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[squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

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richardsnow

[squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).

Richard Snow

--
http://mypals.info

Alan Grimes-2

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

richard snow wrote:
> I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
> However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
> of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).

Try building the standard unix VM for x86_64. Recent and vast
improvements in the VM and vmmaker should make that a workable solution.

Much much more work is still required to make it SMP enabled. =(

--
New president: Here we go again...
Chemistry.com: A total rip-off.
Powers are not rights.

David T. Lewis

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

In reply to this post by richardsnow

On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
> I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
> However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
> of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).

Hi,

I expect that you built this with the "64 bit vm?" button enabled
on the VMMaker tool, right? If so, then you are the victim of some
confusing labeling on that screen. What you've got right now is
a 64 bit VM that is capable of running (only) 64 bit images. What
you want is a 64 bit VM that is capable of running (only) 32 bit
images.

Try unchecking the "64 bit vm?" option and generate the sources
that way. You should end up with a 64 bit VM with will work with
a normal 32 bit image.

Dave

Michael van der Gulik-2

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 10:30 AM, David T. Lewis <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
> I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
> However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
> of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).

I'm guessing that this would be a 64-bit image:

http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/

Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz

But it's (IIRC) unsupported and probably unstable. 32-bit images are better supported and the garbage collector isn't really designed for images bigger than 4GB.

Gulik.

--
http://gulik.pbwiki.com/

richardsnow

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

In reply to this post by David T. Lewis

ok -- I have built a 3.8 64 bit Vm that works with the 64 bit image...

I may now try to do the 64 bit generation for the 32 bit image as you said.

It is a little confusing yes.

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 5:30 PM, David T. Lewis<[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
>> I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
>> However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
>> of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).
>
> Hi,
>
> I expect that you built this with the "64 bit vm?" button enabled
> on the VMMaker tool, right? If so, then you are the victim of some
> confusing labeling on that screen. What you've got right now is
> a 64 bit VM that is capable of running (only) 64 bit images. What
> you want is a 64 bit VM that is capable of running (only) 32 bit
> images.
>
> Try unchecking the "64 bit vm?" option and generate the sources
> that way. You should end up with a 64 bit VM with will work with
> a normal 32 bit image.
>
> Dave
>
>
>

--
http://mypals.info

David T. Lewis

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

In reply to this post by Michael van der Gulik-2

On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 10:40:38AM +1200, Michael van der Gulik wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 10:30 AM, David T. Lewis <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
> > > I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
> > > However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
> > > of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).
> >
>
> I'm guessing that this would be a 64-bit image:
>
> http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/
> Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz<http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz>
>
> But it's (IIRC) unsupported and probably unstable. 32-bit images are better
> supported and the garbage collector isn't really designed for images bigger
> than 4GB.

There's nothing unstable about that image, but unfortunately it does not run
on today's VMs (http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=5239). Personally I use a
descendent of that original 64-bit image (mainly for testing VMs) but as far
as I know nobody is actively working on this.

In any case, it's of acedemic interest in this case, because what Richard needs
is a 64-bit VM to run normal 32-bit images.

Dave

richardsnow

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

http://mypals.info/tikiwiki-2.1/tiki-index.php?page=SqueakForAlpha

Here is a page with the two vms I've made (source code).

the 3.8 is a 64 bit that runs 64 bit images, the 3.10 is a 64 bit that
runs 32 bit images.

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:08 PM, David T. Lewis<[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 10:40:38AM +1200, Michael van der Gulik wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 10:30 AM, David T. Lewis <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> > On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
>> > > I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
>> > > However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
>> > > of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).
>> >
>>
>> I'm guessing that this would be a 64-bit image:
>>
>> http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/
>> Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz<http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz>
>>
>> But it's (IIRC) unsupported and probably unstable. 32-bit images are better
>> supported and the garbage collector isn't really designed for images bigger
>> than 4GB.
>
> There's nothing unstable about that image, but unfortunately it does not run
> on today's VMs (http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=5239). Personally I use a
> descendent of that original 64-bit image (mainly for testing VMs) but as far
> as I know nobody is actively working on this.
>
> In any case, it's of acedemic interest in this case, because what Richard needs
> is a 64-bit VM to run normal 32-bit images.
>
> Dave
>
>
>

--
http://mypals.info

David T. Lewis

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

Richard,

Very nice. Thanks for the link to http://mypals.info/tikiwiki-2.1/tiki-index.php?page=SqueakForAlpha.

