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Re: Can Pharo meet all your computing needs?

Posted by kilon.alios on Aug 24, 2014; 1:46pm
URL: https://forum.world.st/Can-Pharo-meet-all-your-computing-needs-tp4774250p4774426.html

For Emac and Pharo is common practice to build a monolithic environment where everything is reimplemented. Emacs has its own email client, git client, command shell, irc client etc etc. But then this lead me to ask the question "Why fight them when you can join them" . 

The problem with existing solutions , however clumsy , inconvenient and uncool they are. They are just that, solutions. 

I get how Alan Kay disapproves of modern iPads and many other modern technologies BUT his dynabook is vaporware. However emacs and pharo are cool and powerful they cannot compete with those specialised tools that have been in development in some cases for decades . 

So that led me to my second question "Why fight them , when you can join them ?" which is why it started with emacs eshell and ended up with Xterm2. 

However still missing all the coolness of Pharo and the language and the tools it has triggered a new question "why join when you can enslave them ?". Parasites after all are difficult to like but they happen to be one of the most powerful organisms on this planet and they are very efficient ,like viruses. 

So now I am exploring the concept of how Pharo can control all these apps without me having to reimplement these apps in Pharo which is just an insane amount of work to code and maintain.  In my case it was not difficult to reach this conclusion since reimplementing Blender in Pharo would be an insane if not impossible amount of work for a single developer. At first I was very sceptical trying to use sockets as a way to control Blender but now I see this actually can work very well. It has its limitations but its light years easier and more efficient than the alternative. 

It raises some interesting questions, how Pharo can control gmail, or thunderbird, or irc client like mirc and KVIRC and XChat, or the web browser (amber could play a very important role here) or many thousands of apps out there. We certainly have the libraries to do this. 


On Sun, Aug 24, 2014 at 2:47 AM, Sean P. DeNigris <[hidden email]> wrote:
kilon.alios wrote
> I've been wondering if I can use Pharo the way I would use
> Emacs, as an environment for doing everything."

This is the dream - the Dynabook vision. Smalltalk was a protoype
exploration of JCR Licklider's dream, articulated in the early 60s "to
become interactive intellectual amplifiers for all people", or as Dan
Ingalls put it "to provide computer support for the creative spirit in
everyone". There is no reason why Pharo should not be able to do this.
Indeed it is why its lineage exists in the first place. The only thing
necessary is the effort to implement the features that matter to you.


kilon.alios wrote
> "* Use IRC?"

I remember there is at least one project, but would probably have to be
ported to a current Pharo version


kilon.alios wrote
> Pharo has a command shell, similar to emacs eshell

I've experimented with it quite a bit. The features are very impressive when
you dig into it.


kilon.alios wrote
> " Read the Pharo documentation (e.g. Pharo By Example)?"

This - unfortunately - is the weakest point of all the features you have
mentioned. While multimedia is an essential part of the Dynabook vision,
standards and formats have been moving so quickly and becoming so
complicated that our community's resources are overwhelmed, and it seems we
have mostly conceded here, although there are some bits and pieces lying
around and now-a-days with all the FFI/NB advancements, a quick hack would
be to wrap existing external libraries.


kilon.alios wrote
> " Is there a package manager I can use to find new tools I can use in
> Pharo"

We are moving closer and closer to this, but don't yet have one central
catalog.

Anyway, welcome! What you're suggesting is a dream for many of us. We've
been focusing these last few years on infrastructure to make it more
practical. Let's make it happen :)

- Sean



-----
Cheers,
Sean
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