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MVC song

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timrowledge

MVC song

http://mikezornek.com/archives/2003/07/17/wwdcs_mvc_song.php

tim
--
tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
Esc key to reboot Universe, or any other key to continue...

Edgar J. De Cleene

Re: MVC song

tim Rowledge puso en su mail :

> http://mikezornek.com/archives/2003/07/17/wwdcs_mvc_song.php
>
> tim
> --
> tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
> Esc key to reboot Universe, or any other key to continue...

When the Morphic song or the Tweak song ?
I wish the full album ...

Edgar

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Hiren Thacker

Re: MVC song

also the croquet song :)

Ralph Johnson

Re: MVC song

The problem is that the song is NOT about Smalltalk MVC. In this
song, the controller is a layer between the view and the model, which
usually means it is a mediator. The song also says that the
controller is copying values from one field to another, which also
indicates that it is a mediator. However, in true MVC, the controller
is a strategy for handling events. The events come directly to it,
rather than to the view. The controller changes the model, but it is
not notified by the model. When the user presses a key or moves the
mouse, the controller receives the event. It checks with the view to
map mouse locations into model coordinates, then interacts directly
with the model. If it changes the model then the model notifives all
dependents (observers), which notifes the view, which redisplays.

The song desribes Ivar Jacobson's Model/Interface/Control, in which
the Control is responsible for an entire use case. It is not MVC.
Jacobson's model is like the MVC model, but his Interface is a
combination of View and Controller and his Control is not at all like
a real Controller.

-Ralph Johnson

dcorking

Re: MVC song

Thanks for the explanation Ralph.

On 7/17/06, Ralph Johnson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> The problem is that the song is NOT about Smalltalk MVC. In this
> song, the controller is a layer between the view and the model, which
> usually means it is a mediator. ...

> The song desribes Ivar Jacobson's Model/Interface/Control, in which
> the Control is responsible for an entire use case. It is not MVC.
> Jacobson's model is like the MVC model, but his Interface is a
> combination of View and Controller and his Control is not at all like
> a real Controller.

Has anyone seen a longer article that compares several different MVC
and Model/Interface/Control design strategies, as used in, say an
Apple GUI, a Struts Web app and in Smalltalk MVC / Morphic / Tweak /
Seaside? I would like to understand the Smalltalk heritage for
current UI implementation practices, and see code samples or
pseudocode for where they differ.

If so, I would love to read such an article.

I know the best way would be to build my own and judge how
maintainable they are, but I am not motivated to learn Java and
Objective-C :)

karl-8

Re: MVC song

David Corking skrev:

> Thanks for the explanation Ralph.
>
> On 7/17/06, Ralph Johnson <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The problem is that the song is NOT about Smalltalk MVC. In this
>> song, the controller is a layer between the view and the model, which
>> usually means it is a mediator. ...
>
>> The song desribes Ivar Jacobson's Model/Interface/Control, in which
>> the Control is responsible for an entire use case. It is not MVC.
>> Jacobson's model is like the MVC model, but his Interface is a
>> combination of View and Controller and his Control is not at all like
>> a real Controller.
>
> Has anyone seen a longer article that compares several different MVC
> and Model/Interface/Control design strategies, as used in, say an
> Apple GUI, a Struts Web app and in Smalltalk MVC / Morphic / Tweak /
> Seaside? I would like to understand the Smalltalk heritage for
> current UI implementation practices, and see code samples or
> pseudocode for where they differ.
>
> If so, I would love to read such an article.
>
> I know the best way would be to build my own and judge how
> maintainable they are, but I am not motivated to learn Java and
> Objective-C :)
>
>

MVC was implemented in Smalltalk in the late seventies by Trygve Reenskaug,
he's on this list. Here is his homepage:

http://heim.ifi.uio.no/~trygver/themes/mvc/mvc-index.html

karl

Edgar J. De Cleene

Re: MVC song

In reply to this post by timrowledge

tim Rowledge puso en su mail :

> Esc key to reboot Universe, or any other key to continue...
>
http://fusionanomaly.net/beginnersguidetoconstructingtheuniverse.html

This universe Tim ?, the whole site is intringuing...

___________________________________________________________
1GB gratis, Antivirus y Antispam
Correo Yahoo!, el mejor correo web del mundo
http://correo.yahoo.com.ar

dcorking

Re: MVC song

In reply to this post by karl-8

On 7/17/06, karl <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > I would like to understand the Smalltalk heritage for
> > current UI implementation practices, and see code samples or
> > pseudocode for where they differ.
> >
> > If so, I would love to read such an article.

> MVC was implemented in Smalltalk in the late seventies by Trygve Reenskaug,
> he's on this list. Here is his homepage:
>
> http://heim.ifi.uio.no/~trygver/themes/mvc/mvc-index.html

Thank you Karl - that is exactly what I wanted - and more. Trygve has
plenty of papers on his site that give me all the information I need.
I should not have been surprised to see that the problem for the first
MVC patterns were proposed was not the same as the problems to which
its descendants are applied now.

I am intrigued to see that Tryvge has alternative design patterns in
mind in his current work, that I will have to read about later.