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who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

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EstebanLM

who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

really?

git says guilty was Torsten :P

anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.

Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now… what changed?

Esteban

EstebanLM

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

first time I use the “blame” to actually blame someone ;)

Esteban

> On 8 May 2018, at 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> really?
>
> <Screen Shot 2018-05-08 at 15.26.21.png>
>
> git says guilty was Torsten :P
> anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.
> Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now… what changed?
>
> Esteban

Sven Van Caekenberghe-2

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

Yes, it was changed.

But for me (latest 7) it is black text on yellow background which is OK.

However, Print It in Playground is unreadable now ...

> On 8 May 2018, at 15:32, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> first time I use the “blame” to actually blame someone ;)
>
> Esteban
>
>> On 8 May 2018, at 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> really?
>>
>> <Screen Shot 2018-05-08 at 15.26.21.png>
>>
>> git says guilty was Torsten :P
>> anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.
>> Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now… what changed?
>>
>> Esteban
>
>

CyrilFerlicot

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

On mar. 8 mai 2018 at 15:37, Sven Van Caekenberghe <[hidden email]> wrote:

Yes, it was changed.

But for me (latest 7) it is black text on yellow background which is OK.

Black and Yellow for a dark theme is readable but I do not think it is ok because it is really aggressive for the eyes. :(

Usually in dark themes I see light gray for backgrounds and white or black font depending on the luminescence of the font. (Depending if it's > or < to 0.5)

However, Print It in Playground is unreadable now ...

Cyril Ferlicot
https://ferlicot.fr

Sven Van Caekenberghe-2

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

> On 8 May 2018, at 15:53, Cyril Ferlicot <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> On mar. 8 mai 2018 at 15:37, Sven Van Caekenberghe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Yes, it was changed.
>
> But for me (latest 7) it is black text on yellow background which is OK.
>
> Black and Yellow for a dark theme is readable but I do not think it is ok because it is really aggressive for the eyes. :(

It is a pale yellow, only used for tooltip balloons, so for me it is acceptable.

> Usually in dark themes I see light gray for backgrounds and white or black font depending on the luminescence of the font. (Depending if it's > or < to 0.5)
>
>
>
> However, Print It in Playground is unreadable now ...
>
> --
> Cyril Ferlicot
> https://ferlicot.fr

Torsten Bergmann

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

In reply to this post by EstebanLM

This came from https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21809

- the original changeset came from Hilaire
- Stef wanted to do prepare the PR
- I actually did the PR using the CS from Hilaire
- it was reviewed and merged by Marcus
- now Sven likes it too ;)

So you have to blame half of the community :P

For me it is showing yellow with black (not white) text which seems OK.
But I usually work with the light theme and might be biased.

No problem from my side to have a look at other tools with a dark theme
(like VisualStudio, IntelliJ, Eclipse or other) to find a better color combination.

Bye
T.

> Gesendet: Dienstag, 08. Mai 2018 um 15:30 Uhr
> Von: "Esteban Lorenzano" <[hidden email]>
> An: "Pharo Development List" <[hidden email]>
> Betreff: [Pharo-dev] who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?
>
> really?
>
>
>
> git says guilty was Torsten :P
> anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.
> Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now… what changed?
>
> Esteban

Peter Uhnak

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

> For me it is showing yellow with black (not white) text which seems OK.

Dark theme is always light text on dark background, not the other way around.

Also, the color itself feels out of place... how does it relate to the other colors? What other UI element uses yellow? It has to make sense in the entire color scheme.

Finally, consider the following test: In a dark room, only monitor with pharo and dark theme is producing light. Now a large popup with yellow background appears... did your eyes squint? can you suddenly see the other side of the room? :)

Peter

On Tue, May 8, 2018 at 9:16 PM, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:

This came from https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21809

- the original changeset came from Hilaire
- Stef wanted to do prepare the PR
- I actually did the PR using the CS from Hilaire
- it was reviewed and merged by Marcus
- now Sven likes it too ;)

So you have to blame half of the community :P

For me it is showing yellow with black (not white) text which seems OK.
But I usually work with the light theme and might be biased.

No problem from my side to have a look at other tools with a dark theme
(like VisualStudio, IntelliJ, Eclipse or other) to find a better color combination.

Bye
T.

> Gesendet: Dienstag, 08. Mai 2018 um 15:30 Uhr
> Von: "Esteban Lorenzano" <[hidden email]>
> An: "Pharo Development List" <[hidden email]>
> Betreff: [Pharo-dev] who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?
>
> really?

>
>
>
> git says guilty was Torsten :P
> anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.
> Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now… what changed?
>
> Esteban

Torsten Bergmann

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

Peter wrote:
>Finally, consider the following test: In a dark room, only monitor with pharo and dark theme is producing light. Now a large popup with yellow background appears... did your eyes squint? can you suddenly see >the other side of the room? :)

Instead of hypothetical tests I tend to code in a light room and rather use the practical approach of
fixing an issue when it appears or when I get blamed for it :P

All details and a proposed solution are summarized in new issue: https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21856/
which
- will not hardcode the balloon background color (as it was before the introduction of #21809)
by using a lighter version of the darkBaseColor for balloonBackgroundColor in DarkTheme
- nonetheless exactly restores the actual color values of the dark theme as before the introduction of issue #21809
- still allows to define a tooltips text color on the graphics theme as it was the goal in #21809

Also a new PR is awaiting a review: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/1320

Thx
T.

Sven Van Caekenberghe-2

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

Tested manually. OK from this Dark Theme user, Thx !

