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Sebastian Sastre-2

Class hierarchy topology

Hi there,

after about a year of switching from Dolphin Smalltalk to Squeak as
main development platform I still miss to see the hierarchy of classes as
primary way to navigate the classes in the image.

Searching the web I've found Whiskler Browser seems to have (at
least for classes) the kind of view I miss but I was unable to make it work
in the 3.10 nor 3.9 images. It loads but when I want to browse a class it
brings a debugger with: MultiSelectHierarchicalListMorph DNU
totalScrollRange

I love to see the categories *and* hierarchy in, unlike the alt-h
browser, a dynamic navigational way. It helps me to think about the topology
in a way categorized classes will never do. It's a birds eye view which I
need so I can understand the forest shape instead of seeing just groups of
trees. I think the two views are very important for ST developers.

Have I alternatives to whisker?

Other browsers that uses as main class navigation pane a tree kind
of view (ala explorer)?

thanks,

Sebastian Sastre
PD: until now I'm using standard tools plus autocompletion and shout

Colin Putney

Re: Class hierarchy topology

On 5-Feb-08, at 12:30 PM, Sebastian Sastre wrote:

> Other browsers that uses as main class navigation pane a tree kind
> of view (ala explorer)?

OmniBrowser doesn't use a tree widget, but it does using indenting to
indicate the inheritance hierarchy. I quite like it.

Colin

Sebastian Sastre-2

RE: Class hierarchy topology

Hi Colin,

I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that it's a framework
to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a variant of it so
it have a tree view instead of the idented one?

cheers,

Sebastian Sastre

> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] En
> nombre de Colin Putney
> Enviado el: Miércoles, 06 de Febrero de 2008 03:43
> Para: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
> Asunto: Re: Class hierarchy topology
>
>
> On 5-Feb-08, at 12:30 PM, Sebastian Sastre wrote:
>
> > Other browsers that uses as main class navigation pane
> a tree kind of
> > view (ala explorer)?
>
> OmniBrowser doesn't use a tree widget, but it does using
> indenting to indicate the inheritance hierarchy. I quite like it.
>
> Colin
>

Alain Plantec

Re: Class hierarchy topology

In reply to this post by Sebastian Sastre-2

On Tuesday 05 February 2008 21:30, Sebastian Sastre wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> after about a year of switching from Dolphin Smalltalk to Squeak as
> main development platform I still miss to see the hierarchy of classes as
> primary way to navigate the classes in the image.
>
> Searching the web I've found Whiskler Browser seems to have (at
> least for classes) the kind of view I miss but I was unable to make it work
> in the 3.10 nor 3.9 images. It loads but when I want to browse a class it
> brings a debugger with: MultiSelectHierarchicalListMorph DNU
> totalScrollRange
>
> I love to see the categories *and* hierarchy in, unlike the alt-h
> browser, a dynamic navigational way. It helps me to think about the
> topology in a way categorized classes will never do. It's a birds eye view
> which I need so I can understand the forest shape instead of seeing just
> groups of trees. I think the two views are very important for ST
> developers.
>
> Have I alternatives to whisker?

you can try Tamaris.
alain
>
> Other browsers that uses as main class navigation pane a tree kind
> of view (ala explorer)?
>
> thanks,
>
> Sebastian Sastre
> PD: until now I'm using standard tools plus autocompletion and shout

Sebastian Sastre-2

RE: Class hierarchy topology

I'm starting to use it. I think it do the job,

thanks!

Sebastian Sastre

> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] En
> nombre de Alain Plantec
> Enviado el: Miércoles, 06 de Febrero de 2008 13:17
> Para: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
> Asunto: Re: Class hierarchy topology
>
> On Tuesday 05 February 2008 21:30, Sebastian Sastre wrote:
> > Hi there,
> >
> > after about a year of switching from Dolphin Smalltalk
> to Squeak as
> > main development platform I still miss to see the hierarchy
> of classes
> > as primary way to navigate the classes in the image.
> >
> > Searching the web I've found Whiskler Browser seems to
> have (at least
> > for classes) the kind of view I miss but I was unable to
> make it work
> > in the 3.10 nor 3.9 images. It loads but when I want to
> browse a class
> > it brings a debugger with: MultiSelectHierarchicalListMorph DNU
> > totalScrollRange
> >
> > I love to see the categories *and* hierarchy in, unlike
> the alt-h
> > browser, a dynamic navigational way. It helps me to think about the
> > topology in a way categorized classes will never do. It's a
> birds eye
> > view which I need so I can understand the forest shape instead of
> > seeing just groups of trees. I think the two views are very
> important
> > for ST developers.
> >
> > Have I alternatives to whisker?
> you can try Tamaris.
> alain
> >
> > Other browsers that uses as main class navigation pane
> a tree kind of
> > view (ala explorer)?
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > Sebastian Sastre
> > PD: until now I'm using standard tools plus autocompletion and shout
>

