Re-2: Looking for good souls
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Agree. One list is enough. The combination of the list
with an well structured swiki (e.g. pier) with permanent refactored pages would help enormous. Cheers, Frank -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: Looking for good souls (22-Apr-2006 21:41) From: Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]> To: [hidden email] > I actually still think the "one-list-for-all" is best, because even > if you don't understand half of what is discussed, you at least get > to know that more advanced topics exist. > > However, I can see how a newbie might be afraid of posting some basic > question to squeak-dev. So to get new folks to participate, I'd make > it explicit in the list name that it really is okay to ask even the > dumbest questions. How about > > "squeak-newbies" > > Can't get much more inviting than that, can it? > > - Bert - > > Am 22.04.2006 um 20:49 schrieb Hans N Beck: > > > Hi, > > > > why not simply squeak-help ? > > > > Regards > > > > Hans > > > > Am 22.04.2006 um 18:58 schrieb stéphane ducasse: > > > >> sounds cool. > >>> In keeping with zen and the importance of approaching the world > >>> with "beginner's mind", I like squeak-beginners. > >> > >> > > > > > > > |
Re: Re-2: Looking for good souls
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>> stephane ducasse wrote: >>> Hi all >>> >>> I would like to have a list for newbies: squeak-starters >>> because (I see it now with my students) newbies are really afraid to post, >>> experience with python mailing-list doing the same are a success so we >>> should learn. >>> >>> Now I would like to have a couple of good souls to help me answering the >>> questions >>> on this squeak-starters mailing-list. >>> >>> So if we are 4 or 5 we win! >> >> I don't consider myself a newbie as I've been playing with Squeak for >> years and have not been shy about displaying my ignorance on this list >> for all to see. :) >> >> I'm not sure we need a new list. >> But if we do keep this list as the one list for all, we do need to make >> the Subscription page better. >> >> It says at the top: >> """ >> This is the main Squeak developers' list, which isn't restricted to any >> particular Squeak topic. It is the newest incarnation of the list >> formerly known as [hidden email]. It has been given the more specific >> name "squeak-dev" to distinguish it from other Squeak lists that are >> emerging. >> """ >> >> >> I think that it hasn't been the [hidden email] for so long that we >> should drop that comment. It isn't meaningful to most people who >> subscribe today. >> >> In this section we should make it explicitly clear that the list is for >> everyone. Maybe something like: >> >> """ >> This mailing list is a general discussion list for Squeak. >> Squeak is a multi-faceted environment providing a variety of >> applications, a development environment and the Smalltalk programming >> language. >> >> This list is for those who are interested in any area of Squeak. >> Whether you are new to Squeak or are a long-time veteran, please feel >> free to participate in friendly, productive and sometimes excited >> discussion. Don't be shy, jump on in, were here to help. >> >> For more information about Squeak go to: http://www.squeak.org >> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, view archives or for posting information see >> below. >> >> Enjoy! Squeak makes computing fun! >> """ >> >> >> Okay maybe I went overboard. :) >> >> But hey, hammer this out on the list and lets provide a better front to >> this mailing list. And then if it proves at some point to have a >> squeak-users (or somesuch) list, then we can do that. >> >> >> Jimmie >> Helping newbies is user groups task (ours do , in Spanish ). I also think Divide and Conquer seems a tactic of one Squeak hater and not from Steff !!. Lot of people do help now , for newbies and not so. If each of us answer quick and to point to questions (as usually happen), no need of new list. Swiki improve slowly, and new sites only add fragmentation and no help. And having newbies here maybe have the effect of masters nod loose perpective. Edgar __________________________________________________ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis! ¡Abrí tu cuenta ya! - http://correo.yahoo.com.ar |
Re: Re-2: Looking for good souls
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On 23/04/06, Lic. Edgar J. De Cleene <[hidden email]> wrote:
Which mean you find completely appropriate that a newbie wanting just to *learn* then also receive ~ 1000 mails per month in his mailbox related to devel- Debug report -hacking VM :)) Well at least this confort me in my "prediction" that Squeak-smalltalk will mainly remain a platform for researchers/hackers That's OK I guess ... francois |
re: how to communicate with beginners
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Hi-- Edgar writes: > If each of us answers questions quickly and to the point (as usually > happens), there's no need for a new list. François responds: > Which means you find it completely appropriate that a newbie wanting > just to *learn* then also receive ~1000 mails per month in his > mailbox related to [advanced topics]. I think the best way to participate in squeak-dev is with a newsreader connected to Gmane's gateway to/from the list[1]. Any decent newsreader (such as the one in Mozilla Thunderbird) can display messages grouped by threads, and one can easily filter out undesired threads. I find reading squeak-dev this way goes much faster than reading most normal mailing lists, even low-traffic ones. I unsubscribed from the squeak-dev mailing list years ago. A "real" USENET newsgroup gets a lot more junk messages, but with this setup we get the benefits of a newsreading interface without that junk. I also think it's better to keep beginning and advanced people speaking in the same space when it's easy to do, so I wouldn't make a new list. Beginners frequently do the teaching. :) I wouldn't put them in a separate place. It's not broken; don't fix it. It would be good, though, let people know about gmane on the squeak-dev subscription page. I'd go so far as to encourage people to use gmane instead of email for squeak-dev. Some people actually need to use batch email because they lack interactive net access, but most don't. François continues: > Well at least this comforts me in my "prediction" that Squeak > Smalltalk will mainly remain a platform for researchers/hackers. It's what we make of it! I think we can make Squeak much more than it is. I have a different prediction, and I'm working to make it happen[2]. thanks, -C [1] Use "news.gmane.org" as your news server, and subscribe to the "gmane.comp.lang.smalltalk.squeak.general" group. For more information about Gmane (including more detail about why it's a good idea), see http://gmane.org/. [2] http://netjam.org/spoon [3] I find the terms "newbie" and "wannabe" rather degrading. There's no need for hazing. :) We're all learning. I prefer "beginner". -- Craig Latta improvisational musical informaticist www.netjam.org Smalltalkers do: [:it | All with: Class, (And love: it)] |
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