Updated trunk image (Squeak3.11-9622-alpha.zip)

On 3/7/10 8:55 AM, "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Let me try to help on understanding Edgar feelings.
>
> I think (correct me Edgar if I'm wrong) that Edgar thinks that his
> contributions are mostly ignored (from years...) and
> with a seat on the Board he can have more attention as well as more
> possibilities of go to a modular, small image,
> that is his goal from long long time.
>
> Just my 0.02....


Very thanks !!!

Only for this next week work for FunSqueak got to load Seaside 3.0 + Pier, I
see how the Metacello into do this :=)

2010/3/7 Edgar J. De Cleene <[hidden email]>:
Should be easy, as follow:

1. Load Metacello latest version from Squeaksource;

2. Load ConfigurationOfSeaside from Squeaksource/MetacelloRepository

3. Follow the instructions of Dale:


Then pick the Seaside variant you want to load:

 "Seaside 2.8"
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Seaside 2.8'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Seaside 2.8 Examples'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Magritte'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Magritte Tests'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Pier'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Pier Tests'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Pier AddOns'.

 "Seaside 3.0"
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Seaside 3.0'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Seaside 3.0 Tests'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Magritte2'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Magritte2 Tests'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Pier2'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Pier2 Tests'.
 ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'Pier2 AddOns'.


Hoy domingo arrancamos tempranos eh!! :)

Germán.

Edgar,

On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 10:05 PM, Edgar J. De Cleene
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> Very happy the base or core or "Mendieta" for nobody feels hurt about the
> name is on top of list now.

what do you mean? I really do not understand this. Sorry, but your
handling of English is rather unusual. Since I don't speak Spanish, I
can't even try to map it to your native language.

> P.S Also I send friendly private mail to you (February 10) for all work
> together.....

In case you mean me personally, I just checked: there was no message
to me personally in my inbox on Feb 10. Could you please resend it?

Best,

Michael

On 3/7/10 10:27 AM, "Michael Haupt" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> what do you mean? I really do not understand this. Sorry, but your
> handling of English is rather unusual.
I send message about this.
The short is for not having the word Squeak or confusions about numbers , I
propose the name of well know character cartoon here what is "Mendieta"

>Since I don't speak Spanish, I
> can't even try to map it to your native language.

Ich kann keine Deutsche :=)

> In case you mean me personally, I just checked: there was no message
> to me personally in my inbox on Feb 10. Could you please resend it?
>
> Best,
>
> Michael

Just I forward it to [hidden email] using gmail this time

Edgar

Hi Michael:

I will try to help on understand Edgar again, I hope nobody feels offended....

2010/3/7 Michael Haupt <[hidden email]>:
I think that Edgar try to point here that he is happy by the fact that
having a minimal image
(a small one) is on top of goals now regardless its name/author (base,
core or "Mendieta" [1] this last, a work
from Edgar).

[1] http://www.todohistorietas.com.ar/fontanarrosa.htm (Sorry is in
spanish. Mendieta is the dog of a well know
cartoon here named "Inodoro Pereyra" of the (unfortunately died)
Roberto Fontanarrosa, from Rosario, Argentina,
the city were Edgar lives.

Germán.

Germán,

On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 1:35 PM, Germán Arduino <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I will try to help on understand Edgar again, I hope nobody feels offended....
> ...
> I think that Edgar try to point here that he is happy by the fact that
> having a minimal image
> (a small one) is on top of goals now regardless its name/author (base,
> core or "Mendieta" [1] this last, a work
> from Edgar).

thank you very much.

Best,

Michael

2010/3/7 Edgar J. De Cleene <[hidden email]>:
hehe, seems that my interpretation was not correct after all :)

Hi Edgar,

On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 12:57 PM, Edgar J. De Cleene
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> I send message about this.
> The short is for not having the word Squeak or confusions about numbers , I
> propose the name of well know character cartoon here what is "Mendieta"

ah. :-) Looks like a sad character, though. (?)

> Ich kann keine Deutsche :=)

Das macht nix. :-)

> Just I forward it to [hidden email] using gmail this time

Got it, replied, thanks!

Best,

Michael

On 3/7/10 10:57 AM, "Michael Haupt" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> ah. :-) Looks like a sad character, though. (?)
Because the draw was by Daniel Paz when Roberto die.
Mendieta in the original draws is some philosophic.
Maybe you loss the words, by the draws was very cool .

Edgar

P.S) Maybe Mendieta is sad because we and our far cousins of Pharo can work
all together ?

On 07.03.2010, at 11:55, Germán Arduino wrote:
IMHO it's not at all about "having a Board seat" for getting your work noticed. It's about working *within* the community rather than on your own. In fact, it's the other way around: *Because* people like what you do and say, you get elected to serve on the Board.

- Bert -

2010/3/7 Bert Freudenberg <[hidden email]>:
I'm only trying to help people understand what Edgar says, that not
means I agree with the opinion :)

On 7 Mar 2010, at 10:55, Germán Arduino wrote:

> Let me try to help on understanding Edgar feelings.
>
> I think (correct me Edgar if I'm wrong) that Edgar thinks that his
> contributions are mostly ignored (from years...) and
> with a seat on the Board he can have more attention as well as more
> possibilities of go to a modular, small image,
> that is his goal from long long time.
>
> Just my 0.02....

