Andreas.Raab
New Win32 VM [m17n testers needed] –
Hi Folks -
Thanks to some dedicated OLPC-related work done in Greece by Chris
Petsos[1], we now have a Windows VM with Unicode support enable...
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Alexander Lazarevic'
I just did a quick test out of curiosity. I did an "update code from
server" on a rather old image (Squeak3.9gamma [latest update: #706...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
> I'm interested in reports, both good and bad about whether the
> clipboard, file, directory and input support behaves as expected.
Aft...
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Andreas.Raab
Yes, I just fixed that. A left-over call to CreateDirectoryA() would
make directory creation impossible and later file creation attempts as
we...
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Andreas.Raab
Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> What I couldn't get working is the listing of file names in the
> file browser. To reproduce, create file names u...
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Andreas.Raab
Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> What I couldn't get working is the listing of file names in the
> file browser. To reproduce, create file names u...
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Andreas.Raab
I have fixed the problem with directory creation and updated the VM to
3.10.2 which is up in the usual places:
http://www.squeakvm.org/win32/...
Yoshiki Ohshima
Martin,
> What I couldn't get working is the listing of file names in the
> file browser. To reproduce, create file names using Greek,...
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Chris Petsos
> The file path interpretation works on Japanese Windows (see the file
> name pane in the attached picture) by changing the
> fileName...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Chris,
> Don't forget that the VM is sending unicode chars as the sixth data member
> of the event buffer.
Sure. I looked at th...
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Andreas.Raab
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
>> Cause, there have been used Windows functions that convert WCHAR streams
>>
>> MultiByteToWideC...
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Chris Petsos
>> Japanese locale specific question... does a unicode Japanese character
>> fit
>> inside a WCHAR struct?
>
> It do...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
>> What I couldn't get working is the listing of file names in the
>> file browser. To reproduce, create file names using Greek, Cyri...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
>> What I don't understand is: Why do I have to set the language
>> environment (*) to make it work? It's Unicode, so Squeak
>&...
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Andreas.Raab
Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>> Hm ... there isn't any easy way to test this I guess?
>
> It's actually very easy.
>
> 1. Creat...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Martin,
> >> What I don't understand is: Why do I have to set the language
> >> environment (*) to make it work? It's Unic...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Monday 04 June 2007 12:08 am, Andreas Raab wrote:
> "Windows VMs always use UTF8-encoded file names now"
> Smalltalk pl...
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Bert Freudenberg
On Jun 4, 2007, at 12:49 , subbukk wrote:
> On Monday 04 June 2007 12:08 am, Andreas Raab wrote:
>> "Windows VMs always use...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Monday 04 June 2007 4:28 pm, Bert Freudenberg wrote:
> > .. filename encoding
> > depends on
> > filesystem, not the VM pl...
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Bert Freudenberg
On Jun 4, 2007, at 15:48 , subbukk wrote:
> On Monday 04 June 2007 4:28 pm, Bert Freudenberg wrote:
>>> .. filename encoding
>...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
> The conditional is incorrect and unnecessary. filename encoding depends on
> filesystem, not the VM platform.
On a bad operating syst...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
>>> Because it is Unicode, a mechanism out of scope of Unicode has to
>>> supply language information to do sensible stuff.
...
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Andreas.Raab
New Win32 VM (3.10.3) –
Hi Folks -
[cc: v3dot10 for consideration of related fixes]
After a few more rounds of fixes and debugging (incl. the
unicodification of t...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
> Right, but take a look at the codepage parameter of the functions
>
> http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms776413.aspx
>...
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Andreas.Raab
Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> MultiByteToWideChar certainly works for Japanese code pages, such
> as 932 (Japanese Shift-JIS). It works for all...
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Andreas.Raab
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> The file path interpretation works on Japanese Windows (see the file
> name pane in the attached picture) by ch...
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Damien Cassou-3
Hi Andreas,
I'm not part of the release team, but if they are consistent, and I
think they are, they will request unit tests from you before t...
