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Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

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Günther Schmidt

Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Hi all,

I'm using a clean 3.8 image with the current VM from Squeak.org on XP.

Whenever I want to load SMPackageLoader for the first time, the system
tells me I need to update to a newer client version of SM.

Fine sofar, I'll just do that then. (Klicking OK)

Next thing the system tells me it's snapshotting methods, and the CPU
usage is at 100% for the next 1 1/2 hours.

Every time.

Does anybody know, what's causing this, and how to prevent it?

Oh and sometimes I make it through the 1 1/2 hours just to have the
system let me know that it failed.

Please help!

Günther

stéphane ducasse-2

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

It seems that the version 3.8 of MC is fetching a lot the source of
the methods (which is really slow)
and was partially fixed in 3.9 or at least cached (if I remember
correctly). But 1h 30 is really huge.

Stef

On 3 juin 06, at 22:03, Günther Schmidt wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I'm using a clean 3.8 image with the current VM from Squeak.org on XP.
>
> Whenever I want to load SMPackageLoader for the first time, the
> system tells me I need to update to a newer client version of SM.
>
> Fine sofar, I'll just do that then. (Klicking OK)
>
> Next thing the system tells me it's snapshotting methods, and the
> CPU usage is at 100% for the next 1 1/2 hours.
>
> Every time.
>
> Does anybody know, what's causing this, and how to prevent it?
>
> Oh and sometimes I make it through the 1 1/2 hours just to have the
> system let me know that it failed.
>
> Please help!
>
> Günther
>
>

Milan Zimmermann-2

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Günther Schmidt

Günter,

Before going to next step, could you send here the message the the system gave
you at the end when it said it failed? It may be interesting for someone to
help debugging it. Also please attach file named "SqueakDebug.log" from the
directory where your image is located.

As to trying to fix your problem quickly (and I am not sure it will help):

1) This may not be the "correct approach", but try it: in the directory where
your image runs from, there is a directory named "sm" - remove it and try SM
again. This may be too radical, but should work.

2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
command from workspace.

Milan

On 2006 June 3 16:03, Günther Schmidt wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I'm using a clean 3.8 image with the current VM from Squeak.org on XP.
>
> Whenever I want to load SMPackageLoader for the first time, the system
> tells me I need to update to a newer client version of SM.
>
> Fine sofar, I'll just do that then. (Klicking OK)
>
> Next thing the system tells me it's snapshotting methods, and the CPU
> usage is at 100% for the next 1 1/2 hours.
>
> Every time.
>
> Does anybody know, what's causing this, and how to prevent it?
>
> Oh and sometimes I make it through the 1 1/2 hours just to have the
> system let me know that it failed.
>
> Please help!
>
> Günther

Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by stéphane ducasse-2

Stéphane,

thanks for answering, but you got me just more confused.

stéphane ducasse schrieb:
> It seems that the version 3.8 of MC is fetching a lot the source of the

that's version 3.8 of Monticello and not 3.8 image?

> methods (which is really slow)
> and was partially fixed in 3.9 or at least cached (if I remember

and that would be Monticello 3.9 but not Squeak image 3.9?

Well is there a way to do totally without MC since, as I understand it,
MC is meant for package *development* as opposed to SqueakMap which is
meant for package *distribution*?

Günther

stéphane ducasse-2

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

> Well is there a way to do totally without MC since, as I understand
> it, MC is meant for package *development* as opposed to SqueakMap
> which is meant for package *distribution*?

You can load the st file contained in the mcz file you get on your
disc in the package folder
but you will not have the merge of MC.

Not sure that it is the solution thought.

Ken Causey-3

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Milan Zimmermann-2

On Sat, 2006-06-03 at 16:46 -0400, Milan Zimmermann wrote:
> 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
> command from workspace.
>
> Milan

Milan:

I think you mean 'SMSqueakMap bootStrap'. However I suspect neither of
those methods is going to help Günther as his problem is almost
certainly occurring after this point. Unfortunately Goran is out of
contact for a few days so he can't offer any suggestions immediately.

