Porting Squeak to iPod touch

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Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Mathieu SUEN
Hi All,

Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for an  
ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a ARM  
processor.

Thanks

        Mth




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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

timrowledge

On 8-Jan-08, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for an  
> ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a ARM  
> processor.

It's C code. Aside from a few tiny bits in the FFIPlugin you won't  
find much processor dependent stuff around. My guess is that if you  
compiled a Mac VM with the iTouch switch (or whatever) flipped it  
ought to do the job.

Of course, first you have to have the tools to compile *anything* for  
iPhone/iTouch/etc. Have they released them yet?


tim
--
tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
World Ends at Ten! Pictures at 11 on Fox News!



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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Brian Rice
In reply to this post by Mathieu SUEN

On Jan 8, 2008, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen wrote:

> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for an  
> ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a ARM  
> processor.


I've had an iPhone for 3 months now and have been occasionally trying  
to build Squeak for it (and it runs the same binaries as the iPod  
Touch). It is definitely fast enough (400MHz) but Squeak would require  
some modifications to handle application switching which seems to shut  
things down. I want the Faure (http://www.squeaksource.com/Faure)  
framework to run on it and use the Layers system (core animation,  
basically, over OpenGLES) but haven't gotten to step one yet, for  
reasons described below:

You need a cross-compile toolchain, provided by hackers here:
http://iphone.fiveforty.net/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
http://code.google.com/p/iphone-dev/

There are a lot of applications built or ported using this method, but  
there's no support from Apple, so debugging is very difficult. Alas,  
toolchain issues have vexed me nearly every time I try to tackle the  
problem. Apparently everyone who creates a working toolchain is more-
or-less lucky and can't rebuild it on demand. There are also  
outstanding (often not universally reproducible) bugs for specific  
platforms, too. See the Google Code issues tracker if you have a  
problem.

Apple has stated intentions of delivering an SDK/toolchain in  
February, but the notion of application signing and security  
restrictions may make this not-open-enough for Squeak to ease in.

--
-Brian
http://briantrice.com


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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Mathieu SUEN
In reply to this post by timrowledge

On Jan 8, 2008, at 5:18 PM, tim Rowledge wrote:

>
> On 8-Jan-08, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
>> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for  
>> an ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a  
>> ARM processor.
>
> It's C code. Aside from a few tiny bits in the FFIPlugin you won't  
> find much processor dependent stuff around. My guess is that if you  
> compiled a Mac VM with the iTouch switch (or whatever) flipped it  
> ought to do the job.
>
> Of course, first you have to have the tools to compile *anything*  
> for iPhone/iTouch/etc. Have they released them yet?

Nop but I have found jailbreak. It is suppose let you write  
application for the ipod or iphone:
http://jailbreakme.com/1.1.2/
http://www.tuaw.com/2007/11/11/1-1-2-jailbreak-software-released/


>
>
>
> tim
> --
> tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
> World Ends at Ten! Pictures at 11 on Fox News!
>
>
>

        Mth




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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Bert Freudenberg
On Jan 8, 2008, at 18:07 , Mathieu Suen wrote:

> On Jan 8, 2008, at 5:18 PM, tim Rowledge wrote:
>
>> On 8-Jan-08, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
>>> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for  
>>> an ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a  
>>> ARM processor.
>>
>> It's C code. Aside from a few tiny bits in the FFIPlugin you won't  
>> find much processor dependent stuff around. My guess is that if  
>> you compiled a Mac VM with the iTouch switch (or whatever) flipped  
>> it ought to do the job.
>>
>> Of course, first you have to have the tools to compile *anything*  
>> for iPhone/iTouch/etc. Have they released them yet?
>
> Nop but I have found jailbreak. It is suppose let you write  
> application for the ipod or iphone:
> http://jailbreakme.com/1.1.2/
> http://www.tuaw.com/2007/11/11/1-1-2-jailbreak-software-released/

This only allows you to *run* third-party applications. This is much  
easier than *compile* an app. See Brian's message.

