Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Previous Topic Next Topic
 
classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
10 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Chris Cunnington
Members attending: Bert Freudenberg, Colin Putney, Chris Muller, Randal
Schwartz, Chris Cunnington, Craig Latta

- Squeak4.4 is going to be released soon

- The election process is being reviewed to secure an election manager
so Göran doesn't have to do it forever

- David T. Lewis set up automatic building of 64-bit images [1], and Ian
Piumarta provides a Linux VM to run these images [2]. The Board explored
what could be done with such an image. The main thing it allows is
having larger object memories. One idea was a system that would log all
message sends and state changes, so we could have an omniscient debugger
(e.g., a person could play back everything that happened in the previous
half hour). This relates to Gilad Bracha's blog post "Debug Mode Is The
Only Mode" [3]. One thing necessary for a wider adoption of 64-bit
images would be providing VMs for Windows and Mac, and making some
remaining plugins work with 64-bits.

- Craig Latta is about to release the first modules for the Naiad module
system for Spoon: Chronos and Quoth. Craig has a process of
"spoonifying" an application written in regular code. Chronos is Alan
Lovejoy's date/time library [4] and Quoth is Craig's own musical
live-coding system [5].

- Tim Rowledge is waiting to receive in the mail a Raspberry Pi with
which he aims to provide a current RiscOS platform for Squeak. Being the
original ARM maintainer of the Squeak VM, he intends to adapt his
existing RiscOS code for the Raspbery Pi.

- Colin Putney  is in the process of reviewing and releasing a new
revision of Filesystem [6]

- Chris C. has developed a prototype of a new squeak.org homepage. It's
latest version can be found at [7]. It is an Altitude website. There are
questions about the site on two fronts: how it looks; and, how stable it
is. There has been doubt about how the site should look. Opinions about
its design, logo, layout, CSS, etc. are welcome. Herbert Konig is
helping to harden it with the Selenium testing suite. [8] [9] The most
recent image has been up for +200 hours without a problem. Colin has
added changes to Altitude, which will be deployed soon.

[1]
http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/squeak-dev/2012-November/166422.html

[2] http://squeakvm.org/unix/

[3] http://gbracha.blogspot.ca/

[4] http://chronos-st.blogspot.com/

[5] http://netjam.org/quoth/

[6] http://wiresong.ca/filesystem/

[7] http://box3.squeak.org:8624

[8] http://seleniumhq.org/

[9] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/selenium-ide/

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

radoslav hodnicak

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Chris Cunnington <[hidden email]> wrote:
- Chris C. has developed a prototype of a new squeak.org homepage. It's latest version can be found at [7]. It is an Altitude website. There are questions about the site on two fronts: how it looks; and, how stable it is. There has been doubt about how the site should look. Opinions about its design, logo, layout, CSS, etc. are welcome. Herbert Konig is helping to harden it with the Selenium testing suite. [8] [9] The most recent image has been up for +200 hours without a problem. Colin has added changes to Altitude, which will be deployed soon.

I would suggest using Twitter's Bootstrap framework, it's easy to adopt and the defaults look reasonably pleasant even when a programmer puts the site together.

Cheers,
Rado


Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Chris Cunnington
On 2012-11-20 9:59 AM, radoslav hodnicak wrote:

On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Chris Cunnington <[hidden email]> wrote:
- Chris C. has developed a prototype of a new squeak.org homepage. It's latest version can be found at [7]. It is an Altitude website. There are questions about the site on two fronts: how it looks; and, how stable it is. There has been doubt about how the site should look. Opinions about its design, logo, layout, CSS, etc. are welcome. Herbert Konig is helping to harden it with the Selenium testing suite. [8] [9] The most recent image has been up for +200 hours without a problem. Colin has added changes to Altitude, which will be deployed soon.

I would suggest using Twitter's Bootstrap framework, it's easy to adopt and the defaults look reasonably pleasant even when a programmer puts the site together.

