how much introduction?
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i am currently going through the "squeak by example" doc... it's really good and clear, btw.. anyway.. i am learning squeak pretty much for the sole purpose of learning seaside.. although i am having some ideas for squeak apps.. sooo, my question is.. will doing through this doc provide me with enough background to start developing in squeak? i am not new to programming, web design, web frameworks, or any of that.. just new to squeak.. thanks! ___ peace, sergio photographer, journalist, visionary www.village-buzz.com _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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Yeah, that's an excellent start into Smalltalk, the library and
development tools. You might want to skip the chapter on Morphic. That's probably not really relevant for you. Cheers, Lukas On 10/24/08, sergio <[hidden email]> wrote: > > i am currently going through the "squeak by example" doc... it's > really good and clear, btw.. > > anyway.. > > i am learning squeak pretty much for the sole purpose of learning > seaside.. although i am having some ideas for squeak apps.. > > sooo, my question is.. > > will doing through this doc provide me with enough background to start > developing in squeak? > > i am not new to programming, web design, web frameworks, or any of > that.. just new to squeak.. > > thanks! > > > ___ > peace, > sergio > photographer, journalist, visionary > www.village-buzz.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > -- Lukas Renggli http://www.lukas-renggli.ch _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by sergio t. ruiz
Hi sergio
when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest you to take the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and cleaner. http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ Stef On Oct 24, 2008, at 5:03 PM, sergio wrote: > > i am currently going through the "squeak by example" doc... it's > really good and clear, btw.. > > anyway.. > > i am learning squeak pretty much for the sole purpose of learning > seaside.. although i am having some ideas for squeak apps.. > > sooo, my question is.. > > will doing through this doc provide me with enough background to > start developing in squeak? > > i am not new to programming, web design, web frameworks, or any of > that.. just new to squeak.. > > thanks! > > > ___ > peace, > sergio > photographer, journalist, visionary > www.village-buzz.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
Re: how much introduction?
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2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>:
> Hi sergio > > when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest you to > take > the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and cleaner. > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face and OmniBrowser not working. Cheers Philippe _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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hi philippe
>> I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad > experiences with Pharo. You don't :( > Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face > and OmniBrowser not working. Which explosion we did not hear anything :)? the problem related to the fact that some people use uppercase for class **instance** variables and that a change (that now is fixed) was punishing them for that. So it was not exploding in your face. Omnibrowser... come one david is improving it everyday. Do not use not even alpha version software if you are ready to complain :). Now you know like me that that lukas is developing seaside 2.9. And when I see what we already fixed and removed.... Stef _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by Philippe Marschall
Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be
free of bugs. We are making a lot of progress, so sometimes a change breaks some unexpected functionality. Usually, though, this is fixed within few days. We will soon go to beta and then produce a release that is going to be maintained. That's where you can expect stability. Adrian On Oct 27, 2008, at 17:25 , Philippe Marschall wrote: > 2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>: >> Hi sergio >> >> when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest >> you to >> take >> the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and >> cleaner. >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ > > I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad > experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face > and OmniBrowser not working. > > Cheers > Philippe > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by sergio t. ruiz
I think the real point Philippe made is a good one. It is not good for the Squeak/Smalltalk community to point a new user to an alpha product. The new user should be pointed to a stable functional platform so they can concentrate on learning the language not the platform bugs.
Philippe's example of breakage was an example for why Pharo might not be good for Sergio. As an additional example, I was using Pharo the other day and while testing one of my models, I discovered #timesRepeat: was broken. Imagine Sergio running some simple sample code loops and getting the wrong answer. What is that going to do to his newly forming opinion of Squeak? Again, these are not criticisms of Pharo, simply reasons why Pharo might not be the right tool for a beginning Squeak/Seaside user. Taun ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adrian Lienhard" <[hidden email]> To: "Seaside - general discussion" <[hidden email]> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 12:45:32 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be free of bugs. We are making a lot of progress, so sometimes a change breaks some unexpected functionality. Usually, though, this is fixed within few days. We will soon go to beta and then produce a release that is going to be maintained. That's where you can expect stability. Adrian On Oct 27, 2008, at 17:25 , Philippe Marschall wrote: > 2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>: >> Hi sergio >> >> when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest >> you to >> take >> the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and >> cleaner. >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ > > I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad > experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face > and OmniBrowser not working. > > Cheers > Philippe > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
Re: how much introduction?