> On 9 May 2018, at 08:59, Torsten Bergmann <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Peter wrote:
>> Finally, consider the following test: In a dark room, only monitor with pharo and dark theme is producing light. Now a large popup with yellow background appears... did your eyes squint? can you suddenly see >the other side of the room? :)
>
> Instead of hypothetical tests I tend to code in a light room and rather use the practical approach of
> fixing an issue when it appears or when I get blamed for it :P
>
> All details and a proposed solution are summarized in new issue: https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21856/
> which
> - will not hardcode the balloon background color (as it was before the introduction of #21809)
> by using a lighter version of the darkBaseColor for balloonBackgroundColor in DarkTheme
> - nonetheless exactly restores the actual color values of the dark theme as before the introduction of issue #21809
> - still allows to define a tooltips text color on the graphics theme as it was the goal in #21809
>
> Also a new PR is awaiting a review: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/1320
>
> Thx
> T.
>

HilaireFernandes

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

In reply to this post by EstebanLM

What changed is the UITheme receive a balloonTextColor method (the fix I
proposed), BUT some morphs in Pharo use the theme balloonBackgroundColor
BUT NOT the assorted balloonTextColor (obviously as this method was just
introduced).

The right fix will be to makes these morphs using balloonBackgroundColor
to use
balloonTextColor too. I took a look but get lost again in morph classes.
Someone with the appropriate knowledge could fix it in a breeze.

Hilaire

Le 08/05/2018 à 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
> git says guilty was Torsten :P
> anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.
> Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme
> myself and I just realised now… what changed?
>

--
Dr. Geo
http://drgeo.eu

http://drgeo.eu

EstebanLM

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

thanks Hilaire,

in any case yellow background for dark theme was bad :)

cheers,
Esteban

> On 9 May 2018, at 13:17, Hilaire <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> What changed is the UITheme receive a balloonTextColor method (the fix I proposed), BUT some morphs in Pharo use the theme balloonBackgroundColor BUT NOT the assorted balloonTextColor (obviously as this method was just introduced).
>
> The right fix will be to makes these morphs using balloonBackgroundColor to use
> balloonTextColor too. I took a look but get lost again in morph classes. Someone with the appropriate knowledge could fix it in a breeze.
>
> Hilaire
>
> Le 08/05/2018 à 15:30, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
>> git says guilty was Torsten :P
>> anyway… that’s an awful color for background on dark.
>> Why nobody realised it before? I’m using a variant of the dark theme myself and I just realised now… what changed?
>>
>
> --
> Dr. Geo
> http://drgeo.eu
>
>
>

HilaireFernandes

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

well... For me the hight contrast makes it very visible, as should be a
tooltip, and helpfull to discover feature in drgeo.

Le 09/05/2018 à 13:41, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
> thanks Hilaire,
>
> in any case yellow background for dark theme was bad:)
>
> cheers,
> Esteban

--
Dr. Geo
http://drgeo.eu

http://drgeo.eu

HilaireFernandes

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

In reply to this post by HilaireFernandes

It looks like the scenario is worst than imagined. Some morph pick up
the tooltips background color, then some other morph paint some text on
the former one, without knowing their are painting on a kind of
background tooltips.

Not even sure there is easy fix... bad.

Le 09/05/2018 à 13:17, Hilaire a écrit :
> What changed is the UITheme receive a balloonTextColor method (the fix
> I proposed), BUT some morphs in Pharo use the theme
> balloonBackgroundColor BUT NOT the assorted balloonTextColor
> (obviously as this method was just introduced).
>
> The right fix will be to makes these morphs using
> balloonBackgroundColor to use
> balloonTextColor too. I took a look but get lost again in morph
> classes. Someone with the appropriate knowledge could fix it in a breeze.

--
Dr. Geo
http://drgeo.eu

http://drgeo.eu

CyrilFerlicot

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

In reply to this post by HilaireFernandes

On 09/05/2018 14:32, Hilaire wrote:
> well... For me the hight contrast makes it very visible, as should be a
> tooltip, and helpfull to discover feature in drgeo.
>
>

Maybe themes could use a dictionary storing all the colors for the theme.

Like that each theme should only define the default set of colors and
applications can easily customize the themes by updating this dictonary.

--
Cyril Ferlicot
https://ferlicot.fr

Torsten Bergmann

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

In reply to this post by HilaireFernandes

Hi Hilaire,

why not make a custom "DrGeoDarkTheme" as

- a subclass of "PharoDarkTheme" (in Pharo 7)
- or "Pharo3DarkTheme" (when still in Pharo 6, note this class is deprecated in Pharo 7)

there you can overwrite the appropriate methods for your personal styled colors.

I guess this was the idea for the theming class hierarchy and to my knowledge custom theming
is used by Moose and others.

Attached is an example and you can easily switch to it using

DrGeoDarkTheme beCurrent

in your playground, startup.st, the settings or other to get the yellow tooltip back.

You can add new custom colors for Dr.Geo to this class, ... - so no dictionary needed.
Or if you like the dictionary approach you can provide it in your subclass for Dr. Geo.

Bye
T.

DrGeoTheme.cs (823 bytes) Download Attachment

HilaireFernandes

Re: who redefined the #balloonBackgroundColor for dark theme?

Hi Torsten,

This will not work. Because some morphs in the system will mix use of
theme's balloonColor and textColor, so these morphs will render as
unreadable as soon as I change (Esteban screenshot).

Anyway, I give up on that. Your lighter balloon background is good enough.

Thanks

Hilaire

Le 09/05/2018 à 16:17, Torsten Bergmann a écrit :
> why not make a custom "DrGeoDarkTheme" as
>
> - a subclass of "PharoDarkTheme" (in Pharo 7)
> - or "Pharo3DarkTheme" (when still in Pharo 6, note this class is deprecated in Pharo 7)
>

--
Dr. Geo
http://drgeo.eu

http://drgeo.eu