Cheers,
Rado



    
http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/

A good tip. Thanks.

Chris


Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Hannes Hirzel
Yes, indeed.

And in particular I suggest to go for a fluid layout, so that it looks
fine on smaller screens

http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/examples/fluid.html

With Firefox 15.0 for example you have a new menu option
   Web developer / Responsive web design
where you can easily choose different screen sizes and have a look how
the site renders for various screen sizes.

This does not use much time in terms of Smalltalk as it is all CSS. It
will give us a modern web site.

In any case, Chris,  thank you very much for going for an Altitude web
site. It is good to have a test site. We were well served by Aida in
the past but giving the new framework a chance is fine as well.

---Hannes


On 11/20/12, Chris Cunnington <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 2012-11-20 9:59 AM, radoslav hodnicak wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 2:12 PM, Chris Cunnington
>> <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>     - Chris C. has developed a prototype of a new squeak.org
>>     <http://squeak.org> homepage. It's latest version can be found at
>>     [7]. It is an Altitude website. There are questions about the site
>>     on two fronts: how it looks; and, how stable it is. There has been
>>     doubt about how the site should look. Opinions about its design,
>>     logo, layout, CSS, etc. are welcome. Herbert Konig is helping to
>>     harden it with the Selenium testing suite. [8] [9] The most recent
>>     image has been up for +200 hours without a problem. Colin has
>>     added changes to Altitude, which will be deployed soon.
>>
>>
>> I would suggest using Twitter's Bootstrap framework, it's easy to
>> adopt and the defaults look reasonably pleasant even when a programmer
>> puts the site together.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Rado
>>
>>
> http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/
>
> A good tip. Thanks.
>
> Chris
>

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

timrowledge
In reply to this post by Chris Cunnington

On 20-11-2012, at 5:12 AM, Chris Cunnington <[hidden email]> wrote:
> - Tim Rowledge is waiting to receive in the mail a Raspberry Pi with which he aims to provide a current RiscOS platform for Squeak. Being the original ARM maintainer of the Squeak VM, he intends to adapt his existing RiscOS code for the Raspbery Pi.


Still waiting; good old snailmail is living up to its name.

tim
--
tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
Try not to let implementation details sneak into design documents.



Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Chris Cunnington
In reply to this post by Hannes Hirzel
On 2012-11-20 12:39 PM, H. Hirzel wrote:

> Yes, indeed.
>
> And in particular I suggest to go for a fluid layout, so that it looks
> fine on smaller screens
>
> http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/examples/fluid.html
>
> With Firefox 15.0 for example you have a new menu option
>     Web developer / Responsive web design
> where you can easily choose different screen sizes and have a look how
> the site renders for various screen sizes.
>
> This does not use much time in terms of Smalltalk as it is all CSS. It
> will give us a modern web site.
>
> In any case, Chris,  thank you very much for going for an Altitude web
> site. It is good to have a test site. We were well served by Aida in
> the past but giving the new framework a chance is fine as well.
>
> ---Hannes

Fluid sounds good to me. And responsive... yea, I think I should look
into that too.

Thanks,
Chris

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

timrowledge

On 20-11-2012, at 11:44 AM, Chris Cunnington <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 2012-11-20 12:39 PM, H. Hirzel wrote:
>> Yes, indeed.
>>
>> And in particular I suggest to go for a fluid layout, so that it looks
>> fine on smaller screens
>>
>> http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/examples/fluid.html
>>
>> With Firefox 15.0 for example you have a new menu option
>>    Web developer / Responsive web design
>> where you can easily choose different screen sizes and have a look how
>> the site renders for various screen sizes.
>>
>> This does not use much time in terms of Smalltalk as it is all CSS. It
>> will give us a modern web site.
>>
>> In any case, Chris,  thank you very much for going for an Altitude web
>> site. It is good to have a test site. We were well served by Aida in
>> the past but giving the new framework a chance is fine as well.
>>
>> ---Hannes
>
> Fluid sounds good to me. And responsive... yea, I think I should look into that too.

