> This was for an heterogeneous audience (10% devel 10% creatives a couple of
> angel investors and most people with administration profile)
>
> Here the slides:
> http://dinos.flowingconcept.com
>
> I'm pretty confident that most of you here will connect the dots ;)
>
> sebastian
>
> o/
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "amber-lang" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to [hidden email].
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>

>
>
> On Saturday, April 26, 2014 3:27:37 PM UTC-3, Hannes wrote:
>>
>> ...
>> And please, your link to your 10 reasons why you use Smalltalk, could
>> you please repost  it. here?
>>
>> --Hannes
>>
>>
>> 10 reasons why I'm using Smalltalk for airflowing
>
> http://sebastianconcept.com/brandIt/10-reasons-why-im-using-smalltalk-for-airflowing
>
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "amber-lang" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to [hidden email].
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>

> On 4/28/14, H. Hirzel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Sebastian,
>>
>> On 4/28/14, sebastian <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
> ...
>>> The physics metaphor and all the visual stuff is the best ammunition in
>>> my
>>> experience
>>
>> I agree
>>
>>> What are the things you think we could focus for that?
>>
>> Have a few good simulations.
>
>
> e.g. something like https://github.com/dvberkel/traffic-simulation
>
> About the GUI
> - interesting how rules can be composed by clicking (if(distance >=
> 4){ return speed + 1; })
> - having to click repeatedly on 'step' is clumsy
> - It is not clear what the units mean.
>
>
>
>
> (The GUI is not intuitive)
>
> HH.
>

> Not a terribly new idea,
>  cf
> http://classes.soe.ucsc.edu/cmps112/Spring03/languages/smalltalk/visualworksinstall.pdf
>
> But maybe more appealing in terms of graphics with Amber ...
>
> On 4/28/14, H. Hirzel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On 4/28/14, H. Hirzel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Sebastian,
>>>
>>> On 4/28/14, sebastian <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>> ...
>>>> The physics metaphor and all the visual stuff is the best ammunition in
>>>> my
>>>> experience
>>>
>>> I agree
>>>
>>>> What are the things you think we could focus for that?
>>>
>>> Have a few good simulations.
>>
>>
>> e.g. something like https://github.com/dvberkel/traffic-simulation
>>
>> About the GUI
>> - interesting how rules can be composed by clicking (if(distance >=
>> 4){ return speed + 1; })
>> - having to click repeatedly on 'step' is clumsy
>> - It is not clear what the units mean.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> (The GUI is not intuitive)
>>
>> HH.
>>
>

> sebastianconcept wrote
>> Can you elaborate on the real blue plane idea Sean?
>
> If the dynabook is "to provide computer support for the creative spirit in
> everyone" [1], one key thing is to reduce the cognitive burden of the
> technology so that there is enough mental RAM left over to create. If you
> go
> back to the original intentions of Morphic from the Self world [2], the
> vision was - find an object (notice, it's not "find a class") that looks
> like/behaves like I want, copy it, and then tweak it until it does what I
> want it to do. This is totally lost in - find something that looks like
> something I want (e.g. bootstrap), then save and edit as raw HTML and CSS
> (which might take a bit of investigation into where all the necessary js
> and
> css files live), then partially automate and abstract those with a DSL in
> Smalltalk (which is clearly more efficient but a far cry from WYSIWYG),
> then
> plug into a web framework like Amber or Seaside or both. The latter, with
> it's non-WYSIWYG run-compile like cycle, and myriad technologies to deal
> with, is more like programming with punch cards than the live, direct
> universe hinted at by Self, Sketchpad, Squeak/Pharo, and Croquet. In
> Morphic, if the browser doesn't work the way I want, I can  drill down and
> make it so (theoretically, this is becoming less true with e.g. Spec, which
> hides the live objects under layers of
> hopefully-cross-ui-platform-compatibility [3]). One of my first favorite
> examples of using Pharo was that creating a new repository in the MC
> Browser
> always started with IIRC the image directory, and I have a folder under
> which all my local repos live. I brought up halos on the "new repository"
> button, then on the Settings browser, connected the two together, and
> submitted the fix in a few minutes with 0 context switches... and I was
> hooked on Smalltalk. How do I do that with a cool Bootstrap login form? How
> do I dig in, find the live objects, and bend them to my vision, without
> leaving my live, dynamic system? I would love to live in that world.
>
> [1] http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655/readings/smalltalk.html
> [2]
> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.103.600&rep=rep1&type=pdf
> [3] One of the funny (or sad) thing is that people keep developing UI
> Builders for Morphic - that's what Morphic *is*. The question isn't how to
> layer tool-centric crap on top, but how to directly play with the Morphs
> themselves (remember flaps?) until you have what you want, and then reify
> *that*. It wouldn't be so hard (at least for geometry and layout) to
> implement "aMorphThatIBuiltViaDirectManipulation reifyAs:
> #MyCoolMorphSubclass".
>
> HTH :)
>
>
> sebastianconcept wrote
>> Also need reference on what LK is?
>
> Sorry for the abbreviation - it's Lively Kernel.
>
>
>
> -----
> Cheers,
> Sean
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://forum.world.st/Slides-available-for-the-talk-making-a-case-in-Smalltalk-tp4756615p4756899.html
> Sent from the Amber Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "amber-lang" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to [hidden email].
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>

