RE: [V3dot10] Release team problems; Draft Pavel

> From: Klaus D. Witzel
> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 8:45 AM
>
> All,
>
> I have the same concern regarding Ralph's silence. But the release team is
> organized, there is an official liason with the board (most likely also
> reading this list).
>
> If Ralph does not respond to your message (say, within 48 hours or so)
> then the next hierarchy has to be involved. You'll need to prepare a
> consise message (when was last communication, what was last action, if
> appropriate) in order to not require the liason to find that out by
> himself.
>
> /Klaus
>
> On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 13:55:18 +0100, Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
> >
> >
> > El 2/18/07 9:45 AM, "Pavel Krivanek" <[hidden email]>
> escribió:
> >
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> as I see it, the ability to work of the release team is very limited
> >> now. Ralph doesn't communicate and steps of next team members seems to
> >> be uncoordinated.
> >>
> >> So I would like to ask you how do you want to solve it.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> -- Pavel
> >
> > Was me what ask Ralph email you for having a board and email private
> > also.
> >
> > It's very sad for me what I have a process and a image from december 12.
> > That's and the whole process what I dream converge at some point with
> > MinimalMorphic was stopped when Ralph stop emailing.
> > And I very tired to do things what must go back and never see light.
> > I have access to all sites now, but don't wish put something what again
> > must
> > go back.
> >
> > So , I could do things if people in charge trust me and if I do mistakes
> > could improve at some point.
> > Or we could wait until Ralph shows.
> >
> > What you think?
> >
> > Edgar

> All,
>
> It seems to me that Pavel has spent a great deal of time creating images
> that are very useful for the community.  Most people respect and trust
> Pavel's work.  For example I saw recently that Avi's work is based on a
> previous Pavel image.
>
> Since the release team is having some difficulty getting going, I was
> wondering if we could not try to encourage Pavel to join and head up the
> release team.  In my opinion Pavel is the obvious choice.  I'd be interested
> in what other members of the Squeak Community think.
>
> If we were able to get Pavel to take the job would the current board support
> this change?  What do the new candidates for the board think?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ron Teitelbaum
>
>
> > From: Klaus D. Witzel
> > Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 8:45 AM
> >
> > All,
> >
> > I have the same concern regarding Ralph's silence. But the release team is
> > organized, there is an official liason with the board (most likely also
> > reading this list).
> >
> > If Ralph does not respond to your message (say, within 48 hours or so)
> > then the next hierarchy has to be involved. You'll need to prepare a
> > consise message (when was last communication, what was last action, if
> > appropriate) in order to not require the liason to find that out by
> > himself.
> >
> > /Klaus
> >
> > On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 13:55:18 +0100, Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > El 2/18/07 9:45 AM, "Pavel Krivanek" <[hidden email]>
> > escribió:
> > >
> > >> Hi all,
> > >>
> > >> as I see it, the ability to work of the release team is very limited
> > >> now. Ralph doesn't communicate and steps of next team members seems to
> > >> be uncoordinated.
> > >>
> > >> So I would like to ask you how do you want to solve it.
> > >>
> > >> Cheers,
> > >> -- Pavel
> > >
> > > Was me what ask Ralph email you for having a board and email private
> > > also.
> > >
> > > It's very sad for me what I have a process and a image from december 12.
> > > That's and the whole process what I dream converge at some point with
> > > MinimalMorphic was stopped when Ralph stop emailing.
> > > And I very tired to do things what must go back and never see light.
> > > I have access to all sites now, but don't wish put something what again
> > > must
> > > go back.
> > >
> > > So , I could do things if people in charge trust me and if I do mistakes
> > > could improve at some point.
> > > Or we could wait until Ralph shows.
> > >
> > > What you think?
> > >
> > > Edgar
>
>