And chocolatey.

tim
--
tim Rowledge; [hidden email]; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
In the long run, every program becomes rococco, and then rubble.



Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Randal L. Schwartz
In reply to this post by Hannes Hirzel
>>>>> "H" == H Hirzel <[hidden email]> writes:

H> http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/examples/fluid.html

Yes, Bootstrap rocks.  I'm using it on all current projects.

--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<[hidden email]> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.posterous.com/ for Smalltalk discussion

Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

OpenSlate ChalkDust
In reply to this post by Chris Cunnington
If the case is, as the web site states, "There aren't any applications bundled with this release," then there ought to be a mention of how to add applications. Even if this statement is omitted I think it would be useful to newcomers to show them our version of the app store. The current site lists some things under "features" because in the past these were bundled. Granted, some good old stuff is rather broken, but if a newbie did want to try out one of these apps we need to make it simple to learn how and easy to do.


On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 3:12 AM, Chris Cunnington <[hidden email]> wrote:
Members attending: Bert Freudenberg, Colin Putney, Chris Muller, Randal Schwartz, Chris Cunnington, Craig Latta

- Squeak4.4 is going to be released soon

- The election process is being reviewed to secure an election manager so Göran doesn't have to do it forever

- David T. Lewis set up automatic building of 64-bit images [1], and Ian Piumarta provides a Linux VM to run these images [2]. The Board explored what could be done with such an image. The main thing it allows is having larger object memories. One idea was a system that would log all message sends and state changes, so we could have an omniscient debugger (e.g., a person could play back everything that happened in the previous half hour). This relates to Gilad Bracha's blog post "Debug Mode Is The Only Mode" [3]. One thing necessary for a wider adoption of 64-bit images would be providing VMs for Windows and Mac, and making some remaining plugins work with 64-bits.

- Craig Latta is about to release the first modules for the Naiad module system for Spoon: Chronos and Quoth. Craig has a process of "spoonifying" an application written in regular code. Chronos is Alan Lovejoy's date/time library [4] and Quoth is Craig's own musical live-coding system [5].

- Tim Rowledge is waiting to receive in the mail a Raspberry Pi with which he aims to provide a current RiscOS platform for Squeak. Being the original ARM maintainer of the Squeak VM, he intends to adapt his existing RiscOS code for the Raspbery Pi.

- Colin Putney  is in the process of reviewing and releasing a new revision of Filesystem [6]

- Chris C. has developed a prototype of a new squeak.org homepage. It's latest version can be found at [7]. It is an Altitude website. There are questions about the site on two fronts: how it looks; and, how stable it is. There has been doubt about how the site should look. Opinions about its design, logo, layout, CSS, etc. are welcome. Herbert Konig is helping to harden it with the Selenium testing suite. [8] [9] The most recent image has been up for +200 hours without a problem. Colin has added changes to Altitude, which will be deployed soon.

[1] http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/squeak-dev/2012-November/166422.html

[2] http://squeakvm.org/unix/

[3] http://gbracha.blogspot.ca/

[4] http://chronos-st.blogspot.com/

[5] http://netjam.org/quoth/

[6] http://wiresong.ca/filesystem/

[7] http://box3.squeak.org:8624

[8] http://seleniumhq.org/

[9] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/selenium-ide/




--
Gary Dunn
Open Slate Project
http://openslate.org/


Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Squeak Board minutes - 11/19/12

Darius Clarke
+1

<=>Darius


On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 12:43 PM, Open Slate <[hidden email]> wrote:
If the case is, as the web site states, "There aren't any applications bundled with this release," then there ought to be a mention of how to add applications. Even if this statement is omitted I think it would be useful to newcomers to show them our version of the app store. The current site lists some things under "features" because in the past these were bundled. Granted, some good old stuff is rather broken, but if a newbie did want to try out one of these apps we need to make it simple to learn how and easy to do.