> Sean,
>
> thank you for reminding us about the general background.
>
> Regarding a specific topic, what about this
>
> Roassal in Amber running over Amber 0.12
> https://github.com/pestefo/roamber12
>
> ?
>
> Three months old, needs to be upgraded too 0.12.4
>
> --Hannes
>
> On 4/29/14, Sean P. DeNigris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> sebastianconcept wrote
>>> Can you elaborate on the real blue plane idea Sean?
>>
>> If the dynabook is "to provide computer support for the creative spirit
>> in
>> everyone" [1], one key thing is to reduce the cognitive burden of the
>> technology so that there is enough mental RAM left over to create. If you
>> go
>> back to the original intentions of Morphic from the Self world [2], the
>> vision was - find an object (notice, it's not "find a class") that looks
>> like/behaves like I want, copy it, and then tweak it until it does what I
>> want it to do. This is totally lost in - find something that looks like
>> something I want (e.g. bootstrap), then save and edit as raw HTML and CSS
>> (which might take a bit of investigation into where all the necessary js
>> and
>> css files live), then partially automate and abstract those with a DSL in
>> Smalltalk (which is clearly more efficient but a far cry from WYSIWYG),
>> then
>> plug into a web framework like Amber or Seaside or both. The latter, with
>> it's non-WYSIWYG run-compile like cycle, and myriad technologies to deal
>> with, is more like programming with punch cards than the live, direct
>> universe hinted at by Self, Sketchpad, Squeak/Pharo, and Croquet. In
>> Morphic, if the browser doesn't work the way I want, I can  drill down
>> and
>> make it so (theoretically, this is becoming less true with e.g. Spec,
>> which
>> hides the live objects under layers of
>> hopefully-cross-ui-platform-compatibility [3]). One of my first favorite
>> examples of using Pharo was that creating a new repository in the MC
>> Browser
>> always started with IIRC the image directory, and I have a folder under
>> which all my local repos live. I brought up halos on the "new repository"
>> button, then on the Settings browser, connected the two together, and
>> submitted the fix in a few minutes with 0 context switches... and I was
>> hooked on Smalltalk. How do I do that with a cool Bootstrap login form?
>> How
>> do I dig in, find the live objects, and bend them to my vision, without
>> leaving my live, dynamic system? I would love to live in that world.
>>
>> [1] http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655/readings/smalltalk.html
>> [2]
>> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.103.600&rep=rep1&type=pdf
>> [3] One of the funny (or sad) thing is that people keep developing UI
>> Builders for Morphic - that's what Morphic *is*. The question isn't how
>> to
>> layer tool-centric crap on top, but how to directly play with the Morphs
>> themselves (remember flaps?) until you have what you want, and then reify
>> *that*. It wouldn't be so hard (at least for geometry and layout) to
>> implement "aMorphThatIBuiltViaDirectManipulation reifyAs:
>> #MyCoolMorphSubclass".
>>
>> HTH :)
>>
>>
>> sebastianconcept wrote
>>> Also need reference on what LK is?
>>
>> Sorry for the abbreviation - it's Lively Kernel.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Cheers,
>> Sean
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://forum.world.st/Slides-available-for-the-talk-making-a-case-in-Smalltalk-tp4756615p4756899.html
>> Sent from the Amber Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "amber-lang" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to [hidden email].
>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>
>