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Andreas.Raab
Damien Cassou wrote:
> I'm not part of the release team, but if they are consistent, and I
> think they are, they will request unit tests ...
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Bert Freudenberg
On Jun 5, 2007, at 7:02 , Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> a) why do I have to configure my image myself to set the language?
> (couldn't Squ...
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Gary Chambers-4
Hi there, looks like this stuff is just in time for the project I'm working
on!
A couple of problems so far though. Seems that when the Ctrl k...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Tuesday 05 June 2007 10:25 am, Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>It would actually be good if the VM would guarantee UTF-8 file
> names on all sy...
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Edgar J. De Cleene
El 6/5/07 2:16 AM, "Andreas Raab" <andreas.raab@...> escribió:
> Hi Folks -
>
> [cc: v3dot10 for consideratio...
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Ralph Johnson
> I think this is a good candidate to get any pending fixes into 3.10 - I
> have posted the list of required fixes to Mantis and would like...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Martin,
> Ok. However, this still doesn't answer the questions:
> a) why do I have to configure my image myself to set the language?
...
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Andreas.Raab
Ralph Johnson wrote:
>> I think this is a good candidate to get any pending fixes into 3.10 - I
>> have posted the list of required ...
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Takashi Yamamiya
Hi Andreas,
When I started Squeakland image with new vm on the desktop (I
extracted SqueakVM-Win32-3.10.3-bin.zip, and dragged
SqueakPlugin.i...
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Andreas.Raab
I just did the same without any problems. Can you check to see whether
that was a one-time problem or if a different image file works. And if
...
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"Martin v. Löwis"
> I'm looking forward to someone explaining to me how to write unit tests
> that test the file system encodings and clipboard interface in ...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
I think what Takashi meant was to put an image file on the "desktop",
which is translated to Katakana characters on Japanese Windows,...
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Andreas.Raab
Ah! Indeed this doesn't seem to work correctly. I'll have a look at it.
Cheers,
- Andreas
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
>
> I think...
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Andreas.Raab
Hi Takashi -
The latest version (3.10.4) fixes this and many related problems. Turns
out that there were still plenty of places in the whole ...
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Takashi Yamamiya
Hi Andreas,
It works with new VM,
http://www.squeakvm.org/win32/release/SqueakVM-Win32-3.10.4-bin.zip
Good. I still got primitive failed in S...
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Lex Spoon-3
subbukk <subbukk@...> writes:
> On Tuesday 05 June 2007 10:25 am, Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> >It would actually be good if the VM w...
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K. K. Subramaniam
UTF8 Squeak (was Re: New Win32 VM [m17n testers needed]) –
On Wednesday 06 June 2007 5:54 pm, Lex Spoon wrote:
> Yes, it would seem to simplify matters to use UTF-8 consistently for
> interfacing b...
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David Mitchell-10
I'd start with Pavel's kernel image:
http://www.comtalk.net/Squeak/98
If you google Pavel kernel image you can find discussion
On 6/7/07, s...
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Andreas.Raab
subbukk wrote:
> On Wednesday 06 June 2007 5:54 pm, Lex Spoon wrote:
>> Yes, it would seem to simplify matters to use UTF-8 consistentl...
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Janko Mivšek
I don't know details but I hope that UTF8 Squeak means full Unicode in
image and UTF-8 just on the "borders", to OS, to files etc?
...
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K. K. Subramaniam
Re: UTF8 Squeak –
On Thursday 07 June 2007 10:00 pm, Janko Mivšek wrote:
> I don't know details but I hope that UTF8 Squeak means full Unicode in
> image an...
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Alan L. Lovejoy
RE: UTF8 Squeak –
Each String object should specify its encoding scheme. UTF-8 should be the
default, but all commonly-encounterd encodings should be supported, a...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Subbu,
At Thu, 7 Jun 2007 19:26:14 +0530,
subbukk wrote:
>
> On Wednesday 06 June 2007 5:54 pm, Lex Spoon wrote:
> > Yes, it...
