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Reinout Heeck-3

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

On 7/31/2014 5:03 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>>
>> Sorry but this is totally wrong. You should not judge a community based on the existence or not of a namespace :)>
>>

Not on its own no, but as part of an (incomplete) list of symptoms?
<smiley too>

R
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Richard Sargent (again)

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Helge Nowak

In my opinion, this entire thread is based on an "argument from a false premise".

"Pharo is not Smalltalk. Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired."

My son is not me. He is inspired by me.

Why would I want him to be "just like me"? My ambition is that he will be better than me.

He has grown and left home. Does that mean he has divorced me?

He doesn't want to be a programmer. Is that a bad thing?

I feel like a family friend, watching a child grow into an adult. There is a sense of pride - vicarious - in watching Pharo's growth. The is a sense of anticipation of what Pharo's future will be.

Am I concerned that this child will repudiate beliefs and behaviours I hold dear? Not in the least! It comes from good stock and it's being raised by a good and caring family.

Go, Pharo! Fly! Show us what you can be.

-----------------

Can we stop discussing "When did you stop beating your wife?" and resume discussing what Pharo should be (or become)?

-------- Original message --------
From: Helge Nowak
Date:2014/07/31 08:29 (GMT-08:00)
To: Tudor Girba
Cc: ESUG ,[hidden email],[hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Dear Stef and Doru,

what Doru is saying seems contradictory to what Stef does (or I do not understand one, or the both of you correctly):

Doru says: "Pharo is not Smalltalk. Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired."

Whereas Stef says "Pharo is to reinvent Smalltalk" and "I prefer that my students find a job in “Smalltalk”". From which I take that Stef sees himself and Pharo as part of the Smalltalk community. Something I had hoped to hear ;-)

I am with Kent Pitman: "Smalltalk" is not technically defined but by the (sub-)communities and their values. The development of Smalltalk will never stop, each dialect may take its own path yet it will stay "Smalltalk" regardless of what you name it. Only if one thinks that being part of the Smalltalk community doesn't serve him/her well he/she will leave it. I don't see how Pharo and its community did a departure from the Smalltalk values and its overall community. And I hope this will stay that way.

Cheers
Helge

Von: Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>
An: Helge Nowak <[hidden email]>
CC: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; ESUG <[hidden email]>
Gesendet: 17:05 Donnerstag, 31.Juli 2014
Betreff: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Hi,

The official Pharo statement is clearly stated on the http://pharo.org/ webpage.

This topic has been (re)discussed recently spawned by my original post on Pharo is Pharo:

http://www.tudorgirba.com/blog/pharo-is-pharo

You can choose to see in my words what you wish. I will choose to not fight it. I did it before and it lead nowhere. I will only state that we clearly want to position Pharo to build a future that we do not know at this point in time.

Cheers,

Doru

Cheers,

Doru

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Helge Nowak <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear Pharoers,

I stumbled upon Doru’s (BTW excellent, as usual) presentation on Live Objects at NDC 2014. In there he states “Pharo is Smalltalk inspired. … we want to point ourselves that we are Smalltalk inspired because we want to move towards the future”. This implies three things:

Pharo is NOT Smalltalk
All Smalltalks are not moving towards the future
The Pharo community wants to get divorced from the community that gave them birth

I am wondering whether this is indeed the official position of the Pharo community? And how the Smalltalkers think about it.

Cheers

Helge

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http://www.tudorgirba.com/

"Every thing has its own flow"

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Reinout Heeck-3

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by jgfoster

On 7/31/2014 3:56 PM, James Foster wrote:
> On Jul 31, 2014, at 5:26 AM, Reinout Heeck <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> The problem with the Smalltalk community is that it holds itself back.
>> For example there are no Smalltalks with a decent namespace implementation (although there was Dave Simmons' S# for a while).
> In what way does GemStone/S not have “a decent namespace implementation”?

It's been ages since I worked with Gemstone, so the following may be way
off.
What I recall is that Gemstone allows per-session bindings for global
names but only 'once' for all the code, IOW I cannot do visibility
management with it (have 'Array' mean one thing in one level of
abstraction (=package) and another thing in another level of abstraction
in the same session).
So it feels like there is one namespace, not multiple. (and it does not
do selector namespaces if memory serves).

>
>> Seeing that Pharo and Squeak are still producing browser framework after browser framework
> Have you seen TODE (https://code.google.com/p/tode/ and https://github.com/dalehenrich/tode)?

No, so I just watched the video and it made me cringe: here we have one
of the very early Smalltalk talents *still* busy with implementing the
browser, still concerning himself with combating window clutter, still
biding his time with extracting code from the UI to make tool
interaction and the MOP accessible to ad-hock scripting.

It is a poignant example of what I meant.

Compare his browser demo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4LcZ4_1Yic)
that shows us how to interact with code with less mouse clicks with Bret
Victors browser demo (http://vimeo.com/36579366) that shows tools to
discover new ideas.

R
-

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Stéphane Ducasse

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Tudor Girba-2

Hi,

The official Pharo statement is clearly stated on the http://pharo.org webpage.

This topic has been (re)discussed recently spawned by my original post on Pharo is Pharo:

http://www.tudorgirba.com/blog/pharo-is-pharo

You can choose to see in my words what you wish. I will choose to not fight it. I did it before and it lead nowhere. I will only state that we clearly want to position Pharo to build a future that we do not know at this point in time.

Cheers,
Doru

And this is not like we did not announce it since 2008 :)

Stef

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jgfoster

The problem with Smalltalk: no decent namespace implementation?

In reply to this post by Reinout Heeck-3

On Jul 31, 2014, at 10:17 AM, Reinout Heeck <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 7/31/2014 3:56 PM, James Foster wrote:
>> On Jul 31, 2014, at 5:26 AM, Reinout Heeck <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> The problem with the Smalltalk community is that it holds itself back.
>>> For example there are no Smalltalks with a decent namespace implementation (although there was Dave Simmons' S# for a while).
>> In what way does GemStone/S not have “a decent namespace implementation”?
>
> It's been ages since I worked with Gemstone, so the following may be way off.
> What I recall is that Gemstone allows per-session bindings for global names but only 'once' for all the code, IOW I cannot do visibility management with it (have 'Array' mean one thing in one level of abstraction (=package) and another thing in another level of abstraction in the same session).

Name lookup (the namespace) is applied at the time a method is compiled and is independent of the runtime session. To see this working in Pharo check out http://programminggems.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/gsoc-namespace-project/.

> So it feels like there is one namespace, not multiple. (and it does not do selector namespaces if memory serves).

I’m not sure what you mean by selector namespaces, but a few years ago (as part of supporting Ruby) GemStone added the ability to have multiple method dictionaries for each class and (as part of supporting Seaside) added the ability to insert session-specific method dictionaries.

-James
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Stéphane Ducasse

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Reinout Heeck-3

>>>
>>> Sorry but this is totally wrong. You should not judge a community based on the existence or not of a namespace :)>
>>>
>
> Not on its own no, but as part of an (incomplete) list of symptoms? <smiley too>

Dont worry :)
You only see in Pharo the top of the iceberg. We have first class variables, brand new compiler.
We are prototyping on package local extensions and many more but since we want that our users continue to make
business with Pharo we go step by step. Wise isn’t :)

>
>
> R
> -
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

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Stéphane Ducasse

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Richard Sargent (again)

***THANKS*** for your great words.

Indeed I have three boys and I expect them to be smarter and better than me (without having to kill me :)).

some people forget that around the corner we have Javascript, Lua, Python, ruby and scala, dart…..and many others

and such battles are far more important.

Stef

On 31 Jul 2014, at 18:10, Richard Sargent <[hidden email]> wrote:

In my opinion, this entire thread is based on an "argument from a false premise".

"Pharo is not Smalltalk. Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired."

My son is not me. He is inspired by me.

Why would I want him to be "just like me"? My ambition is that he will be better than me.

He has grown and left home. Does that mean he has divorced me?

He doesn't want to be a programmer. Is that a bad thing?

I feel like a family friend, watching a child grow into an adult. There is a sense of pride - vicarious - in watching Pharo's growth. The is a sense of anticipation of what Pharo's future will be.

Am I concerned that this child will repudiate beliefs and behaviours I hold dear? Not in the least! It comes from good stock and it's being raised by a good and caring family.

Go, Pharo! Fly! Show us what you can be.

-----------------
Can we stop discussing "When did you stop beating your wife?" and resume discussing what Pharo should be (or become)?

-------- Original message --------
From: Helge Nowak
Date:2014/07/31 08:29 (GMT-08:00)
To: Tudor Girba
Cc: ESUG ,[hidden email],[hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Dear Stef and Doru,

what Doru is saying seems contradictory to what Stef does (or I do not understand one, or the both of you correctly):

Doru says: "Pharo is not Smalltalk. Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired."

