Re: Eyetracking VS BCI (eyetracking could make hires HMD)

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Re: Eyetracking VS BCI (eyetracking could make hires HMD)

Doug Thompson-7
Re: [croquet-user] Eyetracking VS BCI (eyetracking could make hires HMD) Sounds like a plug-in for the following Les (they call them Web 2.0 dressing rooms...personally, I’d prefer to have some place where I’m not twittering and texting trying to figure out whether to buy that pair of jeans, but then I hate shopping)...


IconNicholson's Social Retailing(SM) concept, first unveiled at the National Retail Federation's (NRF) BIG show at the Javits Center in New York City in January 2007, answers the question that retailers are pondering for the future of their business: How do you engage the digi-savvy youth audience in a cool and unique way while expanding your retail sales and reach?

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techinnovations/2007-01-18-high-tech-dressing-rooms_x.htm
http://www.iconnicholson.com/nrf07/

:)

Doug Thompson
RTC Health
67 Mowat Ave, 441
Toronto, ON M6K 3E3
416.413.7910 ext 203
*RTC Health is a division of R T Communications Inc.

Important: The Information in this e-mail belongs to RTC Health, a division of R T Communications Inc., and is intended for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed, and may contain information that is privileged, confidential, or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of, or reliance on, the contents of this e-mail is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us immediately by replying back to the sending e-mail address, and delete this e-mail message from your computer.



From: Les <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: <[hidden email]>, Les <[hidden email]>
Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2008 14:45:25 -0500
To: <[hidden email]>, PAUL SHELDON <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [croquet-user] Eyetracking VS BCI (eyetracking could make hires HMD)

On Thu, 2008-02-21 at 09:50 -0800, PAUL SHELDON wrote:
> --- "deadgenome -.,.-*`*-.,.-*`*-"
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > you move the projection source to physically match
> > the direction your
> > eye is looking...
> Yes that is what I meant to try to convey or instruct.
> > off the top of my head I can think
> > of several
> > arrangements of optics that could accomplish this.
> >
> Fantastic. I think you understand the idea I was
> trying to convey.
> The eye would track the image that was behind the
> sampling screen
> and the pixels would interleave precluding the need
> for high resolution
> sampling screen by time multiplexing of interleaved
> pixels on retina
> if you want to think about retinas or more difficult
> stuff
> if you want to think of vision systems in the brain
> like Bell Labs did.
Yet another option is shading to move the perspective from one pixel to
the next.  Think of a black line running at some arbitrary angle.  When
the line is at precisely 45 degrees (or whatever is appropriate for the
ratio of length to height of pixels), the line is directly drawn.  If
the line runs at some other angle, the pixels on either side are shaded
approprately to the gamma factor and shade approprate to interperolate
the actual line.  Although the actual hardware resolution doesn't
change, the eye perceives a smoother and more "real life" line rather
than a  pixelated image.

In 3d this is generally accomplished by calculating the radiance factor
given the relative angles of each facet contributing to the edge.  A
similar effect is used to smooth the compound curves for pixelated 3d
images.

There is no reason this could not be used with coarser displays (reduced
pixel counts).  But today, with small screens on PDA's and other
devices, it won't be long before head mounted displays can be megapixel,
full color and quite small.  

 One use is via a DMD IC (produced by TI) mounted in the frame of
eye-wear that will project an image onto the inside of the lens (first
surface).  This surface could be coated to reduce reflective
interference with the real world, and it would be possible to overlay VR
onto the real world.  Think about a home walk through where your
furniture could be featured in the rooms as you walk through.  Clothing
that could be shown on your body via a VR mirror, or other commercial
applications.

 A means of achieving polar coordinates appropriate to the room could be
a light bar on some wall, viewed by a camera in the headset, similar to
the WII.

 How's that for a good application?

Regards,
Les H




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Re: Eyetracking VS BCI (eyetracking could make hires HMD)

Howard Stearns-3
Does this actually work, or, um, does the emperor have no clothes?

There's a video and slide show at the second link, but it doesn't  
seem to show anything more than a very crude overlay. E.g.:
   No morphing or folding of the cloth to body type or movement.
   No filling in of textures from the person (e.g., to try on a  
swimsuit while wearing a turtleneck).

Magicians have had the overlay part working for at least a hundred  
years...