Günther:

However I will note that I just tried opening SqueakMap Package Loader
in a clean 3.8-6665-basic image and I went through the upgrade process
without any problems. Is there a possibility that Squeak may not be
able to access the Internet? Like maybe you are behind a proxy? Or the
link is just incredibly slow?

Note that it should relatively quickly ask you a fairly long question
regarding installing Monticello. It only takes me about 10-20 seconds
to get to that step. Did you see that?

Ken

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Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Milan Zimmermann-2

Dear Milan,

Milan Zimmermann schrieb:
> Günter,
>
> Before going to next step, could you send here the message the the system gave
> you at the end when it said it failed? It may be interesting for someone to
> help debugging it. Also please attach file named "SqueakDebug.log" from the
> directory where your image is located.
>

I will, thanks for the offer, but it'll be an hour + or so, during which
my machine will pretty much be frozen up.

> As to trying to fix your problem quickly (and I am not sure it will help):
>
> 1) This may not be the "correct approach", but try it: in the directory where
> your image runs from, there is a directory named "sm" - remove it and try SM
> again. This may be too radical, but should work.
>
> 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
> command from workspace.
>
> Milan
>
>
> On 2006 June 3 16:03, Günther Schmidt wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I'm using a clean 3.8 image with the current VM from Squeak.org on XP.
>>
>> Whenever I want to load SMPackageLoader for the first time, the system
>> tells me I need to update to a newer client version of SM.
>>
>> Fine sofar, I'll just do that then. (Klicking OK)
>>
>> Next thing the system tells me it's snapshotting methods, and the CPU
>> usage is at 100% for the next 1 1/2 hours.
>>
>> Every time.
>>
>> Does anybody know, what's causing this, and how to prevent it?
>>
>> Oh and sometimes I make it through the 1 1/2 hours just to have the
>> system let me know that it failed.
>>
>> Please help!
>>
>> Günther
>
>

Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Ken Causey-3

Ken Causey schrieb:

> On Sat, 2006-06-03 at 16:46 -0400, Milan Zimmermann wrote:
>> 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
>> command from workspace.
>>
>> Milan
>
> Milan:
>
> I think you mean 'SMSqueakMap bootStrap'. However I suspect neither of
> those methods is going to help Günther as his problem is almost
> certainly occurring after this point. Unfortunately Goran is out of
> contact for a few days so he can't offer any suggestions immediately.
>
> Günther:
>
> However I will note that I just tried opening SqueakMap Package Loader
> in a clean 3.8-6665-basic image and I went through the upgrade process
> without any problems. Is there a possibility that Squeak may not be
> able to access the Internet? Like maybe you are behind a proxy? Or the
> link is just incredibly slow?

I think you're onto something here, I will try a couple of things with
my network configuration.

I *am* behind my router, which is also the DSL modem.

>
> Note that it should relatively quickly ask you a fairly long question
> regarding installing Monticello. It only takes me about 10-20 seconds
> to get to that step. Did you see that?
>
> Ken
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>

Milan Zimmermann-2

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Ken Causey-3

Ken,

you are most likely right on both accounts (that deleting the sm will not help
and the real reason may be a proxy/network problem)

Milan

On 2006 June 3 17:09, Ken Causey wrote:

> On Sat, 2006-06-03 at 16:46 -0400, Milan Zimmermann wrote:
> > 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
> > command from workspace.
> >
> > Milan
>
> Milan:
>
> I think you mean 'SMSqueakMap bootStrap'. However I suspect neither of
> those methods is going to help Günther as his problem is almost
> certainly occurring after this point. Unfortunately Goran is out of
> contact for a few days so he can't offer any suggestions immediately.
>
> Günther:
>
> However I will note that I just tried opening SqueakMap Package Loader
> in a clean 3.8-6665-basic image and I went through the upgrade process
> without any problems. Is there a possibility that Squeak may not be
> able to access the Internet? Like maybe you are behind a proxy? Or the
> link is just incredibly slow?
>
> Note that it should relatively quickly ask you a fairly long question
> regarding installing Monticello. It only takes me about 10-20 seconds
> to get to that step. Did you see that?
>
> Ken

Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Milan,

I also now believe that is the problem. I just can't figure out where
and why.

