins, we have full power they can only
>
> 1)manage message in a specific channel
> 2) manage webhooks (for example github commits or rss feeds)
> 3) create instant invites
>
> so if there is one person that is willing to become a mooc admin i will
> create the channel and add his as admin
>
> On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 5:33 AM Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Could we have additional channels:
>>
>>   #welcome - which would be the generally advertised invite URL.  A
>> read-only channel that informs about community rules and summaries available
>> channels etc (maybe including hidden channels and who to ask for invite)
>>
>>   #help - To be referenced from in-Image Help Browser. Maybe later have an
>> in-Image chat tool that connects to this channel.  How cool would it be to
>> have live help from within the IDE?
>>
>>   #mooc - So people can maybe look back through history before asking
>> questions, and also people further along might help others less advanced ==>
>> more participation
>>
>> cheers -ben

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Re: discord channel request

kilon.alios
"I like the idea. What is necessary to make it work? Can you describe a bit more in detail the use case and required infrastructure? Do we have any code I could reuse?"

Hey there , Discord has a web API that can be found here

https://discordapp.com/developers/docs/intro

There are wrappers of the API for several languages, I use wrappers for Python that can be found here

https://github.com/Rapptz/discord.py

to make a bot that can be found

https://github.com/kilon/lighthouse

A bot is basically a bit like a client because a bot has to get info about the messages , the members etc.

You can use my Atlas project to use the python discord api from inside pharo, this way you avoid a full rewrite of a wrapper and you have access to a ton of python code, including my bot

"There have been some requests to remove the bot.
But I see that you've responded to feedback to tune its behaviour,
so I'm happy to wait to see how that panes out.
But oh! the irony...

   jecisc-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   Can you delete this level thing with the bot please?(edited)

   Mee6BOT-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   GG @jecisc, you just advanced to level 3 !"

Mee6 is the name of the bot, its one of the most popular for Discord. I have it temporary , my bot which called Lighthouse can completely replace it at some point I am just waiting to see the needs of the community and of course the time I can invest on this.

I started it the bot because Esteban wanted to move to Discord then I gave up on it because it was clear people wanted to stick with Slack. Then Esteban brought the subject of a complete migration to Discord so I am on standby to improve the bot if people start joining in.

The level thing message was indeed annoying .

"Its not just about searchability.  Its a social barrier thing.
If the regulars are rolling through some deep discussion,
a newcomer may hesitate to jump in with a side topic.

If you want to condense channels, then probably the #mooc and #help
could be rolled into one.

cheers -ben"

I want beginners to feel comfortable with experienced Pharo coders , I do not want to accommodate their fears and insecurities. Many people when they join a community they feel like outsiders fools that waste other people's time. Its important to make them see we are one big family that see beyond experience and we all just here because we love Pharo and not because we have something to prove.

For me this extremely crucial , facing this fear and stereotype, thus I am not in favor of any kind of "help" channel, mailing lists etc.

BUT in the end I am not a dictator I am just here to help the community , if the community wants a #help channel that is what it will get but again I will need an #admin that will be there to help the newcomers and preferably more than one. I want admis on each channel because in the end it needs the cooperation of many to create a great community.

For me admin is a lot more about making people feel comfortable than deleting posts and banning people.

By the way you are already an admin for all channels , you can create new ones if you want. You do not need my permission to do so.

Anyone who is serious about helping out and wants to become admin, join and drop me a message.


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Re: discord channel request

kilon.alios
I forgot to add that yes Mee6 is hosted on its own server and I also created a Heroku account to host my own bot there. Heroku allows to host python apps (including web apps) for free and supports other languages too.

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Re: discord channel request

Stephane Ducasse-3
In reply to this post by Ben Coman
About the mooc and the social barrier I agree. 
We should make sure that shy people ask questions. 

On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 7:45 PM, Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 8:09 PM, Dimitris Chloupis <[hidden email]> wrote:
> #welcome is not necessary there is already a bot in place that provides a
> welcome message and displays a command for help for newcomers

There have been some requests to remove the bot.
But I see that you've responded to feedback to tune its behaviour,
so I'm happy to wait to see how that panes out.
But oh! the irony...

   jecisc-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   Can you delete this level thing with the bot please?(edited)

   Mee6BOT-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   GG @jecisc, you just advanced to level 3 !


btw, where is the bot hosted?