> http://www.objectprofile.com/Roassal.html
>
> On 4/29/14, H. Hirzel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Sean,
>>
>> thank you for reminding us about the general background.
>>
>> Regarding a specific topic, what about this
>>
>> Roassal in Amber running over Amber 0.12
>> https://github.com/pestefo/roamber12
>>
>> ?
>>
>> Three months old, needs to be upgraded too 0.12.4
>>
>> --Hannes
>>
>> On 4/29/14, Sean P. DeNigris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> sebastianconcept wrote
>>>> Can you elaborate on the real blue plane idea Sean?
>>>
>>> If the dynabook is "to provide computer support for the creative spirit
>>> in
>>> everyone" [1], one key thing is to reduce the cognitive burden of the
>>> technology so that there is enough mental RAM left over to create. If
>>> you
>>> go
>>> back to the original intentions of Morphic from the Self world [2], the
>>> vision was - find an object (notice, it's not "find a class") that looks
>>> like/behaves like I want, copy it, and then tweak it until it does what
>>> I
>>> want it to do. This is totally lost in - find something that looks like
>>> something I want (e.g. bootstrap), then save and edit as raw HTML and
>>> CSS
>>> (which might take a bit of investigation into where all the necessary js
>>> and
>>> css files live), then partially automate and abstract those with a DSL
>>> in
>>> Smalltalk (which is clearly more efficient but a far cry from WYSIWYG),
>>> then
>>> plug into a web framework like Amber or Seaside or both. The latter,
>>> with
>>> it's non-WYSIWYG run-compile like cycle, and myriad technologies to deal
>>> with, is more like programming with punch cards than the live, direct
>>> universe hinted at by Self, Sketchpad, Squeak/Pharo, and Croquet. In
>>> Morphic, if the browser doesn't work the way I want, I can  drill down
>>> and
>>> make it so (theoretically, this is becoming less true with e.g. Spec,
>>> which
>>> hides the live objects under layers of
>>> hopefully-cross-ui-platform-compatibility [3]). One of my first favorite
>>> examples of using Pharo was that creating a new repository in the MC
>>> Browser
>>> always started with IIRC the image directory, and I have a folder under
>>> which all my local repos live. I brought up halos on the "new
>>> repository"
>>> button, then on the Settings browser, connected the two together, and
>>> submitted the fix in a few minutes with 0 context switches... and I was
>>> hooked on Smalltalk. How do I do that with a cool Bootstrap login form?
>>> How
>>> do I dig in, find the live objects, and bend them to my vision, without
>>> leaving my live, dynamic system? I would love to live in that world.
>>>
>>> [1] http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655/readings/smalltalk.html
>>> [2]
>>> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.103.600&rep=rep1&type=pdf
>>> [3] One of the funny (or sad) thing is that people keep developing UI
>>> Builders for Morphic - that's what Morphic *is*. The question isn't how
>>> to
>>> layer tool-centric crap on top, but how to directly play with the Morphs
>>> themselves (remember flaps?) until you have what you want, and then
>>> reify
>>> *that*. It wouldn't be so hard (at least for geometry and layout) to
>>> implement "aMorphThatIBuiltViaDirectManipulation reifyAs:
>>> #MyCoolMorphSubclass".
>>>
>>> HTH :)
>>>
>>>
>>> sebastianconcept wrote
>>>> Also need reference on what LK is?
>>>
>>> Sorry for the abbreviation - it's Lively Kernel.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----
>>> Cheers,
>>> Sean
>>> --
>>> View this message in context:
>>> http://forum.world.st/Slides-available-for-the-talk-making-a-case-in-Smalltalk-tp4756615p4756899.html
>>> Sent from the Amber Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups
>>> "amber-lang" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> an
>>> email to [hidden email].
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>>
>>
>