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Andreas.Raab
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> It might be just a matter of self-defence, but I still think that
> the way we did it (i.e., not change the VM ...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
> Each String object should specify its encoding scheme. UTF-8 should be the
> default, but all commonly-encounterd encodings should be su...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Subbu,
> > I don't know details but I hope that UTF8 Squeak means full Unicode in
> > image and UTF-8 just on the "borders&...
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J J-6
RE: UTF8 Squeak –
Wouldn't that be a pretty big speed impact given how much strings are used?
>From: "Alan Lovejoy" <squeak-dev.sourcery@...>
...
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Janko Mivšek
Because I'm coming from VisualWorks world, let me explain a bit how the
Unicode support is solved there:
1. internally everything is in 16bit...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
It is so true that I should've looked at the class names in VW
before doing everything...
> 1. internally everything is in 16bit Unicode,...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Yoshiki,
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> It is so true that I should've looked at the class names in VW
> before doing everything...
>...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Hi, Janko,
> >> 1. internally everything is in 16bit Unicode, without any additionally
> >> encoding info attached to ...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Yoshiki,
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
>>>> 1. internally everything is in 16bit Unicode, without any additionally
>>>> ...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Janko,
> > So, the question to you is that if you have a system with 8-bit
> > ByteString and 32-bit WideString in year 2007, ...
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Alan L. Lovejoy
RE: UTF8 Squeak –
<Alan L>Each String object should specify its encoding scheme. UTF-8 should
> be the default, but all commonly-encounterd encodin...
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Alan L. Lovejoy
<Alan L>UTF-8 should be the default</Alan L>
<J J (Jason)>Wouldn't that be a pretty big speed impact given how much
strings ...
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Tapple Gao
On Thu, Jun 07, 2007 at 08:16:21PM -0700, Alan Lovejoy wrote:
> It is already the case that accessing individual characters from a String
>...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Alan,
> Well, perhaps UTF-32 would be a better default, now that I think about
> it--due to performance issues for accessing character...
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Lukas Renggli
Just as a side-note: In Seaside the encoding and decoding turns out to
be very complicated and expensive. In fact so expensive, that almost
nob...
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Andreas.Raab
Lukas Renggli wrote:
> Just as a side-note: In Seaside the encoding and decoding turns out to
> be very complicated and expensive. In fac...
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Lukas Renggli
> > Just as a side-note: In Seaside the encoding and decoding turns out to
> > be very complicated and expensive. In fact so expensi...
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Andreas.Raab
Lukas Renggli wrote:
>> But is that a property of 1) Seaside or 2) Squeak or 3) UTF-8? If the
>> first, just fix it ;-) If the secon...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Friday 08 June 2007 1:25 am, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
..
> > Well, UTF8 is just an encoding of Unicode code points, So, Squeak will
>...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Friday 08 June 2007 2:41 am, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> However, there is a reason to call our stuff m17n, instead of i18n.
> It might ...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Friday 08 June 2007 11:28 am, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> > Of course, for some encodings (such as UTF-8) there would probably be a
> &...
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Nicolas Cellier-3
Lukas Renggli <renggli <at> gmail.com> writes:
>
> Another issue I observed is that Characters in Squeak have an
> inco...
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Colin Putney
On Jun 7, 2007, at 11:55 PM, Andreas Raab wrote:
> How about trying to improve the speed of conversions? You seem to
> imply that th...
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stephane ducasse
Colin
Could you say the difference between WidString and UTF-8 (UTF-8 would
a specialized WideString?).
I got bitten by these encodings pro...
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Philippe Marschall
2007/6/9, stephane ducasse <stephane.ducasse@...>:
> Colin
>
> Could you say the difference between WidString and UTF-8 (UTF-8 w...
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Colin Putney
On Jun 9, 2007, at 12:24 AM, stephane ducasse wrote:
> Could you say the difference between WidString and UTF-8 (UTF-8
> would a spe...