> All,
>
> It seems to me that Pavel has spent a great deal of time creating  
> images
> that are very useful for the community.  Most people respect and trust
> Pavel's work.  For example I saw recently that Avi's work is based  
> on a
> previous Pavel image.
>
> Since the release team is having some difficulty getting going, I was
> wondering if we could not try to encourage Pavel to join and head  
> up the
> release team.  In my opinion Pavel is the obvious choice.  I'd be  
> interested
> in what other members of the Squeak Community think.
>
> If we were able to get Pavel to take the job would the current  
> board support
> this change?  What do the new candidates for the board think?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ron Teitelbaum
>
>
>> From: Klaus D. Witzel
>> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 8:45 AM
>>
>> All,
>>
>> I have the same concern regarding Ralph's silence. But the release  
>> team is
>> organized, there is an official liason with the board (most likely  
>> also
>> reading this list).
>>
>> If Ralph does not respond to your message (say, within 48 hours or  
>> so)
>> then the next hierarchy has to be involved. You'll need to prepare a
>> consise message (when was last communication, what was last  
>> action, if
>> appropriate) in order to not require the liason to find that out by
>> himself.
>>
>> /Klaus
>>
>> On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 13:55:18 +0100, Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> El 2/18/07 9:45 AM, "Pavel Krivanek" <[hidden email]>
>> escribió:
>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> as I see it, the ability to work of the release team is very  
>>>> limited
>>>> now. Ralph doesn't communicate and steps of next team members  
>>>> seems to
>>>> be uncoordinated.
>>>>
>>>> So I would like to ask you how do you want to solve it.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -- Pavel
>>>
>>> Was me what ask Ralph email you for having a board and email private
>>> also.
>>>
>>> It's very sad for me what I have a process and a image from  
>>> december 12.
>>> That's and the whole process what I dream converge at some point  
>>> with
>>> MinimalMorphic was stopped when Ralph stop emailing.
>>> And I very tired to do things what must go back and never see light.
>>> I have access to all sites now, but don't wish put something what  
>>> again
>>> must
>>> go back.
>>>
>>> So , I could do things if people in charge trust me and if I do  
>>> mistakes
>>> could improve at some point.
>>> Or we could wait until Ralph shows.
>>>
>>> What you think?
>>>
>>> Edgar
>
> _______________________________________________
> V3dot10 mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/v3dot10

>
>
>
> El 2/18/07 2:18 PM, "Pavel Krivanek" <[hidden email]> escribió:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > for completeness' sake, here's the response by Keith Hodges who is the
> > most active release team member now:
>
> Well , he have some strong ideas what Ralph and I don't buy.
> Read carefully the mails.
>
> > less dependent on Ralph's leadership.
> I repeat have the procedure complete from December, and for have people
> happy must go back some steps.

> I publish several tentative images and have the last for remote test several
> days.
> Load some new projects also and Fabrik, all works
>
> Here I almost was burn at the stake for cook all Test relative in a
> package. Your Etoys have 2.8 mb and inside you put several things (Test
> also)
>
> I think is possible a similar .image what MinimalMorphic with my procedure
> taking normal 3.9 , applying "top rip" of existent today packages, plus Juan
> Etoys removal.
> A more small Etoys only taking yours and Etoys reload.
> What you think ?

>
>
>
> El 2/18/07 5:17 PM, "Pavel Krivanek" <[hidden email]> escribió:
>
> > I think that the priority is to detach and sort tests from the EToys
> > package and then avoid overrides in MinimalMorphic and EToys. Then it
> > will be much easier to continue in safe packaging process - do top
> > down packaging in terms of this big package. I really see no reason
> > why we should redefine MinimalMorphic (I hope that I've understood you
> > well)
>
> It's a question of what is a package and what is safe at this time.
> You have a killer in your procedure, I was a long fan of your work.
> I don't wish change MinimalMorphic.
> Only I saying what if you agree on made several parts of your EToys-pk.4.mcz
> and maybe some changes to EToysLoader-pk.8.mcz for having a image derived
> from 3.9 and have your kernel as target for 3.11.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:squeak-dev-
> [hidden email]] On Behalf Of Giovanni Corriga
> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2007 4:42 PM
> To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
> Subject: Re: [V3dot10] Release team problems; Draft Pavel
>
> Il giorno dom, 18/02/2007 alle 11.55 -0800, Todd Blanchard ha scritto:
> > I'd like to hear that someone picked up the phone and asked Ralph why
> > he's been silent first.
>
> I concur.
>
> Giovanni
>
>