I mean it's not like I have to make my browser use a HTTP proxy or
anything, my localhosts' firewall also is not hindering squeak.

I have a DSL-Modem-Router and my localhost which is using the router as
a gateway.

Any suggestions?

Günther

Milan Zimmermann schrieb:

> Ken,
>
> you are most likely right on both accounts (that deleting the sm will not help
> and the real reason may be a proxy/network problem)
>
>
> Milan
>
> On 2006 June 3 17:09, Ken Causey wrote:
>> On Sat, 2006-06-03 at 16:46 -0400, Milan Zimmermann wrote:
>>> 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
>>> command from workspace.
>>>
>>> Milan
>> Milan:
>>
>> I think you mean 'SMSqueakMap bootStrap'. However I suspect neither of
>> those methods is going to help Günther as his problem is almost
>> certainly occurring after this point. Unfortunately Goran is out of
>> contact for a few days so he can't offer any suggestions immediately.
>>
>> Günther:
>>
>> However I will note that I just tried opening SqueakMap Package Loader
>> in a clean 3.8-6665-basic image and I went through the upgrade process
>> without any problems. Is there a possibility that Squeak may not be
>> able to access the Internet? Like maybe you are behind a proxy? Or the
>> link is just incredibly slow?
>>
>> Note that it should relatively quickly ask you a fairly long question
>> regarding installing Monticello. It only takes me about 10-20 seconds
>> to get to that step. Did you see that?
>>
>> Ken
>
>

Milan Zimmermann-2

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Günther,

First let me describe what I get: Clicking "Open SMPackege Loader" in an image
the requests to update client to 2.2:

Messages:

upgrading squeakmap
snapshotting methods
diffing
loading
cleaning up
compiling
initializiing

Do you see any of the above?

Takes about a minute combined on DSL - this is Linux with a 3.9 VM though..

So what to try?

I am not really sure any of the below will help, but if you want to, try one
or both of two approaches. (In both cases, although it seems clear it is not
the problem, I would delete the SM directory..just in case and it should not
hurt i think). Then:

1) Slow Method: Wait for that failure message (may want to run it overnight
if it's slow as you said it seems) and send it here along with the
SqueakDebug.log. Describe what is going on along the way (any messages you
see, answer etc) and send it here.

2) Fast Method: Open the SM Package Loader, Wait for a few minutes or so, and
then interrupt the process by clicking Alt-. (alt and dot). That will ask if
you want to proceed, you can investigate what is going on in the stack, but
it is probably not straighforward. You could send a screenshot of the
interrupt stack, that may help to pinpoint what is hapenning, although I am
not much qualified at that :). You could also save the image at that point
(thus freezing the state), ask someone to download it and look at it,
although I am not sure it would be all that helpful because other person
would run it on a different network.

Milan

On 2006 June 3 19:11, Günther Schmidt wrote:

> Milan,
>
> I also now believe that is the problem. I just can't figure out where
> and why.
>
> I mean it's not like I have to make my browser use a HTTP proxy or
> anything, my localhosts' firewall also is not hindering squeak.
>
> I have a DSL-Modem-Router and my localhost which is using the router as
> a gateway.
>
> Any suggestions?
>
> Günther
>
> Milan Zimmermann schrieb:
> > Ken,
> >
> > you are most likely right on both accounts (that deleting the sm will not
> > help and the real reason may be a proxy/network problem)
> >
> >
> > Milan
> >
> > On 2006 June 3 17:09, Ken Causey wrote:
> >> On Sat, 2006-06-03 at 16:46 -0400, Milan Zimmermann wrote:
> >>> 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
> >>> command from workspace.
> >>>
> >>> Milan
> >>
> >> Milan:
> >>
> >> I think you mean 'SMSqueakMap bootStrap'. However I suspect neither of
> >> those methods is going to help Günther as his problem is almost
> >> certainly occurring after this point. Unfortunately Goran is out of
> >> contact for a few days so he can't offer any suggestions immediately.
> >>
> >> Günther:
> >>
> >> However I will note that I just tried opening SqueakMap Package Loader
> >> in a clean 3.8-6665-basic image and I went through the upgrade process
> >> without any problems. Is there a possibility that Squeak may not be
> >> able to access the Internet? Like maybe you are behind a proxy? Or the
> >> link is just incredibly slow?
> >>
> >> Note that it should relatively quickly ask you a fairly long question
> >> regarding installing Monticello. It only takes me about 10-20 seconds
> >> to get to that step. Did you see that?
> >>
> >> Ken

Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Milan, Ken

I no longer think the problem is network related.
I traced what SM is doing via ethereal and the last HTTP
request/response is:

GET /SMBase-gk.84.mcz HTTP/1.0
ACCEPT: application/octet-stream
ACCEPT: text/html
User-Agent: Squeak3.8-6665
Host: squeak.krampe.se:80

HTTP/1.1 200 OK
Date: Sun, 04 Jun 2006 11:47:58 GMT
Server: Apache/1.3.33 (Debian GNU/Linux)
Last-Modified: Thu, 04 May 2006 23:56:24 GMT
ETag: "57add-1b234-445a94a8"
Accept-Ranges: bytes
Content-Length: 111156
Connection: close
Content-Type: text/plain

When I interrupt the process it is always stuck on a call to

MultiByteFileStream>>open:forWrite:

I've attached the fileOut.

As I said this happens on WinXP PRO.

Günther

Milan Zimmermann schrieb:

> Günther,
>
> First let me describe what I get: Clicking "Open SMPackege Loader" in an image
> the requests to update client to 2.2:
>
> Messages:
>
> upgrading squeakmap
> snapshotting methods
> diffing
> loading
> cleaning up
> compiling
> initializiing
>
> Do you see any of the above?
>
> Takes about a minute combined on DSL - this is Linux with a 3.9 VM though..
>
>
> So what to try?
>
> I am not really sure any of the below will help, but if you want to, try one
> or both of two approaches. (In both cases, although it seems clear it is not
> the problem, I would delete the SM directory..just in case and it should not
> hurt i think). Then:
>
> 1) Slow Method: Wait for that failure message (may want to run it overnight
> if it's slow as you said it seems) and send it here along with the
> SqueakDebug.log. Describe what is going on along the way (any messages you
> see, answer etc) and send it here.
>
> 2) Fast Method: Open the SM Package Loader, Wait for a few minutes or so, and
> then interrupt the process by clicking Alt-. (alt and dot). That will ask if
> you want to proceed, you can investigate what is going on in the stack, but
> it is probably not straighforward. You could send a screenshot of the
> interrupt stack, that may help to pinpoint what is hapenning, although I am
> not much qualified at that :). You could also save the image at that point
> (thus freezing the state), ask someone to download it and look at it,
> although I am not sure it would be all that helpful because other person
> would run it on a different network.
>
> Milan
>
>
> On 2006 June 3 19:11, Günther Schmidt wrote:
>> Milan,
>>
>> I also now believe that is the problem. I just can't figure out where
>> and why.
>>
>> I mean it's not like I have to make my browser use a HTTP proxy or
>> anything, my localhosts' firewall also is not hindering squeak.
>>
>> I have a DSL-Modem-Router and my localhost which is using the router as
>> a gateway.
>>
>> Any suggestions?
>>
>> Günther
>>
>> Milan Zimmermann schrieb:
>>> Ken,
>>>
>>> you are most likely right on both accounts (that deleting the sm will not
>>> help and the real reason may be a proxy/network problem)
>>>
>>>
>>> Milan
>>>
>>> On 2006 June 3 17:09, Ken Causey wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 2006-06-03 at 16:46 -0400, Milan Zimmermann wrote:
>>>>> 2) There is another way I now cannot find on the list on first try .. a
>>>>> command from workspace.
>>>>>
>>>>> Milan
>>>> Milan:
>>>>
>>>> I think you mean 'SMSqueakMap bootStrap'. However I suspect neither of
>>>> those methods is going to help Günther as his problem is almost
>>>> certainly occurring after this point. Unfortunately Goran is out of
>>>> contact for a few days so he can't offer any suggestions immediately.
>>>>
>>>> Günther:
>>>>
>>>> However I will note that I just tried opening SqueakMap Package Loader
>>>> in a clean 3.8-6665-basic image and I went through the upgrade process
>>>> without any problems. Is there a possibility that Squeak may not be
>>>> able to access the Internet? Like maybe you are behind a proxy? Or the
>>>> link is just incredibly slow?
>>>>
>>>> Note that it should relatively quickly ask you a fairly long question
>>>> regarding installing Monticello. It only takes me about 10-20 seconds
>>>> to get to that step. Did you see that?
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>
>