Whereas Stef says "Pharo is to reinvent Smalltalk" and "I prefer that my students find a job in “Smalltalk”". From which I take that Stef sees himself and Pharo as part of the Smalltalk community. Something I had hoped to hear ;-)

I am with Kent Pitman: "Smalltalk" is not technically defined but by the (sub-)communities and their values. The development of Smalltalk will never stop, each dialect may take its own path yet it will stay "Smalltalk" regardless of what you name it. Only if one thinks that being part of the Smalltalk community doesn't serve him/her well he/she will leave it. I don't see how Pharo and its community did a departure from the Smalltalk values and its overall community. And I hope this will stay that way.

Cheers
Helge

Von: Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>
An: Helge Nowak <[hidden email]>
CC: "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; ESUG <[hidden email]>
Gesendet: 17:05 Donnerstag, 31.Juli 2014
Betreff: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Hi,

The official Pharo statement is clearly stated on the http://pharo.org/ webpage.

This topic has been (re)discussed recently spawned by my original post on Pharo is Pharo:

http://www.tudorgirba.com/blog/pharo-is-pharo

You can choose to see in my words what you wish. I will choose to not fight it. I did it before and it lead nowhere. I will only state that we clearly want to position Pharo to build a future that we do not know at this point in time.

Cheers,
Doru

Cheers,
Doru

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Helge Nowak <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear Pharoers,

I stumbled upon Doru’s (BTW excellent, as usual) presentation on Live Objects at NDC 2014. In there he states “Pharo is Smalltalk inspired. … we want to point ourselves that we are Smalltalk inspired because we want to move towards the future”. This implies three things:

Pharo is NOT Smalltalk
All Smalltalks are not moving towards the future
The Pharo community wants to get divorced from the community that gave them birth

I am wondering whether this is indeed the official position of the Pharo community? And how the Smalltalkers think about it.

Cheers

Helge

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Esug-list mailing list
[hidden email]
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--
http://www.tudorgirba.com/

"Every thing has its own flow"

_______________________________________________
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EstebanLM

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse

On 31 Jul 2014, at 21:20, Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>>>>
>>>> Sorry but this is totally wrong. You should not judge a community based on the existence or not of a namespace :)>
>>>>
>>
>> Not on its own no, but as part of an (incomplete) list of symptoms? <smiley too>

meh
ObjC also does not have namespaces and no one has ever claimed that is not professional.
honestly, if that’s your complain, I can just feel confident in the path we are following.

Esteban

>
> Dont worry :)
> You only see in Pharo the top of the iceberg. We have first class variables, brand new compiler.
> We are prototyping on package local extensions and many more but since we want that our users continue to make
> business with Pharo we go step by step. Wise isn’t :)
>
>>
>>
>> R
>> -
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Esug-list mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

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Dale Henrichs-3

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Reinout Heeck-3

Reinout,

I have a feeling that if we had a chance to talk that we would be in "screaming agreement."

I have spent a large portion of the last 5 years helping to build new infrastructure for Smalltalk. Metacello and Filetree have made it possible for Smalltalkers to start using the more modern SCMs like git and to benefit from collaborative tools like GitHub and I think this is a _good_ thing.

tODE is my take on a Smalltalk IDE built to support git/github-based development and is just another necessary (no IDE for GemStone) step along the way.

I'd like to think that my work contributes to the overall effort in building "Smalltalk3.0."

And I'm sorry I made you cringe:)

Dale

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 10:17 AM, Reinout Heeck <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 7/31/2014 3:56 PM, James Foster wrote:

On Jul 31, 2014, at 5:26 AM, Reinout Heeck <[hidden email]> wrote:

The problem with the Smalltalk community is that it holds itself back.
For example there are no Smalltalks with a decent namespace implementation (although there was Dave Simmons' S# for a while).

In what way does GemStone/S not have “a decent namespace implementation”?

It's been ages since I worked with Gemstone, so the following may be way off.
What I recall is that Gemstone allows per-session bindings for global names but only 'once' for all the code, IOW I cannot do visibility management with it (have 'Array' mean one thing in one level of abstraction (=package) and another thing in another level of abstraction in the same session).
So it feels like there is one namespace, not multiple. (and it does not do selector namespaces if memory serves).

Seeing that Pharo and Squeak are still producing browser framework after browser framework

Have you seen TODE (https://code.google.com/p/tode/ and https://github.com/dalehenrich/tode)?

No, so I just watched the video and it made me cringe: here we have one of the very early Smalltalk talents *still* busy with implementing the browser, still concerning himself with combating window clutter, still biding his time with extracting code from the UI to make tool interaction and the MOP accessible to ad-hock scripting.

It is a poignant example of what I meant.