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In reply to this post by Adrian Lienhard
2008/10/27 Adrian Lienhard <[hidden email]>:
> Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be free of > bugs. Fair enough, but then you should suggest to people to use it without this disclaimer on this list. Cheers Philippe _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by Mail Lists-2
On Oct 29, 2008, at 3:17 PM, Taun wrote: > I think the real point Philippe made is a good one. It is not good > for the Squeak/Smalltalk community to point a new user to an alpha > product. The new user should be pointed to a stable functional > platform so they can concentrate on learning the language not the > platform bugs. Come on we are a good group of people using pharo daily and it has less bugs than squeak. I know since I harvested the fixes. > Philippe's example of breakage was an example for why Pharo might > not be good for Sergio. I think that this is not true. Do you think that a newcomer is not overhlem by the squeak menu! > As an additional example, I was using Pharo the other day and while > testing one of my models, I discovered #timesRepeat: was broken. I would be really amazed that timesRepeat: would be broken in pharo. Can you tell us, which version and how to reproduce that? > Imagine Sergio running some simple sample code loops and getting the > wrong answer. What is that going to do to his newly forming opinion > of Squeak? > > Again, these are not criticisms of Pharo, simply reasons why Pharo > might not be the right tool for a beginning Squeak/Seaside user. I would argue the inverse: Take soon the one click image with the new browser of david and the clean menu. Pharo will have much more tests than any squeak distro. Pharo contains far less broken code than 3.9 or 3.10. After the point is that we are working on it so when you update you can get some glitches. But even with that I think that this is better than 3.9. Stef > > > Taun > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Adrian Lienhard" <[hidden email]> > To: "Seaside - general discussion" > <[hidden email]> > Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 12:45:32 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada > Eastern > Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? > > Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be > free of bugs. We are making a lot of progress, so sometimes a change > breaks some unexpected functionality. Usually, though, this is fixed > within few days. We will soon go to beta and then produce a release > that is going to be maintained. That's where you can expect stability. > > Adrian > > On Oct 27, 2008, at 17:25 , Philippe Marschall wrote: > >> 2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>: >>> Hi sergio >>> >>> when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest >>> you to >>> take >>> the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and >>> cleaner. >>> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ >> >> I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad >> experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face >> and OmniBrowser not working. >> >> Cheers >> Philippe >> _______________________________________________ >> seaside mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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I agree with Stef,
I moved my production code to Pharo last month and I've had no issue reports. I've loaded Seaside, MySql, and my own code. On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 7:36 AM, stephane ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote: > > On Oct 29, 2008, at 3:17 PM, Taun wrote: > >> I think the real point Philippe made is a good one. It is not good for the >> Squeak/Smalltalk community to point a new user to an alpha product. The new >> user should be pointed to a stable functional platform so they can >> concentrate on learning the language not the platform bugs. > > Come on we are a good group of people using pharo daily and it has less bugs > than squeak. > I know since I harvested the fixes. > >> Philippe's example of breakage was an example for why Pharo might not be >> good for Sergio. > > I think that this is not true. > Do you think that a newcomer is not overhlem by the squeak menu! > > >> As an additional example, I was using Pharo the other day and while >> testing one of my models, I discovered #timesRepeat: was broken. > > I would be really amazed that timesRepeat: would be broken in pharo. > Can you tell us, which version and how to reproduce that? > > >> Imagine Sergio running some simple sample code loops and getting the wrong >> answer. What is that going to do to his newly forming opinion of Squeak? >> >> Again, these are not criticisms of Pharo, simply reasons why Pharo might >> not be the right tool for a beginning Squeak/Seaside user. > > I would argue the inverse: Take soon the one click image with the new > browser of david and the clean menu. > Pharo will have much more tests than any squeak distro. > Pharo contains far less broken code than 3.9 or 3.10. > > After the point is that we are working on it so when you update you can get > some glitches. > But even with that I think that this is better than 3.9. > > Stef > >> >> >> Taun >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Adrian Lienhard" <[hidden email]> >> To: "Seaside - general discussion" <[hidden email]> >> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 12:45:32 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >> Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? >> >> Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be >> free of bugs. We are making a lot of progress, so sometimes a change >> breaks some unexpected functionality. Usually, though, this is fixed >> within few days. We will soon go to beta and then produce a release >> that is going to be maintained. That's where you can expect stability. >> >> Adrian >> >> On Oct 27, 2008, at 17:25 , Philippe Marschall wrote: >> >>> 2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>: >>>> >>>> Hi sergio >>>> >>>> when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest >>>> you to >>>> take >>>> the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and >>>> cleaner. >>>> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ >>> >>> I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad >>> experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face >>> and OmniBrowser not working. >>> >>> Cheers >>> Philippe >>> _______________________________________________ >>> seaside mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> >> _______________________________________________ >> seaside mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> _______________________________________________ >> seaside mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> > > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by sergio t. ruiz
Having not done a survey, I can only talk from my personal experience. So far my personal experience is I have had about the same number of issues in 2 weeks of using Pharo as in 2 years with Squeak 3.9 and 3.10.
In Pharo, some OmniBrowser functionality was broken and as I said timesRepeat: was broken. It had a '<' rather than '<=' for the loop comparison so the loop ran one too few times. I ran an update which fixed both problems. However the update also changed the World menu and eliminated the flaps (I like the new menu and the flaps were redundant). As someone who has used SmallTalk for over 20 years and someone who hopefully understands why Pharo is so dynamic at the moment, I can live with the issues mentioned previously. When I debugged my loop, got to the timesRepeat: method and saw the test condition, it was obvious what was wrong. I then performed an update in the hope that someone had already fixed the problem. They had. I wanted to try out SmallFaces. I loaded and started to test SmallFaces in the latest Pharo image. The code broke. It turns out Pharo's Color class was missing #hex:. A method in the 3.9 and 3.10 images and used by SmallFaces. Again, a minor item to fix, but not if you are new to SmallTalk and Squeak/Pharo. Before recommending the current version of Pharo to a new SmallTalker, I think one really needs to ask oneself how they would react if while feeling lost trying to learn a new language and environment, the menus for the environment suddenly changed after an update. Or their potential confusion when the environment doesn't match all the existing tutorials. I once worked at a company where we were growing so fast, every day I went to work, the office walls had moved. I started to have dreams about falling asleep at my desk and waking up to find my office door replaced by a wall. The growth was exciting because it was a sign of our success but it definitely made life difficult for new employees. This is Pharo at the moment. > I would argue the inverse: Take soon the one click image with the new > browser of david and the clean menu. Yes, when it is released and stable it would be better. But it is neither at present. Taun ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Mitchell" <[hidden email]> To: "Seaside - general discussion" <[hidden email]> Sent: Friday, October 31, 2008 9:34:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? I agree with Stef, I moved my production code to Pharo last month and I've had no issue reports. I've loaded Seaside, MySql, and my own code. On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 7:36 AM, stephane ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote: > > On Oct 29, 2008, at 3:17 PM, Taun wrote: > >> I think the real point Philippe made is a good one. It is not good for the >> Squeak/Smalltalk community to point a new user to an alpha product. The new >> user should be pointed to a stable functional platform so they can >> concentrate on learning the language not the platform bugs. > > Come on we are a good group of people using pharo daily and it has less bugs > than squeak. > I know since I harvested the fixes. > >> Philippe's example of breakage was an example for why Pharo might not be >> good for Sergio. > > I think that this is not true. > Do you think that a newcomer is not overhlem by the squeak menu! > > >> As an additional example, I was using Pharo the other day and while >> testing one of my models, I discovered #timesRepeat: was broken. > > I would be really amazed that timesRepeat: would be broken in pharo. > Can you tell