[vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

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[vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Bruce Badger
Hi,

Does anyone know either or both of:

o what license is the WikiWorks wiki in the Public Cincom Store under?

o who was the original author?

Thanks,
    Bruce
--
Make the most of your skills - with OpenSkills
http://www.openskills.org/
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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Reinout Heeck

On Jun 29, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Bruce Badger wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Does anyone know either or both of:
>
> o what license is the WikiWorks wiki in the Public Cincom Store under?
>
> o who was the original author?


I'd like to know that too :-)


I think Ralph Johnson authoritatively knows the answer to both these  
questions, so I CC-ed him.



Ralph can you help us with this?

TIA,

R
-







>
>
> Thanks,
>    Bruce
> --
> Make the most of your skills - with OpenSkills
> http://www.openskills.org/
> _______________________________________________
> vwnc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vwnc
>

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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Bruce Boyer
I was of the impression that is was a UIUC student project.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Reinout Heeck" <[hidden email]>
To: "VW NC" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 8:09 AM
Subject: Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?


>
> On Jun 29, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Bruce Badger wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Does anyone know either or both of:
>>
>> o what license is the WikiWorks wiki in the Public Cincom Store under?
>>
>> o who was the original author?
>
>
> I'd like to know that too :-)
>
>
> I think Ralph Johnson authoritatively knows the answer to both these  
> questions, so I CC-ed him.
>
>
>
> Ralph can you help us with this?
>
> TIA,
>
> R
> -
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>    Bruce
>> --
>> Make the most of your skills - with OpenSkills
>> http://www.openskills.org/
>> _______________________________________________
>> vwnc mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vwnc
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> vwnc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vwnc
>
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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Travis Griggs-3

On Jun 30, 2008, at 8:43 AM, Bruce Boyer wrote:

> I was of the impression that is was a UIUC student project.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Reinout Heeck" <[hidden email]>
> To: "VW NC" <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 8:09 AM
> Subject: Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?
>
>
>>
>> On Jun 29, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Bruce Badger wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Does anyone know either or both of:
>>>
>>> o what license is the WikiWorks wiki in the Public Cincom Store  
>>> under?
>>>
>>> o who was the original author?
>>
>>
>> I'd like to know that too :-)
>>
>>
>> I think Ralph Johnson authoritatively knows the answer to both these
>> questions, so I CC-ed him.
>>
>>
>>
>> Ralph can you help us with this?

Ken Treis and I wrote the first versions of WikiWorks following OOPSLA  
'98 where XP made the public splashdown. We wanted to try pair  
programming, we wanted to try test first. And while we thought the C2  
Wiki, we were of the classical Smalltalk centric mindset, that there  
should be a Smalltalk Wiki for Smalltalk stuff. Our "test first"  
approach was to write lots of workspace scripts that fed known GET/
POSTS to a socket, and asserted a given output. Ken and I coined the  
name.

Most of the code has long since been replaced/rewritten by UIUC  
students and other interested individuals. I think the core model, the  
idea of modeling a page as a linked set of polymorphic edit objects,  
so that rollback and diff was easy, is still pretty much intact,  
including the amazingly stupid file based persistence mechanism we  
came up with.

--
Travis Griggs
Objologist
"It's [a spec] _the_ single worst way to write software, because it by  
definition means that the software was written to match theory, not  
reality" - Linus Torvalds


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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Bruce Badger
2008/6/30 Travis Griggs <[hidden email]>:
> Ken Treis and I wrote the first versions of WikiWorks following OOPSLA
> '98 where XP made the public splashdown. We wanted to try pair
> programming ...

Well, I've been using your wiki since the late 90's (i.e. right after
you wrote it) so thank you very much indeed for the original work.

I would like to understand the licensing, though.  To use your
(Travis, Ken, Ralf) code legally, some kind of permission is needed,
and I've been bitten quite enough just recently to make assumptions
about licensing.

Another contributor, of course, is Jim Robertson with his RSS code and
spam filtering.  What is your view on licensing, James?