I am CCing this to the vm-dev mailing list, where various interested
parties (including Ian) are likely to be reading.

Dave

On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 08:39:01PM -0500, richard snow wrote:

> http://mypals.info/tikiwiki-2.1/tiki-index.php?page=SqueakForAlpha
>
> Here is a page with the two vms I've made (source code).
>
> the 3.8 is a 64 bit that runs 64 bit images, the 3.10 is a 64 bit that
> runs 32 bit images.
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:08 PM, David T. Lewis<[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 10:40:38AM +1200, Michael van der Gulik wrote:
> >> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 10:30 AM, David T. Lewis <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>
> >> > On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
> >> > > I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
> >> > > However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
> >> > > of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).
> >> >
> >>
> >> I'm guessing that this would be a 64-bit image:
> >>
> >> http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/
> >> Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz<http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz>
> >>
> >> But it's (IIRC) unsupported and probably unstable. 32-bit images are better
> >> supported and the garbage collector isn't really designed for images bigger
> >> than 4GB.
> >
> > There's nothing unstable about that image, but unfortunately it does not run
> > on today's VMs (http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=5239). Personally I use a
> > descendent of that original 64-bit image (mainly for testing VMs) but as far
> > as I know nobody is actively working on this.
> >
> > In any case, it's of acedemic interest in this case, because what Richard needs
> > is a 64-bit VM to run normal 32-bit images.
> >
> > Dave
> >

richardsnow

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 9:17 PM, David T. Lewis<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Richard,
>
> Very nice. Thanks for the link to http://mypals.info/tikiwiki-2.1/tiki-index.php?page=SqueakForAlpha.
>
> I am CCing this to the vm-dev mailing list, where various interested
> parties (including Ian) are likely to be reading.
>
> Dave
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 08:39:01PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
>> http://mypals.info/tikiwiki-2.1/tiki-index.php?page=SqueakForAlpha
>>
>> Here is a page with the two vms I've made (source code).
>>
>> the 3.8 is a 64 bit that runs 64 bit images, the 3.10 is a 64 bit that
>> runs 32 bit images.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:08 PM, David T. Lewis<[hidden email]> wrote:
>> > On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 10:40:38AM +1200, Michael van der Gulik wrote:
>> >> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 10:30 AM, David T. Lewis <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > On Tue, Aug 04, 2009 at 04:16:02PM -0500, richard snow wrote:
>> >> > > I was able to use vmmaker to generate a 64 bit vm for the Alpha.
>> >> > > However it can't run 32 bit images, so I'm kind
>> >> > > of stuck. Where could I get an image (3.10-6 hopefully).
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> I'm guessing that this would be a 64-bit image:
>> >>
>> >> http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/
>> >> Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz<http://squeakvm.org/squeak64/dist3/Squeak64-3.8g-6548.image.tar.gz>
>> >>
>> >> But it's (IIRC) unsupported and probably unstable. 32-bit images are better
>> >> supported and the garbage collector isn't really designed for images bigger
>> >> than 4GB.
>> >
>> > There's nothing unstable about that image, but unfortunately it does not run
>> > on today's VMs (http://bugs.squeak.org/view.php?id=5239). Personally I use a
>> > descendent of that original 64-bit image (mainly for testing VMs) but as far
>> > as I know nobody is actively working on this.
>> >
>> > In any case, it's of acedemic interest in this case, because what Richard needs
>> > is a 64-bit VM to run normal 32-bit images.
>> >
>> > Dave
>> >
>
>

--
http://mypals.info

Ian says he committed some changes to the trunk to enable the build for alpha.

The config scripts no longer need changing, but there are still
references to sa_restore member of sigact structure.

When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages in
the attached file over and over again
and the make never seems to finish.

Richard Snow

error.txt (862 bytes) Download Attachment

Ian Piumarta-2

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:

> When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages in
> the attached file over and over again
> and the make never seems to finish.

I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken
behaviour on i686. I'm investigating now. I can't help thinking
(again) that getting rid of libtool (and maybe even autoconf)
altogether would make life so much simpler...

Cheers,
Ian

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:53 PM, Ian Piumarta <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:

When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages in
the attached file over and over again
and the make never seems to finish.

I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken behaviour on i686. I'm investigating now. I can't help thinking (again) that getting rid of libtool (and maybe even autoconf) altogether would make life so much simpler...

+10!!