Compare his browser demo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4LcZ4_1Yic) that shows us how to interact with code with less mouse clicks with Bret Victors browser demo (http://vimeo.com/36579366) that shows tools to discover new ideas.

R

-

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Helge Nowak

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Stéphane Ducasse

In Germany we say "analogies limp". And so does the parents/child analogy for communities.

Cheers

Helge

Von: Stéphane Ducasse <[hidden email]>
An: Richard Sargent <[hidden email]>
CC: Helge Nowak <[hidden email]>; Tudor Girba <[hidden email]>; ESUG <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>; "[hidden email]" <[hidden email]>
Gesendet: 21:22 Donnerstag, 31.Juli 2014
Betreff: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

***THANKS*** for your great words.

Indeed I have three boys and I expect them to be smarter and better than me (without having to kill me :)).

some people forget that around the corner we have Javascript, Lua, Python, ruby and scala, dart…..and many others

and such battles are far more important.

Stef

On 31 Jul 2014, at 18:10, Richard Sargent <[hidden email]> wrote:

In my opinion, this entire thread is based on an "argument from a false premise".

"Pharo is not Smalltalk. Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired."

My son is not me. He is inspired by me.

Why would I want him to be "just like me"? My ambition is that he will be better than me.

He has grown and left home. Does that mean he has divorced me?

He doesn't want to be a programmer. Is that a bad thing?

I feel like a family friend, watching a child grow into an adult. There is a sense of pride - vicarious - in watching Pharo's growth. The is a sense of anticipation of what Pharo's future will be.

Am I concerned that this child will repudiate beliefs and behaviours I hold dear? Not in the least! It comes from good stock and it's being raised by a good and caring family.

Go, Pharo! Fly! Show us what you can be.

-----------------

Can we stop discussing "When did you stop beating your wife?" and resume discussing what Pharo should be (or become)?

-------- Original message --------
From: Helge Nowak
Date:2014/07/31 08:29 (GMT-08:00)
To: Tudor Girba
Cc: ESUG ,[hidden email],[hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Dear Stef and Doru,

what Doru is saying seems contradictory to what Stef does (or I do not understand one, or the both of you correctly):

Doru says: "Pharo is not Smalltalk. Pharo is Smalltalk-inspired."

Cheers
Helge

Hi,

The official Pharo statement is clearly stated on the http://pharo.org/ webpage.

This topic has been (re)discussed recently spawned by my original post on Pharo is Pharo:

http://www.tudorgirba.com/blog/pharo-is-pharo

Cheers,

Doru

Cheers,

Doru

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Helge Nowak <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear Pharoers,

I stumbled upon Doru’s (BTW excellent, as usual) presentation on Live Objects at NDC 2014. In there he states “Pharo is Smalltalk inspired. … we want to point ourselves that we are Smalltalk inspired because we want to move towards the future”. This implies three things:

Pharo is NOT Smalltalk
All Smalltalks are not moving towards the future
The Pharo community wants to get divorced from the community that gave them birth

I am wondering whether this is indeed the official position of the Pharo community? And how the Smalltalkers think about it.

Cheers

Helge

_______________________________________________
Esug-list mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

http://www.tudorgirba.com/

"Every thing has its own flow"

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drush66

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Helge Nowak

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Helge Nowak <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear Pharoers,

I stumbled upon Doru’s (BTW excellent, as usual) presentation on Live Objects at NDC 2014. In there he states “Pharo is Smalltalk inspired. … we want to point ourselves that we are Smalltalk inspired because we want to move towards the future”. This implies three things:

Pharo is NOT Smalltalk
All Smalltalks are not moving towards the future
The Pharo community wants to get divorced from the community that gave them birth

I am wondering whether this is indeed the official position of the Pharo community? And how the Smalltalkers think about it.

Cheers

Helge

For me, Pharo is very nice Smalltalk dialect, and "Pharo is not Smalltalk", is just marketing speak for me. As I try to valuate things accordingly to what they are and not marketing, I can live quite nice with "Pharo is not Smalltalk", since, as I said I like Pharo Smalltalk pretty much.

Thanks guys for hard work!

Davorin Ruševljan

http://www.cloud208.com

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Nowak, Helge

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

:-)

Von: Esug-list [mailto:[hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Davorin Rusevljan
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. August 2014 14:16
An: Helge Nowak
Cc: ESUG; [hidden email]
Betreff: Re: [Esug-list] "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Helge Nowak <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear Pharoers,

I stumbled upon Doru’s (BTW excellent, as usual) presentation on Live Objects at NDC 2014. In there he states “Pharo is Smalltalk inspired. … we want to point ourselves that we are Smalltalk inspired because we want to move towards the future”. This implies three things:

Pharo is NOT Smalltalk

All Smalltalks are not moving towards the future

The Pharo community wants to get divorced from the community that gave them birth

I am wondering whether this is indeed the official position of the Pharo community? And how the Smalltalkers think about it.

