[Morphic] I wish know when was the last image in what Nebraska performs as designed

I send direct to this list because I don't have response to  mails what I
send to morphic - list

I continue trying to figure the elusive unloading of Nebraska.

In several different images I have problems.

In particular, in NebraskaServer comment you read.

To start a server, execute the following code:
    NebraskaServerMorph serveWorld: World

To start a client, run the following in another image:
    NetworkTerminalMorph openAndConnectTo: 'servername'

This don't work in 3.6, 3.7, 3.8 or 3.9, so I wish advice

Very thanks.

Edgar



       

       
               
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On 18.01.2006, at 11:21, Lic. Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:


My guess is that Nebraska is just broken for a long time.
I don't think that anyone is using it actively.

     Marcus

Marcus Denker wrote:
Tried the squeakland image? IIRC I think it is working there...

Chrisp

Hi Edgar,

I used Nebraska in a 3.6 image with Seaside to remote control the  
application
and it worked well. The only drawback is that you must set morphic to  
move window
with full redrawing, IIt doesn't work well when window are fast moved  
(only edges redrawn).

I think this is an elegant and simple solution to control remote images.
This is bad to loose this feature even if VNC could be a replacement but
is a more heavyweight solution.

I will try Nebraska in images > 3.6

Alain


On 18 janv. 06, at 11:21, Lic. Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:

On 18.01.2006, at 11:29, chrisp wrote:

>>>
>> My guess is that Nebraska is just broken for a long time.
>> I don't think that anyone is using it actively.
>>     Marcus
>
> Tried the squeakland image? IIRC I think it is working there...
>

Which reminds me that the squeakland image contains fixes
that should definitely be added to 3.9a...

     Marcus

chrisp puso en su mail :

> Tried the squeakland image? IIRC I think it is working there...
>
> Chrisp
Nope.
The question goes because we wish unload from official image.

On trying to do a clean unload, I do a small reorganization and , as Juan
suggest, a subclass of WorldState whose only existence is in this case.
I doing all kind of experiments, including Internet Nebraska for seeing what
happened.

Removing via Monticello, lets Obsolete things what I try to chase .

As Markus said, maybe is time to remove, and  change to NetMorphs via to
loading from SM.

Edgar



       

       
               
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Alain Fischer puso en su mail :
Alain, thanks.
Nebraska works if you use chat, send objects, and for many things.
The case what I saying don't only don't work, your image blows to console
debugger.
Try yourself and see



       

       
               
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  Marcus and Edgar,

> My guess is that Nebraska is just broken for a long time.
> I don't think that anyone is using it actively.

  While I agree with this, Nebraska does work in the Squeakland image.

  Also note that it doesn't work if the evil Squeaky Mouse is on the
server screen.  To try it, create a new Morphic project first.

-- Yoshiki

Yoshiki Ohshima puso en su mail :

>   While I agree with this, Nebraska does work in the Squeakland image.
>
>   Also note that it doesn't work if the evil Squeaky Mouse is on the
> server screen.  To try it, create a new Morphic project first.
>
> -- Yoshiki

Yoshiki :

Very thanks.

If NebraskaServerMorph serveWorld: World don't blow the image (as happened
to my 3.6, 3.7, 3.8 and 3.9), then Markus should integrate on the main, as
he said

I do a new unload/load .mcz Monticello and if all works, we could unload and
let the package on SqueakMap for someone to maintain.

I was able to load the last what I do, Nebraska-edc.7.mcz on SqueakLight
(what of course know nothing about).

The tools what work in normal Squeak, as chat and listener , are working and
tomorrow I do final test .

Related questions about Nebraska what perhaps you know.

1) Is possible have two images on same machine? (I can't do this)

2) Is possible use Nebraska when one of users is behind a proxy, router or
other (I can do one way sending)

Thanks in advance.

Edgar



       

       
               
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  Edgar,

> If NebraskaServerMorph serveWorld: World don't blow the image (as happened
> to my 3.6, 3.7, 3.8 and 3.9), then Markus should integrate on the main, as
> he said

  It shouldn't have any technical obstacle to port the code from
Squeakland to fix 3.8 and 3.9.  As long as the Squeaky mouse is not on
screen, it should work.

  Yes.  You can simply use 127.0.0.1 as the server address.

> 2) Is possible use Nebraska when one of users is behind a proxy, router or
> other (I can do one way sending)

  Nebraska uses only one connection from client to server, so if the
server (server port) is visible to client, it it possible.

-- Yoshiki

On 24.01.2006, at 04:28, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:

Why were the fixes from squeakland never be integrated in 3.8? I  
would guess
that especially the internatialalization related fixed would be quite  
important even
for Tweak.

Especially strange is that you back then just loaded the  
Connectors.sar without caring
about all the extensions it does. This looks to me looks like a  
recipe for desaster.

Did squeakland at all contact the smallland people to discuss about a  
shared code base?
It does no sound very good to ignore the largest squeak-in-schools  
project outside of japan,
especially for bug fixes and improvements for work with older kids.

The biggest problem is, I think, that this gives a really bad  
impression to people...

