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A question (particularly to the Croquet architects)

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Filipe Santos-3

A question (particularly to the Croquet architects)

Hello,

I am using OpenCroquet in my PhD thesis but I am not capable of passing a certain point, which is worrying me.

I have seen that the OpenCroquet help lists are getting less posts than usual and see an increase movement in the Cobalt lists and efforts (with NSF grants responsabilites). My dout, which I have already posted in the email lists, don't get an answer which I would need to make my decisions from this point on.

Therefore I would like to ask everyone, but to the OpenCroquet architects in particular, if it easy to control avatar previledges on the current 1.0.18 SDK. My OpenCroquet application is to be used by primary schools where teachers MUST control the order by which child intervenes in the virtual world. So my scenario is this one:

- Teacher opens the Master Virtual World and children enter that world as participants.

- Teacher gives edition previledges to child A.

- Child A can edit the objects in the world (example: move their position) while other children cannot (other children will not see the "hand" handler of the objects to move them)

- Teacher then passes the edition previledges to child B and the process continues.

My question: does OpenCroquet 1.018 SDK classes allow an easy way to do this?

My current (insucessful) efforts:

- TFrame has the "currentUser" instance variable but DAS wrote on the commentary field "Probably a bad idea...". And as I explore the methods, no support to this instance variable is given.

- Maybie I could use a subclass of TFrame where, when passed with the mouse over it, would pass a message to TSpace to see if that avatar is the one with edition previledges (I could subclass TSpace to have an instance variable with all the IDs of the avatars). But I cannot see how a TFrame object could know from which avavtar did the "mouse over" message come from.

My best guess is to put inside the TSpace an object, which I would call "the magic wand" that would give the avatar holding it edition previledges (the magic wand would be the only object that would pass a "mouse over" to the several TFrames). But isn't this replicating, somehow, the function of TRay?

Can someone help me on this question? Even some general orientations would be "gold" for me at this point.

Thank you once more,

Filipe.

waufrepi III

Re: A question (particularly to the Croquet architects)

Hi Fillipe,

I don't usually post to the developers list because I am still learning how to program. I have a personal interest in your issue because I am developing croquet worlds for use in the classroom. I'm not sure your issue has to be a programming one as I would approach it as a teaching method one.

for instance if you need to limit which students are interacting with specific content in a croquet island then perhaps you can design a croquet continent with separate islands that include versions of the same content. Since you can carry objects between portals and view activity that occurs within each island from another island, maybe design a master/teacher island that looks in on other student islands. The students could then work with their own versions and then carry them into the master island for group discussion and comparison...though this might tax the system.

If this doesn't work for you, traditional classroom managent may address your issue. Just because it is a virtual classroom, it doesn't mean that the students/teachers shouldn't come up with some code of conduct and behavior within it.....this is usually what I do on the first day of class to make sure that my students understand what I expect from them in terms of behavior.

Further, a unit can be broken up into separate tasks. So maybe some students could be working on one model while others are working on another related model. this is actually a richer approach IMHO.

Not sure if this helps at all, and I hope I didn't just misunderstand your ?. thanks for putting the challenge into my head to think about.

You might try posting the question to the user list if you haven't already, for other non-programming + programming solutions.....I've been so busy so that I haven't been able to keep track of everything so i don't know if you have.

best wishes,

wfpi

On 6/5/08, Filipe Santos <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello,

I am using OpenCroquet in my PhD thesis but I am not capable of passing a certain point, which is worrying me.

I have seen that the OpenCroquet help lists are getting less posts than usual and see an increase movement in the Cobalt lists and efforts (with NSF grants responsabilites). My dout, which I have already posted in the email lists, don't get an answer which I would need to make my decisions from this point on.

Therefore I would like to ask everyone, but to the OpenCroquet architects in particular, if it easy to control avatar previledges on the current 1.0.18 SDK. My OpenCroquet application is to be used by primary schools where teachers MUST control the order by which child intervenes in the virtual world. So my scenario is this one:

- Teacher opens the Master Virtual World and children enter that world as participants.

- Teacher gives edition previledges to child A.

- Child A can edit the objects in the world (example: move their position) while other children cannot (other children will not see the "hand" handler of the objects to move them)

- Teacher then passes the edition previledges to child B and the process continues.

My question: does OpenCroquet 1.018 SDK classes allow an easy way to do this?

My current (insucessful) efforts:

- TFrame has the "currentUser" instance variable but DAS wrote on the commentary field "Probably a bad idea...". And as I explore the methods, no support to this instance variable is given.

- Maybie I could use a subclass of TFrame where, when passed with the mouse over it, would pass a message to TSpace to see if that avatar is the one with edition previledges (I could subclass TSpace to have an instance variable with all the IDs of the avatars). But I cannot see how a TFrame object could know from which avavtar did the "mouse over" message come from.

My best guess is to put inside the TSpace an object, which I would call "the magic wand" that would give the avatar holding it edition previledges (the magic wand would be the only object that would pass a "mouse over" to the several TFrames). But isn't this replicating, somehow, the function of TRay?

Can someone help me on this question? Even some general orientations would be "gold" for me at this point.

Thank you once more,

Filipe.