David Röthlisberger

Re: Class hierarchy topology

In reply to this post by Sebastian Sastre-2

> I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that it's a framework
> to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a variant of it so
> it have a tree view instead of the idented one?

Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has implemented a tree view for
OmniBrowser.
He can certainly tell you more.

David

Juraj Kubelka-3

Re: Class hierarchy topology

Hi!

OK. I will merge my changes back to OB repository and anyone can play with it. But there are conceptual issues I haven't solved yet. I will merge it by tomorrow and post some notes.

Jura

On Feb 8, 2008 2:17 PM, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that it's a framework
> to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a variant of it so
> it have a tree view instead of the idented one?

Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has implemented a tree view for
OmniBrowser.
He can certainly tell you more.

David

Sebastian Sastre-2

RE: Class hierarchy topology

Ahh this is good news. A traditional browser with a tree view will be
refreshing. In fact the Whisker browser has an excelent left part. If you
see a Whisker browser it uses the entire left vertical pane to show you the
hierarchy in a tree view and a tree view of categorized classes, so you use
the most convenient path to reach your interest. The rest of whisker I don't
like. The stack of code and class details moving by stacking here and there
is just too distractive. You need fix things to think deep. It also have a
very poor contrast so it promotes eye exaustion quickly. Also you loose
shout coulouring.

Ideal for me will be a browser like the one we have but instead of the
classes categories it could have the left of whisker using the whole
vertical size. I prefer to be able to reach classes from categories *and*
hierarchy by loosing some surface for code than poor classes accessibility
an a lot of, most of the time, sub-used surface for 1-4 lines of code in 90%
of code.

Pragmatical conclusion: the actual browser with a tree view would be a step
forward,

cheers,

Sebastian Sastre

________________________________

De: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] En nombre de Juraj
Kubelka
Enviado el: Viernes, 08 de Febrero de 2008 11:42
Para: David Röthlisberger
CC: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
Asunto: Re: Class hierarchy topology

Hi!

OK. I will merge my changes back to OB repository and anyone can
play with it. But there are conceptual issues I haven't solved yet. I will
merge it by tomorrow and post some notes.

Jura

On Feb 8, 2008 2:17 PM, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that
it's a framework
> to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a
variant of it so
> it have a tree view instead of the idented one?

Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has
implemented a tree view for
OmniBrowser.
He can certainly tell you more.

David

David Röthlisberger

Re: Class hierarchy topology

In reply to this post by Juraj Kubelka-3

> OK. I will merge my changes back to OB repository and anyone can play
> with it. But there are conceptual issues I haven't solved yet.

I would be interested in knowing what these issues are?

David

> On Feb 8, 2008 2:17 PM, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>
> > I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that it's a
> framework
> > to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a
> variant of it so
> > it have a tree view instead of the idented one?
>
> Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has implemented a
> tree view for
> OmniBrowser.
> He can certainly tell you more.
>
> David
>
>

Petr Polasek

Re: Class hierarchy topology

On 2/9/08, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> > OK. I will merge my changes back to OB repository and anyone can play
> > with it. But there are conceptual issues I haven't solved yet.
>
> I would be interested in knowing what these issues are?
>
> David
>
> > On Feb 8, 2008 2:17 PM, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]
> > <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
> >
> >
> > > I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that it's a
> > framework
> > > to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a
> > variant of it so
> > > it have a tree view instead of the idented one?
> >
> > Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has implemented a
> > tree view for
> > OmniBrowser.
> > He can certainly tell you more.
> >
> > David
> >
> >
>
>
>
>

--
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Sebastian Sastre-2

RE: Class hierarchy topology

In reply to this post by Juraj Kubelka-3

Hi Jura,

can you specify the repository you mention so I can take a look?

thanks,

Sebastian Sastre

________________________________

De: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] En nombre de Juraj
Kubelka
Enviado el: Viernes, 08 de Febrero de 2008 11:42
Para: David Röthlisberger
CC: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
Asunto: Re: Class hierarchy topology

Hi!