Cheers

Helge

Thanks guys for hard work!

Davorin Ruševljan

http://www.cloud208.com

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Tim Mackinnon-3

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by drush66

I like different Smalltalks, and I also like Pharo.

I'm not sure if they are different, and even whether I care,

However I do care about preserving the energy in respective communities - and in particular the iterative improvements I see happening in Pharo (which is not to downplay things happening in other Smalltalks either).

I really want to see Pharo continue unhindered by past convictions, and from their recent track record I trust them to keep forging on.

Thanks guys!

Tim

Sent from my iPhone

On 1 Aug 2014, at 02:16 pm, Davorin Rusevljan <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Helge Nowak <[hidden email]> wrote:

Dear Pharoers,

I stumbled upon Doru’s (BTW excellent, as usual) presentation on Live Objects at NDC 2014. In there he states “Pharo is Smalltalk inspired. … we want to point ourselves that we are Smalltalk inspired because we want to move towards the future”. This implies three things:

Pharo is NOT Smalltalk
All Smalltalks are not moving towards the future
The Pharo community wants to get divorced from the community that gave them birth

I am wondering whether this is indeed the official position of the Pharo community? And how the Smalltalkers think about it.

Cheers

Helge

For me, Pharo is very nice Smalltalk dialect, and "Pharo is not Smalltalk", is just marketing speak for me. As I try to valuate things accordingly to what they are and not marketing, I can live quite nice with "Pharo is not Smalltalk", since, as I said I like Pharo Smalltalk pretty much.

Thanks guys for hard work!

Davorin Ruševljan
http://www.cloud208.com

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Reinout Heeck-3

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Dale Henrichs-3

On 7/31/2014 9:56 PM, Dale Henrichs wrote:
> Reinout,
>
> I have a feeling that if we had a chance to talk that we would be in
> "screaming agreement."

We share that feeling :-)

[snipped the actual content]

> And I'm sorry I made you cringe:)

You didn't, the context did -- but I guess you already knew that :-)

R
-

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Tim Mackinnon-4

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

In reply to this post by Andres Valloud-4

On 31 Jul 2014, at 14:49, Andres Valloud <[hidden email]> wrote:

So, ideally, those interested in tackling these challenges would get on the same page in person. We can start doing that just two weeks from now (*and* over beer or equivalent). I'm looking forward to it :).

So should we have a BOF about this in the pub at ESUG 2014 this year?

Tim

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John O'Keefe

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Count me in.

John O'Keefe [|], CTO/Principal Smalltalk Architect
Instantiations Inc

On Aug 4, 2014 4:09 PM, "Tim Mackinnon" <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 31 Jul 2014, at 14:49, Andres Valloud <[hidden email]> wrote:

So, ideally, those interested in tackling these challenges would get on the same page in person. We can start doing that just two weeks from now (*and* over beer or equivalent). I'm looking forward to it :).

So should we have a BOF about this in the pub at ESUG 2014 this year?

Tim

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Sean P. DeNigris

Re: "Pharo is Smalltalk inspired"

Administrator

In reply to this post by drush66

drush66 wrote

"Pharo is not Smalltalk", is just marketing speak for me

Bingo. It's a sound bite, which by definition presents one teeny-tiny side of an issue in a way that we think will bring the most interest to Pharo.

Debating how "true" it is, or whether anyone should be insulted, is as unproductive this time as it was in the thread from April with 98 posts (http://forum.world.st/a-Pharo-talk-from-a-ruby-conference-td4756805.html).

The only potentially helpful discussion would be whether it's good marketing, but the consensus among those of us in the Pharo community with experience sharing to the outside programming community is that once most programmers hear "Smalltalk" either:
<overdramatic list>
- their eyes glaze over
- they can't hear anything else you say over their own laughter, or
- you take so long explaining that "'Smalltalk' is an idea, but most of the time people say 'Smalltalk' meaning 'Smalltalk-80', which is..." you're out of time
</overdramatic list>
Also, as programmers, who are notoriously terrible marketing people, it might be time to try something bold, turning our first instinct - which has been to hold dearly to marketing Smalltalk as such for 34 years - on its head...

Cheers,
Sean