Many thanks,
    Bruce
--
Make the most of your skills - with OpenSkills
http://www.openskills.org/
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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

James Robertson-7
I'm happy to call it public domain

James Robertson
Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library




On Jun 30, 2008, at 4:09 PM, Bruce Badger wrote:

> 2008/6/30 Travis Griggs <[hidden email]>:
>> Ken Treis and I wrote the first versions of WikiWorks following  
>> OOPSLA
>> '98 where XP made the public splashdown. We wanted to try pair
>> programming ...
>
> Well, I've been using your wiki since the late 90's (i.e. right after
> you wrote it) so thank you very much indeed for the original work.
>
> I would like to understand the licensing, though.  To use your
> (Travis, Ken, Ralf) code legally, some kind of permission is needed,
> and I've been bitten quite enough just recently to make assumptions
> about licensing.
>
> Another contributor, of course, is Jim Robertson with his RSS code and
> spam filtering.  What is your view on licensing, James?
>
> Many thanks,
>    Bruce
> --
> Make the most of your skills - with OpenSkills
> http://www.openskills.org/
> _______________________________________________
> vwnc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vwnc
>

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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Ralph Johnson
As I said to Bruce, Travis Griggs was the original author.  Several
people at UIUC hacked
on it.  I probably changed it as much as anyone.

I don't think we worried about copyright much back then.  When people
would ask, i would say "public domain".  Some people don't like that
answer, and want a particular license.  I suppose we could put MIT or
BSD style license on it, but then we'd have to have an owner.

-Ralph
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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

Travis Griggs-3

On Jun 30, 2008, at 1:59 PM, Ralph Johnson wrote:

> As I said to Bruce, Travis Griggs was the original author.  Several
> people at UIUC hacked
> on it.  I probably changed it as much as anyone.
>
> I don't think we worried about copyright much back then.  When people
> would ask, i would say "public domain".  Some people don't like that
> answer, and want a particular license.  I suppose we could put MIT or
> BSD style license on it, but then we'd have to have an owner.

Ken and I are both fine calling the origination public domain.

I've often thought I should come up with some screwy esoteric license  
that is public domain but requires bizarre and inane actions. E.g.

"This software is public domain. You can use it for whatever you  
want... BUT, on the third thursday of every month you must say 'Mr.  
Anderson' to someone.

You can sue us for any liability, but preconditions for pursuing legal  
recourse involve giving us a large island of our own in the South  
Pacific, replete with sharks with friggin laser beams on their  
forheads."

--
Travis Griggs
Objologist
One man's blue plane is another man's pink plane.


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Re: [vwnc] WikiWorks - what license?

James Robertson-7
+1 on the sharks :)

James Robertson
Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library




On Jun 30, 2008, at 5:40 PM, Travis Griggs wrote:

>
> On Jun 30, 2008, at 1:59 PM, Ralph Johnson wrote:
>
>> As I said to Bruce, Travis Griggs was the original author.  Several
>> people at UIUC hacked
>> on it.  I probably changed it as much as anyone.
>>
>> I don't think we worried about copyright much back then.  When people
>> would ask, i would say "public domain".  Some people don't like that
>> answer, and want a particular license.  I suppose we could put MIT or
>> BSD style license on it, but then we'd have to have an owner.
>
> Ken and I are both fine calling the origination public domain.
>
> I've often thought I should come up with some screwy esoteric license
> that is public domain but requires bizarre and inane actions. E.g.
>
> "This software is public domain. You can use it for whatever you
> want... BUT, on the third thursday of every month you must say 'Mr.
> Anderson' to someone.
>
> You can sue us for any liability, but preconditions for pursuing legal
> recourse involve giving us a large island of our own in the South
> Pacific, replete with sharks with friggin laser beams on their
> forheads."
>
> --
> Travis Griggs
> Objologist
> One man's blue plane is another man's pink plane.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> vwnc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/mailman/listinfo/vwnc
>

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