'From Squeak3.8 of ''5 May 2005'' [latest update: #6665] on 4 June 2006 at 1:51:57 pm'! !StandardFileStream methodsFor: 'open/close' stamp: 'yo 2/24/2005 18:34'! open: fileName forWrite: writeMode "Open the file with the given name. If writeMode is true, allow writing, otherwise open the file in read-only mode." "Changed to do a GC and retry before failing ar 3/21/98 17:25" | f | f _ fileName asVmPathName. fileID _ StandardFileStream retryWithGC:[self primOpen: f writable: writeMode] until:[:id| id notNil] forFileNamed: fileName. fileID ifNil: [^ nil]. "allows sender to detect failure" self register. name _ fileName. rwmode _ writeMode. buffer1 _ String new: 1. ! !

Bert Freudenberg-3

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Am 04.06.2006 um 13:55 schrieb Günther Schmidt:

> I traced what SM is doing via ethereal and the last HTTP request/
> response is:
>
> GET /SMBase-gk.84.mcz HTTP/1.0
>
> HTTP/1.1 200 OK
> Content-Length: 111156
>
> When I interrupt the process it is always stuck on a call to
>
> MultiByteFileStream>>open:forWrite:

Which file is it trying to open? Make sure there is enough disc space
and you have write permission.

- Bert -

Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Hi Bert,

it's trying to open the changes file.

Bert Freudenberg schrieb:

> Am 04.06.2006 um 13:55 schrieb Günther Schmidt:
>
>> I traced what SM is doing via ethereal and the last HTTP
>> request/response is:
>>
>> GET /SMBase-gk.84.mcz HTTP/1.0
>>
>> HTTP/1.1 200 OK
>> Content-Length: 111156
>>
>> When I interrupt the process it is always stuck on a call to
>>
>> MultiByteFileStream>>open:forWrite:
>
> Which file is it trying to open? Make sure there is enough disc space
> and you have write permission.
>
> - Bert -
>
>
>

Milan Zimmermann-2

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Günther Schmidt

On 2006 June 4 07:55, Günther Schmidt wrote:
> User-Agent: Squeak3.8-6665
> Host: squeak.krampe.se:80

hmmm... I never realized it is getting the MCZ from Goran Krampe's URL, this
is regular 3.8 right? ... can you, from your browser, get listing from
http://squeak.krampe.se/ ?

Well, I am at the end of what I can think of (as Bert said, check permissions
and space left).

I did, on my 3.8, the following:
-typed krampe.se in workspace
- highlighted it
- clicked to get menu
- on menu, clicked "more.."
- clicked "method sources with it"
expecting to find krampe.se somewhere but did not, I am not sure where that
string comes from , I guess it is dynamically loaded.

Well, apart from that I do not know .. you may want to wait for Goran to
respond ..

Milan

Günther Schmidt

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

as am I.

I think my XP is screwed up, cause it keeps making CHKDSK on every 3rd
boot or so.

