validation of referenced objects

> Hi,
>
> I have an image object which references a user. For
> the user there is a descriptionContainer which adds
> conditions for the user (checks equality of password).
> In a component dealing with the image there appears
> something strange. If I do a validate on that component
> it complains abaut value cache being unknown. And this
> is coming from the descriptionContainer of the user
> object. Is it normal for the referenced objects to be
> checked as well? Or do I misunderstand something?
>

>>> How can it happen that that condition gets the real object as a  
>>> value
>>> instead of the memento? In the failure case I do not invoke self
>>> value: at all. So I'm sure not to store anything strange.
>>
>> I personally never used the MAToOneRelationDescription and
>> MAToManyRelationDescription. The design of how Magritte handles those
>> is simply wrong, therefor many people run into problems when using  
>> them.
>
> How do you model a reference between objects? I think it is quite
> common to interconnect objects ;)

> >>> How can it happen that that condition gets the real object as a  
> >>> value
> >>> instead of the memento? In the failure case I do not invoke self
> >>> value: at all. So I'm sure not to store anything strange.
> >>
> >> I personally never used the MAToOneRelationDescription and
> >> MAToManyRelationDescription. The design of how Magritte handles those
> >> is simply wrong, therefor many people run into problems when using  
> >> them.
> >
> > How do you model a reference between objects? I think it is quite
> > common to interconnect objects ;)
>
> Well, the MARelationDescriptions were ment for that. They work well  
> for some cases I encountered in industrial applications and to  
> describe Magritte in itself, however they fail to describe relations  
> in general.
>
> One of the problems is that you have a description on every end of  
> the relation. Sometimes they are the same, sometimes not. Mostly the  
> framework assumes that this is a MAContainerDescription, but  
> sometimes it is not. When validating the framework has to decide  
> which one to use and if it should recurse the validation into the  
> referenced description.
>
> What I would prefer is to have a multiplicity for all the  
> descriptions. It would probably make the form generation more  
> difficult, but it would cleanly solve the above problems.
>
> >> I suggest that somebody that really needs them gives a try and
> >> implements them cleanly. I have some ideas about that, but
> >> unfortunately I don't have the time to do it myself.
> >
> > Me neither. Maybe I have to do it soon because I use references
> > a lot and I don't think I can rip them out now.
>
> Yes please.

>>>> I suggest that somebody that really needs them gives a try and
>>>> implements them cleanly. I have some ideas about that, but
>>>> unfortunately I don't have the time to do it myself.
>>>
>>> Me neither. Maybe I have to do it soon because I use references
>>> a lot and I don't think I can rip them out now.
>>
>> Yes please.
>
> Could you please provide some experience about your modeling with
> Magritte? If you use automatic form generation you need to model
> relationships, right? How do you model cases where objects reference
> each other?