Cheers,
Ian

richardsnow

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

In reply to this post by Ian Piumarta-2

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Ian Piumarta<[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:
>
>> When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages in
>> the attached file over and over again
>> and the make never seems to finish.
>
> I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken
> behaviour on i686. I'm investigating now. I can't help thinking (again)
> that getting rid of libtool (and maybe even autoconf) altogether would make
> life so much simpler...
>
> Cheers,
> Ian
>
>
>

So I'm not completlely crazy even if I am schizophrenic lol.
(i'm a disabled Navy vet. I had a head injury in 1981 that left me
hospitalized and got a diagnosis of Schizophrenia.

--
http://mypals.info

Ian Piumarta-2

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On Aug 4, 2009, at 9:17 PM, richard snow wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Ian Piumarta<[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>> On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:
>>
>>> When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error
>>> messages in
>>> the attached file over and over again
>>> and the make never seems to finish.
>>
>> I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken
>> behaviour on i686. I'm investigating now.

The culprit was libtool 2.2. Reverting autoconf 2.63 back to 2.50 or
2.13 did not help at all, but rebuilding 'configure' on Mac OS 10.4
with libtool 1.4 resulted in a working script. I committed that to
the trunk, which will now build (on Linux/alpha too) but woe betide
anyone who tries to rebuild configure on a recent OS! This is
clearly an untenable situation. My displacement activity for the
rest of this week may well be the eradication of libtool from the
build system.

Many thanks to Richard for providing me with access to his DEC
Alpha. I've made a Linux/Alpha binary available at squeakvm.org.

Cheers,
Ian

Bert Freudenberg

[squeak-dev] Pulseaudio breaks Linux sound

On 05.08.2009, at 08:40, Ian Piumarta wrote:

> My displacement activity for the rest of this week may well be the
> eradication of libtool from the build system.

This doesn't sound like *real* fun ;) Maybe another displacement would
be getting sound to work again. See

http://tracker.squeakland.org/browse/SQ-214

Both Fedora and Ubuntu now run PulseAudio by default, which
virtualizes our ALSA calls, but incompletely. Here's the PulseAudio
author's summary of the state of affairs (if you're into flame wars,
read the comments):

http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/guide-to-sound-apis.html

He has some advice in there for how to get low-latency sound output.

- Bert -

Ian Piumarta-2

[squeak-dev] Re: Pulseaudio breaks Linux sound

On Aug 5, 2009, at 3:07 AM, Bert Freudenberg wrote:

> Maybe another displacement would be getting sound to work again.
> Both Fedora and Ubuntu now run PulseAudio by default

I think the Scratch people are working on a native pulse audio
driver. It'll be in the repo as soon as I have a copy.

Cheers,
Ian

richardsnow

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

In reply to this post by Ian Piumarta-2

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Ian Piumarta <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:
>
>> When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages in
>> the attached file over and over again
>> and the make never seems to finish.
>
> I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken

Hi Ian. I've gone out of state on a short trip. I've got a new
girlfriend. We are talking
marriage.

I downloaded the ST80 Blue book.

See ya

Bert Freudenberg

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On 25.09.2009, at 10:05, richard snow wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Ian Piumarta <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>> On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:
>>
>>> When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages
>>> in
>>> the attached file over and over again
>>> and the make never seems to finish.
>>
>> I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken
>
> Hi Ian. I've gone out of state on a short trip. I've got a new
> girlfriend. We are talking
> marriage.

Congrats!

> I downloaded the ST80 Blue book.
>
> See ya

Great too! :)

Anybody for reconsidering the reply-to munging on this list?

- Bert -

Eliot Miranda-2

Re: [squeak-dev] Built 64 bit vm for 64 bit compaq ES40 alpha server running gentoo linux.

On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 6:36 AM, Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 25.09.2009, at 10:05, richard snow wrote:

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Ian Piumarta <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Aug 4, 2009, at 8:15 PM, richard snow wrote:

When I tried to compile his trunk version I get the error messages in
the attached file over and over again
and the make never seems to finish.

I just upgraded my autoconf/libtool and can now reproduce the broken

Hi Ian. I've gone out of state on a short trip. I've got a new
girlfriend. We are talking
marriage.

Congrats!

I downloaded the ST80 Blue book.

See ya

Great too! :)

Anybody for reconsidering the reply-to munging on this list?

Please! Its much easier to repost again to the right address than it is to retract a private message ;)

But *why* can't mailers make more of a fuss about reply/reply-all? This kind of mistake is incredibly easy to make.

- Bert -