misconception addendum :)

Previous Topic Next Topic
 
classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
4 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

misconception addendum :)

Stéphane Ducasse
Hi

this night I was thinking about a frequent misconception about pharo.
It is easy to think that pharo wants just plain good engineering to open
grey window. Pharo really wants to be innovative and this at all level.
We want better/faster/leaner and more powerful code at all level: UI, network...

I heard that some people think that we are against MVC but we are not
We are against isMorphic ifTrue: ifFalse:. Pharo does not have to be in
the seaside niche and it will not be. But if this makes the life easier to some
perfect. Now pharoers do not have to either pick web or the rest.
We want to make sure that if someone wants to build an alternative
windowing system he can do it easily. (BTW alain showed to us
some fun and powerful sketches of using cairo (via rome) to have multiple
windowing skeleton.)
Now we certainly do not have the knowledge for everything but this
is not by a lack of vision. So if you want to build this future don't
get us wrong.

Stef

PS: I still have in mind the vision of Smalltalk by dan: a system that a simple
person could understand (for me it means beauty, documentation and elegance
of the solutions).


_______________________________________________
Pharo-project mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: misconception addendum :)

cedreek
I think we should do a one or two day brainstorming about issue/vision/direction. There are some experiences to share and see what we can do. ESUG10 could be a nice place for that kind of workshop. I personnaly have some ideas/insigths but I cannot really communicate them easily by email (moreover, most of the time they'll be ignored ;-) ). I think it's better to sit around a table a discuss.

What do you think ?

2009/12/17 Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]>
Hi

this night I was thinking about a frequent misconception about pharo.
It is easy to think that pharo wants just plain good engineering to open
grey window. Pharo really wants to be innovative and this at all level.
We want better/faster/leaner and more powerful code at all level: UI, network...

I heard that some people think that we are against MVC but we are not
We are against isMorphic ifTrue: ifFalse:. Pharo does not have to be in
the seaside niche and it will not be. But if this makes the life easier to some
perfect. Now pharoers do not have to either pick web or the rest.
We want to make sure that if someone wants to build an alternative
windowing system he can do it easily. (BTW alain showed to us
some fun and powerful sketches of using cairo (via rome) to have multiple
windowing skeleton.)
Now we certainly do not have the knowledge for everything but this
is not by a lack of vision. So if you want to build this future don't
get us wrong.

Stef

PS: I still have in mind the vision of Smalltalk by dan: a system that a simple
person could understand (for me it means beauty, documentation and elegance
of the solutions).


_______________________________________________
Pharo-project mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project



--
Cédrick

_______________________________________________
Pharo-project mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: misconception addendum :)

Stéphane Ducasse
Good idea.
I hope to be able to organize some other sprints before.

Stef

On Dec 17, 2009, at 11:26 AM, Cédrick Béler wrote:

> I think we should do a one or two day brainstorming about issue/vision/direction. There are some experiences to share and see what we can do. ESUG10 could be a nice place for that kind of workshop. I personnaly have some ideas/insigths but I cannot really communicate them easily by email (moreover, most of the time they'll be ignored ;-) ). I think it's better to sit around a table a discuss.
>
> What do you think ?
>
> 2009/12/17 Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]>
> Hi
>
> this night I was thinking about a frequent misconception about pharo.
> It is easy to think that pharo wants just plain good engineering to open
> grey window. Pharo really wants to be innovative and this at all level.
> We want better/faster/leaner and more powerful code at all level: UI, network...
>
> I heard that some people think that we are against MVC but we are not
> We are against isMorphic ifTrue: ifFalse:. Pharo does not have to be in
> the seaside niche and it will not be. But if this makes the life easier to some
> perfect. Now pharoers do not have to either pick web or the rest.
> We want to make sure that if someone wants to build an alternative
> windowing system he can do it easily. (BTW alain showed to us
> some fun and powerful sketches of using cairo (via rome) to have multiple
> windowing skeleton.)
> Now we certainly do not have the knowledge for everything but this
> is not by a lack of vision. So if you want to build this future don't
> get us wrong.
>
> Stef
>
> PS: I still have in mind the vision of Smalltalk by dan: a system that a simple
> person could understand (for me it means beauty, documentation and elegance
> of the solutions).
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
>
>
>
> --
> Cédrick
> _______________________________________________
> Pharo-project mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project


_______________________________________________
Pharo-project mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: misconception addendum :)

Guido Stepken
In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse
Cairographics.org reminds me to Khronos API (http://www.khronos.org/openvg/), nearly used everywhere on all PDA's (iPhone, Android, e.t.c.).

I would prefer SDL. Very stable, implemented in C, multi-platform, language bindings to Smalltalk already ...
http://www.libsdl.org/

Should be easy at first to adapt Morpic to SDL, but ... there are many GUI's out in the wild, for gaming, 3D, 2D, e.t.c. which should be easy to program language bindings for. And OpenGL now becomes standard on all desktop and PDA (Cortex ARM8/9+OpenGL ES 2.0). Chips are cheap! (< 40$ for ARM 2000MIPS incl. OpenGL ES)

Smalltalk is missing a GUI standard. I am hopefully, that Pharo could perhaps set one :)

SDL in Squeak VM could become a wildely accepted standard, that will survive in future ... IMHO.
 
just my 0.02000001 cents ..., Guido Stepken