us, which version and how to reproduce that? > > >> Imagine Sergio running some simple sample code loops and getting the wrong >> answer. What is that going to do to his newly forming opinion of Squeak? >> >> Again, these are not criticisms of Pharo, simply reasons why Pharo might >> not be the right tool for a beginning Squeak/Seaside user. > > I would argue the inverse: Take soon the one click image with the new > browser of david and the clean menu. > Pharo will have much more tests than any squeak distro. > Pharo contains far less broken code than 3.9 or 3.10. > > After the point is that we are working on it so when you update you can get > some glitches. > But even with that I think that this is better than 3.9. > > Stef > >> >> >> Taun >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Adrian Lienhard" <[hidden email]> >> To: "Seaside - general discussion" <[hidden email]> >> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 12:45:32 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern >> Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? >> >> Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be >> free of bugs. We are making a lot of progress, so sometimes a change >> breaks some unexpected functionality. Usually, though, this is fixed >> within few days. We will soon go to beta and then produce a release >> that is going to be maintained. That's where you can expect stability. >> >> Adrian >> >> On Oct 27, 2008, at 17:25 , Philippe Marschall wrote: >> >>> 2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>: >>>> >>>> Hi sergio >>>> >>>> when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest >>>> you to >>>> take >>>> the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and >>>> cleaner. >>>> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ >>> >>> I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad >>> experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my face >>> and OmniBrowser not working. >>> >>> Cheers >>> Philippe >>> _______________________________________________ >>> seaside mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> >> _______________________________________________ >> seaside mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> _______________________________________________ >> seaside mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> > > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by David Mitchell-10
David
> I agree with Stef, > > I moved my production code to Pharo last month and I've had no issue > reports. do not put that pressure on us, like that :) We are doing our best and we are really looking forward to release a version (probably in february after one month of beta phase) because it will let people using a stable version and us working nicely with less pressure. Curving etoy is often a challenge. We may update and produce Pharo by Example for newcomers and it will be easier for newcomers. > I've loaded Seaside, MySql, and my own code. Please let us know if you get issues. Note that one of a real challenge is how to realise our long term goal which is also how to improve Smalltalk (first class instance variables,...) without falling in only experimental system - we want some of the pressure :) Stef _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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In reply to this post by Mail Lists-2
On Nov 1, 2008, at 5:56 AM, [hidden email] wrote: > Having not done a survey, I can only talk from my personal > experience. So far my personal experience is I have had about the > same number of issues in 2 weeks of using Pharo as in 2 years with > Squeak 3.9 and 3.10. > > In Pharo, some OmniBrowser functionality was broken and as I said > timesRepeat: was broken. It had a '<' rather than '<=' for the loop > comparison so the loop ran one too few times. I ran an update which > fixed both problems. However the update also changed the World menu > and eliminated the flaps (I like the new menu and the flaps were > redundant). As someone who has used SmallTalk for over 20 years and > someone who hopefully understands why Pharo is so dynamic at the > moment, I can live with the issues mentioned previously. When I > debugged my loop, got to the timesRepeat: method and saw the test > condition, it was obvious what was wrong. This is strange since I did not recall a change at that level. > I then performed an update in the hope that someone had already > fixed the problem. They had. I wanted to try out SmallFaces. I > loaded and started to test SmallFaces in the latest Pharo image. The > code broke. It turns out Pharo's Color class was missing #hex:. A > method in the 3.9 This is strange since we started from 3.9 > and 3.10 images and used by SmallFaces. Again, a minor item to fix, > but not if you are new to SmallTalk and Squeak/Pharo. I agree pharo is probably changing too fast for a new comers. I should have say: 'Sergio if you hate the long menus of squeak have a look at pharo. If one day you start to look at squeak and start to think that there are some really bad smell like core behavior depending on UI, then have a look at pharo' Note please report to us any problem you get for running your applications. > Before recommending the current version of