> #help is not necessary too, Discord has a search capability which could be
> potentially used from inside a Pharo image but again the question is who is
> going to do this

Its not just about searchability.  Its a social barrier thing.
If the regulars are rolling through some deep discussion,
a newcomer may hesitate to jump in with a side topic.

If you want to condense channels, then probably the #mooc and #help
could be rolled into one.

cheers -ben

>
> #mooc , I am not against this idea but again we had a student yesterday
> asking for help that is following Mooc , I had no problem providing it and
> he had not issues with the process of getting his question aswered in
> #general channel. If he asked at #mooc I would have missed it because I am
> not going to keep a mind in all channels.
>
> For general questions I would prefer , even if they are mooc related , to be
> at #general channel, lets not fragment our discussions for little
> justification,
> but for very mooc discusions, like where to find a specific
> teach or reports of errors in mooc it makes sense to have a mooc channel.
>
> My policy is to point an admin for each channel , channel admis are
> different than us general admins, we have full power they can only
>
> 1)manage message in a specific channel
> 2) manage webhooks (for example github commits or rss feeds)
> 3) create instant invites
>
> so if there is one person that is willing to become a mooc admin i will
> create the channel and add his as admin
>
> On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 5:33 AM Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Could we have additional channels:
>>
>>   #welcome - which would be the generally advertised invite URL.  A
>> read-only channel that informs about community rules and summaries available
>> channels etc (maybe including hidden channels and who to ask for invite)
>>
>>   #help - To be referenced from in-Image Help Browser. Maybe later have an
>> in-Image chat tool that connects to this channel.  How cool would it be to
>> have live help from within the IDE?
>>
>>   #mooc - So people can maybe look back through history before asking
>> questions, and also people further along might help others less advanced ==>
>> more participation
>>
>> cheers -ben


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Re: discord channel request

kilon.alios
+1

On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 9:50 PM Stephane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:
About the mooc and the social barrier I agree. 
We should make sure that shy people ask questions. 

On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 7:45 PM, Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 8:09 PM, Dimitris Chloupis <[hidden email]> wrote:
> #welcome is not necessary there is already a bot in place that provides a
> welcome message and displays a command for help for newcomers

There have been some requests to remove the bot.
But I see that you've responded to feedback to tune its behaviour,
so I'm happy to wait to see how that panes out.
But oh! the irony...

   jecisc-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   Can you delete this level thing with the bot please?(edited)

   Mee6BOT-Yesterday at 8:16 PM
   GG @jecisc, you just advanced to level 3 !


btw, where is the bot hosted?


> #help is not necessary too, Discord has a search capability which could be
> potentially used from inside a Pharo image but again the question is who is
> going to do this

Its not just about searchability.  Its a social barrier thing.
If the regulars are rolling through some deep discussion,
a newcomer may hesitate to jump in with a side topic.

If you want to condense channels, then probably the #mooc and #help
could be rolled into one.

cheers -ben

>
> #mooc , I am not against this idea but again we had a student yesterday
> asking for help that is following Mooc , I had no problem providing it and
> he had not issues with the process of getting his question aswered in
> #general channel. If he asked at #mooc I would have missed it because I am
> not going to keep a mind in all channels.
>
> For general questions I would prefer , even if they are mooc related , to be
> at #general channel, lets not fragment our discussions for little
> justification,
> but for very mooc discusions, like where to find a specific
> teach or reports of errors in mooc it makes sense to have a mooc channel.
>
> My policy is to point an admin for each channel , channel admis are
> different than us general admins, we have full power they can only
>
> 1)manage message in a specific channel
> 2) manage webhooks (for example github commits or rss feeds)
> 3) create instant invites
>
> so if there is one person that is willing to become a mooc admin i will
> create the channel and add his as admin
>
> On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 5:33 AM Ben Coman <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Could we have additional channels:
>>
>>   #welcome - which would be the generally advertised invite URL.  A
>> read-only channel that informs about community rules and summaries available
>> channels etc (maybe including hidden channels and who to ask for invite)
>>
>>   #help - To be referenced from in-Image Help Browser. Maybe later have an
>> in-Image chat tool that connects to this channel.  How cool would it be to
>> have live help from within the IDE?
>>
>>   #mooc - So people can maybe look back through history before asking
>> questions, and also people further along might help others less advanced ==>
>> more participation
>>
>> cheers -ben


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