- Bert -



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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Mathieu SUEN
In reply to this post by Brian Rice
Thanks a lot
On Jan 8, 2008, at 5:41 PM, Brian Rice wrote:

>
> On Jan 8, 2008, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen wrote:
>
>> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
>> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for  
>> an ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a  
>> ARM processor.
>
>
> I've had an iPhone for 3 months now and have been occasionally  
> trying to build Squeak for it (and it runs the same binaries as the  
> iPod Touch). It is definitely fast enough (400MHz) but Squeak would  
> require some modifications to handle application switching which  
> seems to shut things down. I want the Faure (http://www.squeaksource.com/Faure 
> ) framework to run on it and use the Layers system (core animation,  
> basically, over OpenGLES) but haven't gotten to step one yet, for  
> reasons described below:
>
> You need a cross-compile toolchain, provided by hackers here:
> http://iphone.fiveforty.net/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
> http://code.google.com/p/iphone-dev/
>
> There are a lot of applications built or ported using this method,  
> but there's no support from Apple, so debugging is very difficult.  
> Alas, toolchain issues have vexed me nearly every time I try to  
> tackle the problem. Apparently everyone who creates a working  
> toolchain is more-or-less lucky and can't rebuild it on demand.  
> There are also outstanding (often not universally reproducible) bugs  
> for specific platforms, too. See the Google Code issues tracker if  
> you have a problem.
>
> Apple has stated intentions of delivering an SDK/toolchain in  
> February, but the notion of application signing and security  
> restrictions may make this not-open-enough for Squeak to ease in.
>
> --
> -Brian
> http://briantrice.com
>
>

        Mth




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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Dane Jensen
In reply to this post by Mathieu SUEN
One would hope it'd be possible. My question is how well would it  
integrate? Is the ObjectiveCPlugin current and can it play nice with  
the cocoa on the iPod? Dunno.

But I'd love to find out!

-Dane

Sent from my iPod Touch


On Jan 8, 2008, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for an  
> ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a ARM  
> processor.
>
> Thanks
>
>    Mth
>
>
>
>

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Re: Porting Squeak to iPod touch

Kevin Driedger
In reply to this post by Brian Rice
Can you describe more about the application switching problem?  Is the iPhone operating system using round robin multitasking or preemptive?  What do you mean by "shutting things down"?  Is the OS forcing a process yield?

Do you have some preliminary binaries that one could play with?  What are you developing on OSX?

]{evin


Brian Rice wrote
On Jan 8, 2008, at 8:01 AM, Mathieu Suen wrote:

> Dose anyone have try to install/port Squeak on a ipod touch?
> The ipod have a ARM processor IIRC there is a version running for an  
> ARM processor. So I should be able to compile the source for a ARM  
> processor.


I've had an iPhone for 3 months now and have been occasionally trying  
to build Squeak for it (and it runs the same binaries as the iPod  
Touch). It is definitely fast enough (400MHz) but Squeak would require  
some modifications to handle application switching which seems to shut  
things down. I want the Faure (http://www.squeaksource.com/Faure)  
framework to run on it and use the Layers system (core animation,  
basically, over OpenGLES) but haven't gotten to step one yet, for  
reasons described below:

You need a cross-compile toolchain, provided by hackers here:
http://iphone.fiveforty.net/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
http://code.google.com/p/iphone-dev/

There are a lot of applications built or ported using this method, but  
there's no support from Apple, so debugging is very difficult. Alas,  
toolchain issues have vexed me nearly every time I try to tackle the  
problem. Apparently everyone who creates a working toolchain is more-
or-less lucky and can't rebuild it on demand. There are also  
outstanding (often not universally reproducible) bugs for specific  
platforms, too. See the Google Code issues tracker if you have a  
problem.

Apple has stated intentions of delivering an SDK/toolchain in  
February, but the notion of application signing and security  
restrictions may make this not-open-enough for Squeak to ease in.

--
-Brian
http://briantrice.com