> Hi Sean, thanks for taking the time and frame this idea.
>
> It's really inspiring. If you have a blog, I encourage you to publish this.
> You would have at least one guy referencing it.
>
> In the eye of my mind there is nothing conceptually better than Self.
>
> With the right UI, Self can achieve what no programming language could:
> becoming pre-cognitive.
>
> I'm confident that in the future the industry will reinvent some kind of
> Self with term UI and graphic UI.
>
> For that to happen we need more people like us deeply involved with
> designers in places like Silicon Valley which I doubt is happening now.
>
> Saving distances we experienced the principle in action with a feature in my
> product, I've wrote about it here:
> http://blog.flowingconcept.com/brandIt/duplicating-and-hacking
>
> And we call it Duplicating and Hacking, is everything the school told you
> not to do but humanity works that way.
>
> Is even more intuitive than the concept of templates.
>
> Everybody has a pre-cognitive impulse of taking what's done by someone else
> and was already battle tested, duplicate it, make it its own and customise
> it for its own new purpose.
>
> With proud!
>
> If you think on that, it's anthropologic. It's how stories and culture gets
> passed one generation to the next.
>
> Is how legends are built.
>
> A computer model that fits into that, with the right interfaces has a lot to
> be a winner
>
> sebastian
>
> o/
>
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 28, 2014, at 11:36 PM, Sean P. DeNigris <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>> If the dynabook is "to provide computer support for the creative spirit
>> in
>> everyone" [1], one key thing is to reduce the cognitive burden of the
>> technology so that there is enough mental RAM left over to create. If you
>> go
>> back to the original intentions of Morphic from the Self world [2], the
>> vision was - find an object (notice, it's not "find a class") that looks
>> like/behaves like I want, copy it, and then tweak it until it does what I
>> want it to do. This is totally lost in - find something that looks like
>> something I want (e.g. bootstrap), then save and edit as raw HTML and CSS
>> (which might take a bit of investigation into where all the necessary js
>> and
>> css files live), then partially automate and abstract those with a DSL in
>> Smalltalk (which is clearly more efficient but a far cry from WYSIWYG),
>> then
>> plug into a web framework like Amber or Seaside or both. The latter, with
>> it's non-WYSIWYG run-compile like cycle, and myriad technologies to deal
>> with, is more like programming with punch cards than the live, direct
>> universe hinted at by Self, Sketchpad, Squeak/Pharo, and Croquet. In
>> Morphic, if the browser doesn't work the way I want, I can  drill down
>> and
>> make it so (theoretically, this is becoming less true with e.g. Spec,
>> which
>> hides the live objects under layers of
>> hopefully-cross-ui-platform-compatibility [3]). One of my first favorite
>> examples of using Pharo was that creating a new repository in the MC
>> Browser
>> always started with IIRC the image directory, and I have a folder under
>> which all my local repos live. I brought up halos on the "new repository"
>> button, then on the Settings browser, connected the two together, and
>> submitted the fix in a few minutes with 0 context switches... and I was
>> hooked on Smalltalk. How do I do that with a cool Bootstrap login form?
>> How
>> do I dig in, find the live objects, and bend them to my vision, without
>> leaving my live, dynamic system? I would love to live in that world.
>>
>> [1] http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655/readings/smalltalk.html
>> [2]
>> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.103.600&rep=rep1&type=pdf
>> [3] One of the funny (or sad) thing is that people keep developing UI
>> Builders for Morphic - that's what Morphic *is*. The question isn't how
>> to
>> layer tool-centric crap on top, but how to directly play with the Morphs
>> themselves (remember flaps?) until you have what you want, and then reify
>> *that*. It wouldn't be so hard (at least for geometry and layout) to
>> implement "aMorphThatIBuiltViaDirectManipulation reifyAs:
>> #MyCoolMorphSubclass".
>>
>> HTH :)
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "amber-lang" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to [hidden email].
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>