RE: What does it take to buy in to Squeak (was RE: Stef's departurefrom the SqueakFoundation board)

> From: Cees De Groot
> Here's another question: why would you want a central governance model
> for Squeak?
[...]
> So, all I can see SqF doing is to make sure that people don't
> duplicate too much work, by defining some minimal core, and maybe a
> clearing house for patches or something like that.

In one sense, I would want the central governance to lie exactly in
defining and defending that minimal core.

In another sense, you're absolutely right - I shouldn't be saying there
should be exactly one of these, I should instead be saying to which one
of them I'd lend my support (such as it is) and let the OS market fight
it out.

                - Peter

Just like Cees says, Linus Torvalds is against a central governance
group in OS software projects.
You can read what he argues about design and evolution in Linux here:

http://www.uwsg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0112.0/0004.html

It was quite interesting for me.  He really likes mimicking the
organic / chaotic / biological way of  evolution.

Cheers all !


r.


On 8/19/06, Peter Crowther <[hidden email]> wrote:

"Ramiro Diaz Trepat" <[hidden email]> writes:
> Just like Cees says, Linus Torvalds is against a central governance
> group in OS software projects.
> You can read what he argues about design and evolution in Linux here:
>
> http://www.uwsg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0112.0/0004.html
>
> It was quite interesting for me.  He really likes mimicking the
> organic / chaotic / biological way of  evolution.

A good read, thanks.

However, the article talks about *design* approach, not governance.
Linus always was and AFAIK still is in favor of him and his deputies
making the final decisions.  Lots of stuff crosses the desk of these
guys, especially since the kernel design includes modules only as an
afterthought.

The design question is very interesting, for sure: what do you stick
to, and what do you let emerge over time?  However, that is no
different than an author deciding to let a novel develop where it will
instead of guiding it with an iron fist.

To put it another way, it is one thing to cede power to mysterious
forces of organic evolution, and quite another to cede power to real
human beings.  Linus does the former, but is stingy about the latter.

The Squeak community does not seem to have decided yet.  Some people
have claimed from time to time to be our new fearless leaders, but
what does that mean if lots of the older Squeak people just stop
taking part, essentially making their own communities?  Squeak's
Linuses are relatively reticent, and there is no replacement system
(democratic and/or economic) that would be automatically guided.

So, my take has always been, it would be great if a Linus stepped up,
but in the meantime, it is worth thinking very hard about systems that
can evolve reasonably without a great fearless leader.


-Lex