OK. I will merge my changes back to OB repository and anyone can
play with it. But there are conceptual issues I haven't solved yet. I will
merge it by tomorrow and post some notes.

Jura

On Feb 8, 2008 2:17 PM, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that
it's a framework
> to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a
variant of it so
> it have a tree view instead of the idented one?

Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has
implemented a tree view for
OmniBrowser.
He can certainly tell you more.

David

Juraj Kubelka-3

Re: Class hierarchy topology

Hi Sebastian,

sorry, I am late. There was a really sunny weather :-)

So, about my work, results and issues:

1. Source codes:

- repository: http://www.squeaksource.com/JKExperiments.html

- ob-dev: http://source.wiresong.ca/ob

- packages:

- OmniBrowser-jk.408

- OB-Morphic-lr.45

- OB-Standard-jk.325

- OB-TraitsIntegration-jk.41

- packages with sUnit tests (necessary because of tests in

OB-TraitsIntegration-jk.41)

- OB-Tests-Core-cwp.65

- OB-Fake-lr.9

- Bogus-cwp.18

- BogusInfo-cwp.17

- OB-Tests-Standard-dr.86

2. Check out:

- OBTraitsBrowser openOnClass: ClassDescription selector: #addInstVarName:.

- OBTraitsBrowser openOnClass: ClassDescription.

3. Basic implementation motivation

- It is possible to set tree navigation for an OBMetaEdge.

See: OBTraitMetagraphBuilder>>populateTraitFilterInTree

There is a new property for OBMetaEdge called navigate (instvar)

and new classes OBDefaultEdgeNavigation and OBTreeEdgeNavigation

which defines navigation. Every OBNode has also instvar

navigate. It is set during children gathering (see

OBMetaEdge>>nodesForParent:). So, how it works:

If `OBTraitsBrowser openOnClass: ClassDescription` is executed,

a Subtree collects OBFan(s). After that OBColumn(s) is/are

adjusted (see OBSubtree>>selectInColumns:). There are some

changes. Every column is responsible for adjusting of next

column (see #nextColumnWithFan:selection:,

#columnAfter:withFan:selection:). An OBNode's navigate instvar

helps do decide which navigation to use (see

OBFan>>columnAfter:selection:).

There is OBTreeColumn instead of OBColumn which can hold more

fans (OBFan).

4. The present state and issues

Generally it works except switches. There is a lot of garbage,

which may breaks something, but after clarifying of some issues i

am planning to write everything from scratch again (i mean tree

navigation part).

1. Switches

Actually I do not know how to handle switches (e.g. buttons |

instance | ? | class |). There are 3 basic situations:

1. node has only default edges (no tree edges)

There is no problem. It behaves just like now. Buttons are

in column with the node as parent node.

2. node has both default and tree edges

I have no idea how to handle it. Ignore tree edges?

Duplicate buttons?

3. node has only tree edges

It is quite clear i think. Buttons are displayed if parent

node is selected in the parent node's column.

2. OBColumn vs. OBTreeColumn (Tree navigation in core OmniBrowser

package)

If it is wanted to integrate tree navigation to the core,

OBTreeColumn should be dissolved to OBColumn. And the same with

a view presentation (a Morphic classes). Should i focus on it?

Do we want to have a tree capable morph as default graphic

representation?

Thanks for any comments.

Jura

On Feb 11, 2008 1:39 PM, Sebastian Sastre <[hidden email]> wrote:

Hi Jura,

can you specify the repository you mention so I can take a look?

thanks,

Sebastian Sastre

________________________________

De: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] En nombre de Juraj
Kubelka
Enviado el: Viernes, 08 de Febrero de 2008 11:42
Para: David Röthlisberger
CC: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
Asunto: Re: Class hierarchy topology

Hi!

OK. I will merge my changes back to OB repository and anyone can
play with it. But there are conceptual issues I haven't solved yet. I will
merge it by tomorrow and post some notes.

Jura

On Feb 8, 2008 2:17 PM, David Röthlisberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm not yet familiar to OmniBrowser but I read that
it's a framework
> to make browsers. Do you think could be feasible to make a
variant of it so
> it have a tree view instead of the idented one?

Isn't Juraj Kubelka working on that? I think he has
implemented a tree view for
OmniBrowser.
He can certainly tell you more.

David