Pharo to a new > SmallTalker, I think one really needs to ask oneself how they would > react if while feeling lost trying to learn a new language and > environment, the menus for the environment suddenly changed after an > update. Or their potential confusion when the environment doesn't > match all the existing tutorials. I agree. BTW: this is Smalltalk and not SmallTalk > I once worked at a company where we were growing so fast, every day > I went to work, the office walls had moved. I started to have dreams > about falling asleep at my desk and waking up to find my office door > replaced by a wall. The growth was exciting because it was a sign of > our success but it definitely made life difficult for new employees. > This is Pharo at the moment. :) Good.! > > >> I would argue the inverse: Take soon the one click image with the new >> browser of david and the clean menu. > > Yes, when it is released and stable it would be better. But it is > neither at present. It depends what you call stable :) > > > Taun > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "David Mitchell" <[hidden email]> > To: "Seaside - general discussion" > <[hidden email]> > Sent: Friday, October 31, 2008 9:34:23 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? > > I agree with Stef, > > I moved my production code to Pharo last month and I've had no issue > reports. > > I've loaded Seaside, MySql, and my own code. > > > On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 7:36 AM, stephane ducasse > <[hidden email]> wrote: >> >> On Oct 29, 2008, at 3:17 PM, Taun wrote: >> >>> I think the real point Philippe made is a good one. It is not good >>> for the >>> Squeak/Smalltalk community to point a new user to an alpha >>> product. The new >>> user should be pointed to a stable functional platform so they can >>> concentrate on learning the language not the platform bugs. >> >> Come on we are a good group of people using pharo daily and it has >> less bugs >> than squeak. >> I know since I harvested the fixes. >> >>> Philippe's example of breakage was an example for why Pharo might >>> not be >>> good for Sergio. >> >> I think that this is not true. >> Do you think that a newcomer is not overhlem by the squeak menu! >> >> >>> As an additional example, I was using Pharo the other day and while >>> testing one of my models, I discovered #timesRepeat: was broken. >> >> I would be really amazed that timesRepeat: would be broken in pharo. >> Can you tell us, which version and how to reproduce that? >> >> >>> Imagine Sergio running some simple sample code loops and getting >>> the wrong >>> answer. What is that going to do to his newly forming opinion of >>> Squeak? >>> >>> Again, these are not criticisms of Pharo, simply reasons why Pharo >>> might >>> not be the right tool for a beginning Squeak/Seaside user. >> >> I would argue the inverse: Take soon the one click image with the new >> browser of david and the clean menu. >> Pharo will have much more tests than any squeak distro. >> Pharo contains far less broken code than 3.9 or 3.10. >> >> After the point is that we are working on it so when you update you >> can get >> some glitches. >> But even with that I think that this is better than 3.9. >> >> Stef >> >>> >>> >>> Taun >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Adrian Lienhard" <[hidden email]> >>> To: "Seaside - general discussion" <[hidden email] >>> > >>> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 12:45:32 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada >>> Eastern >>> Subject: Re: [Seaside] how much introduction? >>> >>> Pharo currently is in alpha, so its surprising you expect it to be >>> free of bugs. We are making a lot of progress, so sometimes a change >>> breaks some unexpected functionality. Usually, though, this is fixed >>> within few days. We will soon go to beta and then produce a release >>> that is going to be maintained. That's where you can expect >>> stability. >>> >>> Adrian >>> >>> On Oct 27, 2008, at 17:25 , Philippe Marschall wrote: >>> >>>> 2008/10/27 stephane ducasse <[hidden email]>: >>>>> >>>>> Hi sergio >>>>> >>>>> when you will be fit on the syntax and the environment. I suggest >>>>> you to >>>>> take >>>>> the pharo image since it is really starting to get cleaner and >>>>> cleaner. >>>>> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/ >>>> >>>> I don't want to bash any of you but I have had some really bad >>>> experiences with Pharo. Stuff like ClassBuilder exploding in my >>>> face >>>> and OmniBrowser not working. >>>> >>>> Cheers >>>> Philippe >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> seaside mailing list >>>> [hidden email] >>>> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> seaside mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >>> _______________________________________________ >>> seaside mailing list >>> [hidden email] >>> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> seaside mailing list >> [hidden email] >> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside >> > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > _______________________________________________ seaside mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside |
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