Filipe Santos-3

Re: A question (particularly to the Croquet architects)

Hello Waufrepi,

Thank you for your answer. My doubts are mainly programming ones but pedagogical issues also arise from the coding I will have to do.

[The next two paragraphs concern pedagogical issues and may not interest the readers of this list; please skip them if you just want to see the programming approach]
Your solution to the problem (different islands) seems to be a good way of approaching the problem, although I have to consider all the consequences. I haven't told this in my first email but my first pedagogical way of approaching the problem is to let each child edit the world that was left by the previous child. In other words, this world is to be used by teachers to promote a class decision. A child intervenes, edits the world, saves it and then other child continues editing from there. He can then save it, etc, etc... What may be the advantage of this? If I show the saved worlds as small cubes in the space, following the line by which each child edited his own I get a linear structure that shows visually to the child what a collaboration process is (a sequence of "versions"). This may also give the child more sense of ownership of the final configuration as he sees that this configuration was reached from his (and others) previous work. Seeing the linear tree of version a child never has the sensation that his version was deleted, rather it is saved and used to reach a consensus. But Waufrepi as you say this is a pedagogical issue, not programming one, and should be discussed in other list. I would love to change impressions and opinions with you and see your current work. Please contact me if you would like!
So the different islands approach may not solve completely my problem has editing islands happen concurrently in time (not in a linear way). But I'll study your solution as you might be giving me a full solution that I still don't comprehend (I'll read carefully every line you wrote).

[Now the programming approach:]
My new approach (a quick hint from my PhD supervisor) : I am studying the CroquetEvent class as it has in it a avatarID as a instance variable. As I see it, every time an object gets an event (let's say a mouse event) a message is passed to it with an instance of the CroquetEvent class, where the avatar is identified... I have been struggling with this for a month but a now it seems to be the natural/opencroquet way.
I am still not getting the results I would like, but it seems that this is the path to follow.

Any suggestions are still very welcome!

Thank you,
Filipe.

2008/6/6 waufrepi III <[hidden email]>:

Hi Fillipe,

I don't usually post to the developers list because I am still learning how to program. I have a personal interest in your issue because I am developing croquet worlds for use in the classroom. I'm not sure your issue has to be a programming one as I would approach it as a teaching method one.

for instance if you need to limit which students are interacting with specific content in a croquet island then perhaps you can design a croquet continent with separate islands that include versions of the same content. Since you can carry objects between portals and view activity that occurs within each island from another island, maybe design a master/teacher island that looks in on other student islands. The students could then work with their own versions and then carry them into the master island for group discussion and comparison...though this might tax the system.

If this doesn't work for you, traditional classroom managent may address your issue. Just because it is a virtual classroom, it doesn't mean that the students/teachers shouldn't come up with some code of conduct and behavior within it.....this is usually what I do on the first day of class to make sure that my students understand what I expect from them in terms of behavior.

Further, a unit can be broken up into separate tasks. So maybe some students could be working on one model while others are working on another related model. this is actually a richer approach IMHO.

Not sure if this helps at all, and I hope I didn't just misunderstand your ?. thanks for putting the challenge into my head to think about.

You might try posting the question to the user list if you haven't already, for other non-programming + programming solutions.....I've been so busy so that I haven't been able to keep track of everything so i don't know if you have.

best wishes,

wfpi

On 6/5/08, Filipe Santos <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hello,

I am using OpenCroquet in my PhD thesis but I am not capable of passing a certain point, which is worrying me.

I have seen that the OpenCroquet help lists are getting less posts than usual and see an increase movement in the Cobalt lists and efforts (with NSF grants responsabilites). My dout, which I have already posted in the email lists, don't get an answer which I would need to make my decisions from this point on.

Therefore I would like to ask everyone, but to the OpenCroquet architects in particular, if it easy to control avatar previledges on the current 1.0.18 SDK. My OpenCroquet application is to be used by primary schools where teachers MUST control the order by which child intervenes in the virtual world. So my scenario is this one:

- Teacher opens the Master Virtual World and children enter that world as participants.

- Teacher gives edition previledges to child A.

- Child A can edit the objects in the world (example: move their position) while other children cannot (other children will not see the "hand" handler of the objects to move them)

- Teacher then passes the edition previledges to child B and the process continues.

My question: does OpenCroquet 1.018 SDK classes allow an easy way to do this?

My current (insucessful) efforts:

- TFrame has the "currentUser" instance variable but DAS wrote on the commentary field "Probably a bad idea...". And as I explore the methods, no support to this instance variable is given.

- Maybie I could use a subclass of TFrame where, when passed with the mouse over it, would pass a message to TSpace to see if that avatar is the one with edition previledges (I could subclass TSpace to have an instance variable with all the IDs of the avatars). But I cannot see how a TFrame object could know from which avavtar did the "mouse over" message come from.

My best guess is to put inside the TSpace an object, which I would call "the magic wand" that would give the avatar holding it edition previledges (the magic wand would be the only object that would pass a "mouse over" to the several TFrames). But isn't this replicating, somehow, the function of TRay?

Can someone help me on this question? Even some general orientations would be "gold" for me at this point.

Thank you once more,

Filipe.