     Marcus

Yoshiki Ohshima puso en su mail :

>  Yes.  You can simply use 127.0.0.1 as the server address.
I repeat something what I do a while ago.

1) Take a fresh Squeak3.6-5429-basic.image and changes, duplicate via OS X
for having Squeak3.6-5429-basic copy.image and changes.

2) Open each in a different VM

3) Open a Listener and a Badge on both

Messages seems go one way only, to a first of both what I turn the Listener
on.

If I change to my regular IP , the behavior is the same.
What I usually do is grab one Ellipse, star or similar from flaps, throw to
Badge and watch the object showing on Listener

>   Nebraska uses only one connection from client to server, so if the
> server (server port) is visible to client, it it possible.

Similar situations. With a couple of friends, they could send me messages ,
but when I try to reply to they , a no connection to x.x.x.x message shows

Any Ideas ?

Thanks in advance.

edgar



       

       
               
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  Hi, Marcus,

> >   It shouldn't have any technical obstacle to port the code from
> > Squeakland to fix 3.8 and 3.9.  As long as the Squeaky mouse is not on
> > screen, it should work.
>
> Why were the fixes from squeakland never be integrated in 3.8? I  
> would guess
> that especially the internatialalization related fixed would be quite  
> important even
> for Tweak.

  Note, however, that the 3.8 release
*does* contain bunch of changes from former Squeakland image.  (Thanks
to Michael.)

  It is just a slow process and, the possible "3.8.1" is a good time
to merge some changes between them.

> Especially strange is that you back then just loaded the  
> Connectors.sar without caring
> about all the extensions it does. This looks to me looks like a  
> recipe for desaster.

  I'm not sure about the issue you described.

> Did squeakland at all contact the smallland people to discuss about a  
> shared code base?

  We do.

> It does no sound very good to ignore the largest squeak-in-schools  
> project outside of japan,
> especially for bug fixes and improvements for work with older kids.

  We don't ignore it.

> The biggest problem is, I think, that this gives a really bad  
> impression to people...

  I'm not sure about this.  If we consider these different
"distributions" or some sort, it is not as bad as that.

  I don't oppose to communicate and move the patches around images.
But how often is a bit different question.

-- Yoshiki

  Edgar,

> 1) Take a fresh Squeak3.6-5429-basic.image and changes, duplicate via OS X
> for having Squeak3.6-5429-basic copy.image and changes.
>
> 2) Open each in a different VM
>
> 3) Open a Listener and a Badge on both

  Evaluate:

        NebraskaServerMorph serveWorld: World

on one side, and open the badge on the other side.  Type 127.0.0.1
into the badge, and press 'S' button.

-- Yoshiki

Am 30.01.2006 um 21:20 schrieb Yoshiki Ohshima:

>   Hi, Marcus,
>
>> Especially strange is that you back then just loaded the
>> Connectors.sar without caring
>> about all the extensions it does. This looks to me looks like a
>> recipe for desaster.
>
>   I'm not sure about the issue you described.

When connectors were loaded into the Squeakland image, we did not  
notice that the SAR also installed a gazillion patches for various  
system methods. It would have been much easier to fix at that time,  
but we only noticed it a few dozens changesets later. It was a major  
pain to weed out the changes afterwards, and I'm pretty sure we're  
not done, yet.

Well, such things happen. Bad luck.

- Bert -

I see.
Now the question for us is how can we (without losing too much time)  
incorporate the change made in Squeakland
into 3.9.
Any idea besides going step by step over all the changes?
Gloops.

Stef

stéphane ducasse wrote:
> I see.
> Now the question for us is how can we (without losing too much time)  
> incorporate the change made in Squeakland
> into 3.9.
> Any idea besides going step by step over all the changes?
> Gloops.

I already collected all the changes, including the ones the connector
stuff did to system classes.
My plan is to file those into a 3.8 to get the real diffs and work with
Marcus and the others on what and how incorporate the stuff into 3.9 or
3.8.1 where appropriate.
Just came back from C5 in Berkeley, so hopefully I will find time end of
this week.

Michael

Yoshiki Ohshima puso en su mail :

This works, exact as you said. ( in 3.8 Extremadura image used by Diego for
his new book).
And maybe that is the last image in what Nebraska performs as designed.

I find the attached walkback in 3.9.6705, try to found if I can fix.
Still wonder why the communication is one side only in the other cases I
send.

Very, very thanks.

Edgar

Excellent. Let me know if you need help.

Stef

On 31 janv. 06, at 10:33, Michael Rueger wrote:

  Edgar,

> This works, exact as you said. ( in 3.8 Extremadura image used by Diego for
> his new book).
> And maybe that is the last image in what Nebraska performs as designed.

  Good.

> I find the attached walkback in 3.9.6705, try to found if I can fix.
> Still wonder why the communication is one side only in the other cases I
> send.

  Three fixes in Squeakland
(http://www.squeakland.org/installers/SqueakPluginImage-dev.zip and
update stream for it):

0503NebraskaText-yo
0506nebraskaBuffer2-yo
0525NebraskaFontSet

  should fix the problem you described here.

-- Yoshiki