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Janko Mivšek
Philippe Marschall wrote:
>> I got bitten by these encodings problems and having a nice solution
>> would be good.
> Well, there...
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Philippe Marschall
2007/6/9, Janko Mivšek <janko.mivsek@...>:
> Philippe Marschall wrote:
> >> I got bitten by these encodings problems and having ...
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Janko Mivšek
Image as a database (was Re: UTF8 Squeak) –
Hi Phillipe,
Philippe Marschall wrote:
> 2007/6/9, Janko Mivšek <janko.mivsek@...>:
>> Philippe Marschall wrote:
>> All...
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Lukas Renggli
> I admit that I came from VW where I'm running quite a number of web apps
> on images which servers also as a sole database and that just ...
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Alan L. Lovejoy
RE: UTF8 Squeak –
<Philippe>Well, there is what the evil language with J does: UCS2
everywhere, no excuses. This is a bit awkward for characters outside the ...
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Ramiro Diaz Trepat
If you run applications that don't need to execute transactions or
care a lot to lose some part of the objects if the application
crashes, and y...
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tblanchard
FWIW, I believe this is how NSString works on the Mac and it has been
unicode capable for a very long time.
On Jun 9, 2007, at 1:54 PM, Alan...
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Janko Mivšek
Janko Mivšek wrote:
> I would propose a hibrid solution: three subclasses of String:
>
> 1. ByteString for ASCII (native english spea...
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Colin Putney
On Jun 10, 2007, at 3:55 AM, Janko Mivšek wrote:
> I think that this way we can achieve most efficient yet fast
> support for all la...
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K. K. Subramaniam
Re: UTF8 Squeakn –
On Saturday 09 June 2007 6:59 am, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> It is incomplete in many ways. Sure. But that wasn't the issue you
> were r...
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Andreas.Raab
Hi Janko -
Just as a comment from the sidelines I think that concentrating on the
size of the character in an encoding is a mistake. It is re...
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Michael van der Gulik-2
On 6/10/07, Janko Mivšek <janko.mivsek@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Phillipe,
>
> Philippe Marschall wrote:
> > 2007/6/9, Janko...
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Philippe Marschall
2007/6/11, Michael van der Gulik <mikevdg@...>:
>
>
> On 6/10/07, Janko Mivšek <janko.mivsek@...> wrote:
> > Hi Phillip...
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K. K. Subramaniam
On Monday 11 June 2007 2:44 am, Andreas Raab wrote:
> Hi Janko -
>.... this "encoding-driven" view of
> strings makes it per...
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Klaus D. Witzel
On Mon, 11 Jun 2007 09:15:16 +0200, subbukk wrote:
> On Monday 11 June 2007 2:44 am, Andreas Raab wrote:
>> Hi Janko -
>> .... t...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Andreas,
Let me start with a statement that Unicode is a generalization of ASCII.
ASCII has code points < 128 and therefore always fits...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Colin,
Colin Putney wrote:
>
> On Jun 10, 2007, at 3:55 AM, Janko Mivšek wrote:
>
>> I think that this way we can achie...
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Bert Freudenberg
So except for the missing 16-bit optimization this is exactly as we
do have now, right? So what is the actual proposal?
- Bert -
On Jun 1...
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Janko Mivšek
Bert Freudenberg wrote:
> So except for the missing 16-bit optimization this is exactly as we do
> have now, right? So what is the actual...
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NorbertHartl
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 12:35 +0200, Janko Mivšek wrote:
> Hi Andreas,
>
> Let me start with a statement that Unicode is a generalizati...
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Colin Putney
On Jun 11, 2007, at 4:04 AM, Janko Mivšek wrote:
> Anyone can definitively stay with UTF8 encoded strings in plan
> BytString or sub...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Janko,
> It seems that this was already a Yoshiki idea with WideString, so I'm
> just extending that idea with a TwoByteString to cov...
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Michael Rueger-4
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> Janko,
>
>> It seems that this was already a Yoshiki idea with WideString, so I'm
>> just exten...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Hi, Michael,
> > - Suppose you would like to use different line wrapping algorithms
> > for different languages, how would...