-H


On Feb 21, 2008, at 2:19 PM, Doug Thompson wrote:

> Sounds like a plug-in for the following Les (they call them Web 2.0  
> dressing rooms...personally, I’d prefer to have some place where  
> I’m not twittering and texting trying to figure out whether to buy  
> that pair of jeans, but then I hate shopping)...
>
>
> IconNicholson's Social Retailing(SM) concept, first unveiled at the  
> National Retail Federation's (NRF) BIG show at the Javits Center in  
> New York City in January 2007, answers the question that retailers  
> are pondering for the future of their business: How do you engage  
> the digi-savvy youth audience in a cool and unique way while  
> expanding your retail sales and reach?
>
> http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techinnovations/2007-01-18-high- 
> tech-dressing-rooms_x.htm
> http://www.iconnicholson.com/nrf07/
>
> :)
>
> Doug Thompson
> RTC Health
> 67 Mowat Ave, 441
> Toronto, ON M6K 3E3
> 416.413.7910 ext 203
> *RTC Health is a division of R T Communications Inc.
>
> Important: The Information in this e-mail belongs to RTC Health, a  
> division of R T Communications Inc., and is intended for the use of  
> the individual or entity to which it is addressed, and may contain  
> information that is privileged, confidential, or exempt from  
> disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended  
> recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying,  
> distribution, or use of, or reliance on, the contents of this e-
> mail is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error,  
> please notify us immediately by replying back to the sending e-mail  
> address, and delete this e-mail message from your computer.
>
>
> From: Les <[hidden email]>
> Reply-To: <[hidden email]>, Les <[hidden email]>
> Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2008 14:45:25 -0500
> To: <[hidden email]>, PAUL SHELDON <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [croquet-user] Eyetracking VS BCI (eyetracking could  
> make hires HMD)
>
> On Thu, 2008-02-21 at 09:50 -0800, PAUL SHELDON wrote:
> > --- "deadgenome -.,.-*`*-.,.-*`*-"
> > <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > you move the projection source to physically match
> > > the direction your
> > > eye is looking...
> > Yes that is what I meant to try to convey or instruct.
> > > off the top of my head I can think
> > > of several
> > > arrangements of optics that could accomplish this.
> > >
> > Fantastic. I think you understand the idea I was
> > trying to convey.
> > The eye would track the image that was behind the
> > sampling screen
> > and the pixels would interleave precluding the need
> > for high resolution
> > sampling screen by time multiplexing of interleaved
> > pixels on retina
> > if you want to think about retinas or more difficult
> > stuff
> > if you want to think of vision systems in the brain
> > like Bell Labs did.
> Yet another option is shading to move the perspective from one  
> pixel to
> the next.  Think of a black line running at some arbitrary angle.  
> When
> the line is at precisely 45 degrees (or whatever is appropriate for  
> the
> ratio of length to height of pixels), the line is directly drawn.  If
> the line runs at some other angle, the pixels on either side are  
> shaded
> approprately to the gamma factor and shade approprate to interperolate
> the actual line.  Although the actual hardware resolution doesn't
> change, the eye perceives a smoother and more "real life" line rather
> than a  pixelated image.
>
> In 3d this is generally accomplished by calculating the radiance  
> factor
> given the relative angles of each facet contributing to the edge.  A
> similar effect is used to smooth the compound curves for pixelated 3d
> images.
>
> There is no reason this could not be used with coarser displays  
> (reduced
> pixel counts).  But today, with small screens on PDA's and other
> devices, it won't be long before head mounted displays can be  
> megapixel,
> full color and quite small.
>
>  One use is via a DMD IC (produced by TI) mounted in the frame of
> eye-wear that will project an image onto the inside of the lens (first
> surface).  This surface could be coated to reduce reflective
> interference with the real world, and it would be possible to  
> overlay VR
> onto the real world.  Think about a home walk through where your
> furniture could be featured in the rooms as you walk through.  
> Clothing
> that could be shown on your body via a VR mirror, or other commercial
> applications.
>
>  A means of achieving polar coordinates appropriate to the room  
> could be
> a light bar on some wall, viewed by a camera in the headset,  
> similar to
> the WII.
>
>  How's that for a good application?
>
> Regards,
> Les H
>
>
>
>

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watched utube of logitech orbit cam on iPhone and also Johnny Lee's wii head tracker

Paul Sheldon-2
In reply to this post by Doug Thompson-7
The links didn't show up because not attached as text
or html,
so I did simple search looking for the same opening
scene.

For low speed access on modem, I check something out
on web
and then search in utube.

Both utube demos were an eye opener.
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Web 2.0 dressing

Paul Sheldon-2
In reply to this post by Doug Thompson-7

--- Doug Thompson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Sounds like a plug-in for the following Les (they
> call them Web 2.0 dressing
> rooms...
He gave an interesting article on market research.

While the utube on logitech orbit cam dressing a face
with an avatar
suggests virtual dressing rooms
to cut the cost of making dressing rooms bigger of the
article,
I'm not quite sure how that specific software would
work
on whole bodies. It seems to me but a small stretch to
have it work
on whole bodies.

Maya has a feature called cloth which uses physics to
simulate
how clothes would fit or hair hang.

So, we have visualized possible new markets for VR
here by going to utube demo movies. Pretty stimulating!