I agree, and this is another indicator for me that the board is  
failing in its remit, if the only way that the board can represent  
members to their satisfaction is if said member gets elected  
themselves, so they have a voice.

I was told by a board member that charisma is what you need to move  
things forward around here. Apparently, neither Edgar nor I have that  
charisma, and Andreas does. Scary stuff for I thought was a technical  
forum.

Keith

>>>>> "keith" == keith  <[hidden email]> writes:

keith> I was told by a board member that charisma is what you need to move
keith> things forward around here. Apparently, neither Edgar nor I have that
keith> charisma, and Andreas does. Scary stuff for I thought was a technical
keith> forum.

And indeed, one quality of a leader is an ability to express yourself in a way
that can be understood and inspires others to action.  We'll call that
"charisma" for short.

And frankly, by that standard, Keith doesn't have that.  He may be technically
strong, but without the ability to inspire others to take aligned actions, he
isn't a leader.  Hint: it takes more carrots than sticks.

Andreas came with a plan that was easily understood, and inspired others to
action.  That's why his plan was followed, when Keith's wasn't.  It's that
simple.  It wasn't because Andreas was a board member, although the board
endorsed the announcement, just as the board had endorsed Keith's plan until
Keith failed to inspire the community.

Maybe it's not fair that a technical job should also require people skills.
But that's the way it is, particularly for leadership jobs. :)

Note: I'm saying absolutely *nothing* about Edgar here.  I have no opinion
one way or the other about Edgar.  I'm only talking about Keith's lack
of charisma.

--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<[hidden email]> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discussion

>>>>> "keith" == keith  <[hidden email]> writes:

keith> Randal, put quite frankly I regard you as a bully, and given that your
keith> remit on the board was to deliver a re-licenced squeak image, I think
keith> it is about time the community called your bluff. How many methods in
keith> the re-licenced image will have your initials on them?

None, because I was not required to rewrite any methods. The relicensed
image is very close... could even be out before the election.

Therefore, mission accomplished, as proposed.  Next?

--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<[hidden email]> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discussion

On Sun, Mar 07, 2010 at 10:35:06AM +0200, Vaidotas Did??balis wrote:
>
> Noticed bug in core image: I wanted to change fonts and after Alt+k on
> selected text in workspace I got attached walkback.

Vaidotas,

I am not seeing this problem in an updated Squeak trunk. Perhaps someone
has already fixed it?

Dave

On Sun, Mar 07, 2010 at 10:35:06AM +0200, Vaidotas Did??balis wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Thank you all for such a small image.
>
> I interested in small MVC only image. If MVC is separated from Morphic, may
> there is suggestions on how one may try getting MVC only image?

Sungjin Chun has produced a good MVC only image. I cannot find the original
announcement, but you can find information here:
 http://astares.blogspot.com/2009/09/mvc-squeaks-smalltalk-80-roots.html

Squeak trunk cannot yet be reduced to an MVC-only image, but I am sure
that this will be possible in the future.

There are two things that need to happen in order to produce an
MVC-only image from trunk:

1) MVC itself has of problems that need to be fixed. To illustrate, try
evaluating 'self halt' in MVC (but save your image first).

2) Morphic needs to be made reloadable, similar to reloadable MVC. Much
of the enabling work for this has already been done, so it is certainly
an achievable goal.

Dave

On 3/7/2010 12:58 AM, Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
> I send tons of ignored messages, don't want more fights.
> I was the ReleaseTeam manager as Andreas said?
> Or not ?

You are. Why are you questioning this? Please Edgar, since your English
is often difficult to follow, if you have issues that you'd like to see
addressed, be explicit.

> If I was the manager , why don't have access to ftp 3.11 folders?

You don't? My understanding of the server is is that if you have a login
(which you clearly have since you've been able to put things into the
"various images" folder) you can put them anywhere in the files area.

> Or why my request to have access to<http://ftp.squeak.org/Experiments/>
> so I move all the compressed sources work I have in atspace don't was
> answered ?

Where did you send this request to?

Cheers,
   - Andreas

On Sun, 2010-03-07 at 13:21 -0800, Andreas Raab wrote:
> On 3/7/2010 12:58 AM, Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
> > If I was the manager , why don't have access to ftp 3.11 folders?
>
> You don't? My understanding of the server is is that if you have a login
> (which you clearly have since you've been able to put things into the
> "various images" folder) you can put them anywhere in the files area.

It's not quite that simple, but Edgar certainly has access to
http://ftp.squeak.org/3.11/ aka http://ftp.squeak.org/trunk/ just as
everyone does who has access to the 'updates' account on the server:
This is just about everyone who has been on a release team since 3.8
IIRC.  (FYI the origin of the account name is that it was the
access-path to modify the classic update stream.)

In general terms the FTP site as a whole is the responsibility of the
Web Team and so they have write access to the entire site.  A few
sub-directories are also write-accessible to specific other users as
needed.

Ken