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Javier Diaz-Reinoso
On 11/06/2007, at 13:27, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> Janko,
>
>> It seems that this was already a Yoshiki idea with WideString, so...
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Klaus D. Witzel
On Mon, 11 Jun 2007 21:29:54 +0200, Javier Diaz-Reinoso wrote:
...
> perhaps in Squeak is different (no alignment?), but if I doIt:
> (...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Colin,
Colin Putney wrote:
>
> On Jun 11, 2007, at 4:04 AM, Janko Mivšek wrote:
>
>> Anyone can definitively stay with ...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Yoshiki,
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> Janko,
>
>> It seems that this was already a Yoshiki idea with WideString, so I'm
>...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Javier,
Javier Diaz-Reinoso wrote:
> About 2 months ago in the OpenMCL mailing list have this UTF16 vs. UTF32
> discussion:
>...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Janko,
> Consider image as a database where you store strings from your
> application. In that case space efficient but still manipul...
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Andreas.Raab
Janko Mivšek wrote:
>> so, all of this talk is for about 4 MB extra (in that image squeak
>> take 26.8 MB at startup)?.
>
>...
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Colin Putney
On Jun 11, 2007, at 1:31 PM, Janko Mivšek wrote:
>> Is that a fair characterization of your position?
> Yes, or just a bit better s...
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Bert Freudenberg
On Jun 12, 2007, at 8:29 , Colin Putney wrote:
> Your proposal is actually to have strings encoded as ISO 8859-1,
> UCS-2 or UCS-4.
...
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Michael Rueger-4
Bert Freudenberg wrote:
> Also, the "purity" of Unicode strings does not translate directly into
Speaking of which...
In Soph...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Michael,
> Speaking of which...
> In Sophie we discovered that Squeak still uses a not quite unicode
> mapping in the text conver...
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Bert Freudenberg
On Jun 12, 2007, at 18:32 , Michael Rueger wrote:
> Bert Freudenberg wrote:
>
>> Also, the "purity" of Unicode string...
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Michael Rueger-4
Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> That was to keep the image on Windows VM happy. The table is the
> "reverse" of the one in the Win...
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Nicolas Cellier-3
Michael Rueger a écrit :
> Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
>
>> That was to keep the image on Windows VM happy. The table is the
>&g...
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Nicolas Cellier-3
nicolas cellier a écrit :
>
> Otherwise, Squeak is not unicode internally for some of the characters
> from 128 to 255, and this con...
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Yoshiki Ohshima
Nicolas,
> Both Bert and Yoshiki are right, but to be more precise, this is the
> latin1 code page from dos (CP1252) see
> http:...
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Janko Mivšek
Hi Andreas,
Here is an analysis of one VW "image as a database" which runs a
document portal for quality management system of one o...
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Colin Putney
On Jun 12, 2007, at 4:28 AM, Bert Freudenberg wrote:
> On Jun 12, 2007, at 8:29 , Colin Putney wrote:
>
>
>> Your proposal ...
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Masashi UMEZAWA-2
Hi Janko,
> >> 1. internally everything is in 16bit Unicode, without any additionally
> >> encoding info attached to str...
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Andreas.Raab
Colin Putney wrote:
> If a String were a flat array of Unicode code points, it would be
> implemented in Smalltalk as an array of Charact...
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Andreas.Raab
Hi Janko,
Thanks for the numbers, that's quite interesting to see. It seems that
the total increase in image size would be roughly 10% all th...
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Nicolas Cellier-3
Andreas Raab <andreas.raab <at> gmx.de> writes:
>
> Colin Putney wrote:
> > If a String were a flat array of Unicode...
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Bert Freudenberg
On Jun 13, 2007, at 1:31 , Colin Putney wrote:
> On Jun 12, 2007, at 4:28 AM, Bert Freudenberg wrote:
>
>
>> On Jun 12, 2007,...