So on Tuesday I'll be getting myself an external HD and back everything
up and install XP new.

Thanks for all the help guys!

Günther

Milan Zimmermann schrieb:

> On 2006 June 4 07:55, Günther Schmidt wrote:
>> User-Agent: Squeak3.8-6665
>> Host: squeak.krampe.se:80
>
> hmmm... I never realized it is getting the MCZ from Goran Krampe's URL, this
> is regular 3.8 right? ... can you, from your browser, get listing from
> http://squeak.krampe.se/ ?
>
> Well, I am at the end of what I can think of (as Bert said, check permissions
> and space left).
>
> I did, on my 3.8, the following:
> -typed krampe.se in workspace
> - highlighted it
> - clicked to get menu
> - on menu, clicked "more.."
> - clicked "method sources with it"
> expecting to find krampe.se somewhere but did not, I am not sure where that
> string comes from , I guess it is dynamically loaded.
>
> Well, apart from that I do not know .. you may want to wait for Goran to
> respond ..
>
> Milan
>
>

Peter Crowther-2

RE: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Günther Schmidt

> From: Günther Schmidt
> I think my XP is screwed up, cause it keeps making CHKDSK on
> every 3rd boot or so.

http://www.ariolic.com/activesmart/?StartMenu and download the free trial. It's found several failing HDDs for me, both on my own machines and on client sites.

- Peter

Göran Krampe

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

In reply to this post by Günther Schmidt

Hi Günther and everyone else!

Sorry for being "offline" - I was down south in Sweden on a prolonged
holiday.

=?UTF-8?B?R8O8bnRoZXIgU2NobWlkdA==?= <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I think my XP is screwed up, cause it keeps making CHKDSK on every 3rd
> boot or so.

Well, I am not sure. I have ready through this thread lightly and here
are a few comments:

1. Nothing should take 1 hour. Especially if no TCP/IP is going on. :)

2. You wrote in one post that it is stuck in open:forWrite: - the stack
would be interesting to see but I presume it is trying to open the
changes file. It should be writeable, check that. One test you can do:
modify some code, like for example - browse *any* method and change it
in some way (add a space or whatever) and press alt-s. If that works
then the changes file is writable. It should now be modified and be
slightly larger.

3. Right, you will not find "krampe.se" in the code - the bootStrap code
first asks (using HTTP) map.squeak.org for the URL to the release it
should download. So it is not hardcoded.

4. When it is stuck - press alt-. to get a debugger and use "mail out
bug report" to send me an email with the stack. You can change the email
address in the window that pops up.

regards, Göran

Randysiler

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

I have a question: How should I be thinking about whether to wait for Tweak or jump into Squeak and start learning.

CAn anyone give me a sense of how far away Tweak is?

Will knowledge of Morphic be obsoleted by Tweak?

I don't really have a specific project in mind but rather am interested in getting my feet wet with the idea of building concrete, visible, directly manipulable models of conceptual things that empower understanding.

It seems like Tweak is an attempt to do again some of what was done before, but from a perspective of knowing more for having already been over the territory. That suggests to me that it might be foolish to jump into Squeak right now, but I know so little.

Thank you very much for taking the time,

I'm very much enjoying learning from what you all write,

Randy Siler

Coordinator, CIDR Computing

Center for Instructional Development and Research

University of Washington

407 A Sieg Hall. Box 351725

SEATTLE, WA 98195

voice: 206-543-0751 fax: 206-685-1213

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Edgar J. De Cleene

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour

Re: Using SqueakMap on a fresh 3.8 Image for the first time -> CPU 100% for an hour Randy Siler puso en su mail :

CAn anyone give me a sense of how far away Tweak is?

Will knowledge of Morphic be obsoleted by Tweak?

Tweak I don’t know, Sophie is 22 days away.
Morphic is here and is easy and fun.
Juan Vuletich is rewriting a lot for a better Morphic , others could improve Morphic too.
I think what Squeak could have some Morphic for some years in the future.

Edgar