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Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

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Andreas.Raab

Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

Bert Freudenberg wrote:
> Below that the paste from ru.wikipedia. These are actual question marks
> (ASCII 63), the Mac VM does not paste Unicode even if setting
> SqueakEncodingType to UTF-8 (only the extended clipboard plugin does this).

Fortunately, at least that part is very easy to fix. I asked our CEO if
we could release our clipboard support code back to the community and he
agreed, so find attched an sqMacUIClipBoard.c version which does support
Unicode copy/paste properly via UTF-8 (this should work as a drop-in
replacement to the existing sqMacUIClipBoard.c). Brought to you by the
friendly folks at Qwaq.

Cheers,
- Andreas

LICENSE (1K) Download Attachment

sqMacUIClipBoard.c (8K) Download Attachment

Juan Vuletich-4

Re: Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

Andreas Raab wrote:

>
>
> Bert Freudenberg wrote:
>> Below that the paste from ru.wikipedia. These are actual question
>> marks (ASCII 63), the Mac VM does not paste Unicode even if setting
>> SqueakEncodingType to UTF-8 (only the extended clipboard plugin does
>> this).
>
> Fortunately, at least that part is very easy to fix. I asked our CEO
> if we could release our clipboard support code back to the community
> and he agreed, so find attched an sqMacUIClipBoard.c version which
> does support Unicode copy/paste properly via UTF-8 (this should work
> as a drop-in replacement to the existing sqMacUIClipBoard.c). Brought
> to you by the friendly folks at Qwaq.
>
> Cheers,
> - Andreas

Thanks Andreas! This will make a lot of people happy!

BTW, the image needs to deal with different VMs using various encoding
for clipboard data. Currently, a check is made, to assume UTF-8 if on
Windows, and MacRoman elsewhere. It seems Mac will support UTF-8 soon.

I think we need a new primitive, perhaps #clipboardEncoding, or
#vmTextEncoding, that could answer UTF-8 / MacRoman / ASCII and may be
others. That would ease supporting various VMs with the same image.

WRT keyboard events, it seems not to be necessary. VMs store Unicode
keystrokes in different slots in the event buffer, than the one used for
MacRoman. So, the image can tell, right?

What do you think?

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

Andreas.Raab

Re: Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

Juan Vuletich wrote:

> BTW, the image needs to deal with different VMs using various encoding
> for clipboard data. Currently, a check is made, to assume UTF-8 if on
> Windows, and MacRoman elsewhere. It seems Mac will support UTF-8 soon.
>
> I think we need a new primitive, perhaps #clipboardEncoding, or
> #vmTextEncoding, that could answer UTF-8 / MacRoman / ASCII and may be
> others. That would ease supporting various VMs with the same image.
>
> WRT keyboard events, it seems not to be necessary. VMs store Unicode
> keystrokes in different slots in the event buffer, than the one used for
> MacRoman. So, the image can tell, right?
>
> What do you think?

Although you are technically correct, I think the days of Latin1 only
support are simply over and I would prefer to move forward and leave
them completely behind us. The best way to achieve this is when all VMs
use UTF-8 everywhere and all VMs produce Unicode input characters. The
changes to support this aren't difficult (just a bit tedious) and the
image side is trivial for those images that don't need (or want) to
support Unicode. I really don't see any value in fiddling with different
encodings since UTF-8 is both canonical and well supported.

Cheers,
- Andreas

johnmci

Re: Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

In reply to this post by Andreas.Raab

Although this allows you to deal with UTF8 characters I was hoping
that we could migrate to the extended clipboard logic that was
proposed by

http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/vm-dev/2006-April/000584.html

We successfully used that in Sophie to pull utf-8, utf-16, macroman,
and various forms of picture data, plus Finder aliases when you do cmd-
copy on a file in the Finder,
at best this is a patch towards that goal, and if it requires a new VM
and image changes, why not provide all the existing functionality so
people can copy/paste images?

Also some applications just didn't provide kUTTypeUTF8PlainText so the
logic would review the available types on the clipboard and choose the
one with the best options, although Microsoft office was a hassle
because it would place both text in 50 formats AND a TIFF of the PAGE
on the clipboard so we had to somewhat guess does the
client want a TIFF from Word, or text from Word, because if you copied
an image in Word, it would also place a text description of the
graphic object on the clipboard.

On 17-Apr-09, at 1:35 PM, Andreas Raab wrote:

> Bert Freudenberg wrote:
>> Below that the paste from ru.wikipedia. These are actual question
>> marks (ASCII 63), the Mac VM does not paste Unicode even if setting
>> SqueakEncodingType to UTF-8 (only the extended clipboard plugin
>> does this).
>
> Fortunately, at least that part is very easy to fix. I asked our CEO
> if we could release our clipboard support code back to the community
> and he agreed, so find attched an sqMacUIClipBoard.c version which
> does support Unicode copy/paste properly via UTF-8 (this should work
> as a drop-in replacement to the existing sqMacUIClipBoard.c).
> Brought to you by the friendly folks at Qwaq.
>
> Cheers,
> - Andreas
> <LICENSE.txt><sqMacUIClipBoard.c>

--
=
=
=
========================================================================
John M. McIntosh <[hidden email]>
Corporate Smalltalk Consulting Ltd. http://www.smalltalkconsulting.com
=
=
=
========================================================================

Juan Vuletich-4

Re: Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

In reply to this post by Andreas.Raab

Andreas Raab wrote:

>
> Juan Vuletich wrote:
>> BTW, the image needs to deal with different VMs using various
>> encoding for clipboard data. Currently, a check is made, to assume
>> UTF-8 if on Windows, and MacRoman elsewhere. It seems Mac will
>> support UTF-8 soon.
>>
>> I think we need a new primitive, perhaps #clipboardEncoding, or
>> #vmTextEncoding, that could answer UTF-8 / MacRoman / ASCII and may
>> be others. That would ease supporting various VMs with the same image.
>>
>> WRT keyboard events, it seems not to be necessary. VMs store Unicode
>> keystrokes in different slots in the event buffer, than the one used
>> for MacRoman. So, the image can tell, right?
>>
>> What do you think?
>
> Although you are technically correct, I think the days of Latin1 only
> support are simply over and I would prefer to move forward and leave
> them completely behind us. The best way to achieve this is when all
> VMs use UTF-8 everywhere and all VMs produce Unicode input characters.
> The changes to support this aren't difficult (just a bit tedious) and
> the image side is trivial for those images that don't need (or want)
> to support Unicode. I really don't see any value in fiddling with
> different encodings since UTF-8 is both canonical and well supported.
>
> Cheers,
> - Andreas

You are right. The only reason is that it might take time until VMs are
available for all platforms. My proposal allows for a smoother
transition, and it would also allow people to continue using older VMs
without much trouble. As you know, the image side changes to allow this
are easy too.

Cheers,
Juan Vuletich

johnmci

Re: Re: Pasting unicode (was Re: Pharo:: Re: Cuis update)

In reply to this post by Andreas.Raab

Ok, as far as I can tell this requires a 10.4 SDK to build and link.
In the past I built the ppc part using the 10.3.x SDK. So I'll try
with the 10.4.x ppc SDK, and see what happens.

If there are any os-x 10.2 or 10.3 users out there they may want to
try copy/paste with the pending 4.1.0b1 macintosh carbon vm

On 17-Apr-09, at 1:35 PM, Andreas Raab wrote: