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Rob Rothwell

"Smart Paper"?

I've been seeing some messages fly by about people using Squeak like "Smart Paper." What is meant by this? Using the various presentation morphs and just projects and workspaces for a more visual, dynamic, note taking system?

Could anyone give examples of how they are using Squeak just as a general tool, not necessarily for programming per se, if this is the correct way to interpret this?

Just looking for uses I am not recognizing...

Rob
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Herbert König

Re: "Smart Paper"?

Hello Rob,

RR> I've been seeing some messages fly by about people using
RR> Squeak like "Smart Paper." What is meant by this? Using the
RR> various presentation morphs and just projects and workspaces for a
RR> more visual, dynamic, note taking system?

some of us use it for presentations. BookMorph even has a method whose
name suggests you can import powerpoint. I never used BookMorph except
for trying.

One version of smart paper is, I draw userinterfaces by just placing
the elements into an empty project and place texts around them like
the names to reference them, the message names they send an some
general description of what they do. Did this on paper before.

In one case where I did not need so much text around I gradually
filled the sketch with life to have a prototype

For many aspects of a development project I have several Squeak
project with browsers open on the relevant methods and Workspaces. And
I have sketches about the flow of some aspects of the software.

For my project leading job I carry an 3.6 Squeak on a USB stick which
I really use as a notetaker. I lead a road design software project
where I have Squeak projects on technical, sales, customer and
competition aspects.

The last one is what I was talking about in my reply to Brenda's post
in Squeak dev.

Cheers,

Herbert

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Rob Rothwell

Re: "Smart Paper"?

On Sat, Jul 5, 2008 at 6:46 AM, Herbert König <[hidden email]> wrote:

One version of smart paper is, I draw userinterfaces by just placing
the elements into an empty project and place texts around them like
the names to reference them, the message names they send an some
general description of what they do. Did this on paper before.

This is going to sound really lame, but do you have any screenshots you can share? This sounds like a very useful technique, but I don't think my brain is using Morphic that way. In fact, I don't think my brain is using Morphic at all!

In one case where I did not need so much text around I gradually
filled the sketch with life to have a prototype

For many aspects of a development project I have several Squeak
project with browsers open on the relevant methods and Workspaces. And
I have sketches about the flow of some aspects of the software.

What are you using for your sketches?

For my project leading job I carry an 3.6 Squeak on a USB stick which
I really use as a notetaker. I lead a road design software project
where I have Squeak projects on technical, sales, customer and
competition aspects.

What features do you use for notes? Workspaces for typing? Connectors? More sketches? Why 3.6? Does it have features that have been removed?

The last one is what I was talking about in my reply to Brenda's post
in Squeak dev.

Thank you for sharing. I have been trying to "study my history" lately, and am feeling very much like there are all these capabilities out there that I am definitely NOT taking advantage of! When I read, for example, that "The original [Augment] system is still in use today by Dr. Engelbart and the Bootstrap Alliance," I just have to think that we are all suffering from not maximizing the capabilities of the systems we already have!

Thanks again,

Rob

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Steven Claflin

Re: "Smart Paper"?

Hi Rob,

I wanted to thank you for your email to the list and your struggles. I
am just beginning to learn about Squeak and being an old procedural
programmer (PDP-11), OOP in general is kind of backwards to my way of
thinking, and so I can identify with your feeling as though you are just
not online all the way. The first programming that I did that was at all
object oriented was in Visual Basic many years ago, and I can remember
thinking; "Ok, these buttons and windows and textboxes can react to
actions, but how do you start the whole thing going?" It's kind of
laughable now, but at the time I was used to: first you have the
computer do one thing, then the next thing, and so on... So its like I
was sitting there waiting for the program to do something and the
program was sitting there waiting for me to do something.

I am hoping that as I go through the material, ideas which aren't
immediately understandable will become so after getting more info. It's
hard to do that, because it makes me feel uncomfortable to feel as
though I'm not getting it. When I was going to school for my degree in
electronics there was a lot of that, and that turned out ok.

Good luck, hopefully we'll get it. :-)

Steve

On Sat, 2008-07-05 at 09:56 -0400, Rob Rothwell wrote:

> On Sat, Jul 5, 2008 at 6:46 AM, Herbert König <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> One version of smart paper is, I draw userinterfaces by just
> placing
> the elements into an empty project and place texts around them
> like
> the names to reference them, the message names they send an
> some
> general description of what they do. Did this on paper before.
>
> This is going to sound really lame, but do you have any screenshots
> you can share? This sounds like a very useful technique, but I don't
> think my brain is using Morphic that way. In fact, I don't think my
> brain is using Morphic at all!
>
>
> In one case where I did not need so much text around I
> gradually
> filled the sketch with life to have a prototype
>
> For many aspects of a development project I have several
> Squeak
> project with browsers open on the relevant methods and
> Workspaces. And
> I have sketches about the flow of some aspects of the
> software.
>
> What are you using for your sketches?
>
>
> For my project leading job I carry an 3.6 Squeak on a USB
> stick which
> I really use as a notetaker. I lead a road design software
> project
> where I have Squeak projects on technical, sales, customer and
> competition aspects.
>
> What features do you use for notes? Workspaces for typing?
> Connectors? More sketches? Why 3.6? Does it have features that
> have been removed?
>
>
> The last one is what I was talking about in my reply to
> Brenda's post
> in Squeak dev.
>
> Thank you for sharing. I have been trying to "study my history"
> lately, and am feeling very much like there are all these capabilities
> out there that I am definitely NOT taking advantage of! When I read,
> for example, that "The original [Augment] system is still in use today
> by Dr. Engelbart and the Bootstrap Alliance," I just have to think
> that we are all suffering from not maximizing the capabilities of the
> systems we already have!
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Rob
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Beginners mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners

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Prashanth Hebbar

Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Rob Rothwell

Hello Rob:

I have been using Squeak for corporate presentation. I have effectively stopped using PowerPoint. As you suspected, I use the book morph and the stack morph for creating presentations. My Squeak presentations are much more effective and come across as creative than passive PowerPoint ones. However, I do find a lot of limitations in Squeak, owing to my own ignorance I think, they are as follows:

1. I tried animating my Squeak presentations using EToys but it is way too hard

2. I failed to run some Flash movies on Squeak, some months ago Edgar had suggested that older images support Flash but it didn't work for me. Maybe I failed to include the Balloon package and was trying to activate the FlashPlayer Morph. I lost interest in that at that point in time and left off my experiments.

3. Exporting my slides from a book morph and a stack morph is way too laborious, the way I do it. Usually, I save all my slides as Jpegs/PNGs and send them to people in a folder which they can view in any Windows/Linux image viewer with slide show capability. This approach renders my slides to be passive like PowerPoint but lot more aesthetic in look&feel. I tried to do this better but in vain. Any sugggestions?

4. Nowadays, I am pushing people to download Squeak and load my projects. But it is difficult to move corporate people from Windows/Mac's native applicaitons and freelancers from Adobe Flash/Photoshop.

But I must say that I have been sticking to Squeak as my authoring platform. I take notes using workspace and export it as txt files for further use. I use stack morphs to develop story boards (I am a writer, specialising in technology and economy.)

This may be too low-level for people on this mail-list. Please forgive me. If you have ideas for me, I will be grateful. (I intend to do some serious programming in the days to come. I have programmed in Fortran, Cobol, Pascal, C , Basic and used DBase IV and FoxBase. This is all between 1989 to 1994.)

Regards,
Prashanth Hebbar

On 7/5/08, Rob Rothwell <[hidden email]> wrote:

I've been seeing some messages fly by about people using Squeak like "Smart Paper." What is meant by this? Using the various presentation morphs and just projects and workspaces for a more visual, dynamic, note taking system?

Could anyone give examples of how they are using Squeak just as a general tool, not necessarily for programming per se, if this is the correct way to interpret this?

Just looking for uses I am not recognizing...

Rob
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Bangalore
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Herbert König

Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Rob Rothwell

Hello Rob,

RR> This is going to sound really lame, but do you have any
RR> screenshots you can share? This sounds like a very useful

I send you a private mail, the lists have limits on the size of posts.

RR> What are you using for your sketches?

The objects from the ObjectCatalog in the World Menu. Lines, Texts
with coloured Backgrounds, Buttons. Here I would like that typing in
the air just creates a text. Have you come across the red Halo buttons
"Show handles" entry for lines (PolygonMorph)?

RR> What features do you use for notes? Workspaces for typing?
RR> Connectors?
Mainly texts, sometimes with border. Usually I copy an existing one
with the green halo button. Connectors where too heavyweight on
computing power when I tried them.

RR> Why 3.6? Does it have features that have been removed?
3.6 Full is just small and I want an image that starts fast.
Especially in production (physical goods) I encounter quite some
computers with USB1.1.

And I keep 3.6 around because it has "The worlds of Squeak" which
really is a showcase on what is possible with Squeak.

--
Cheers,

Herbert

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Herbert König

Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Prashanth Hebbar

Hello Prashanth,

PH> I have been using Squeak for corporate presentation. I have
PH> effectively stopped using PowerPoint. As you suspected, I use the
PH> book morph and the stack morph for creating presentations. My

interesting. What image are you using?

PH> 1. I tried animating my Squeak presentations using EToys but it is way too hard

To see what can be done, search the web for Squeak News. Tansel
Ersavas has done some very impressive interactive essays in Squeak.
Just to get up your appetitite for learning :-))

PH> 2. I failed to run some Flash movies on Squeak, some months
PH> ago Edgar had suggested that older images support Flash but it
PH> didn't work for me. Maybe I failed to include the Balloon package
PH> and was trying to activate the FlashPlayer Morph. I lost interest
PH> in that at that point in time and left off my experiments.

AFAIK Squeak only understands Flash 3. Try a 3.6 to 3.8 full image, it
should have everything installed

PH> But I must say that I have been sticking to Squeak as my
PH> authoring platform. I take notes using workspace and export it as
PH> txt files for further use. I use stack morphs to develop story
PH> boards (I am a writer, specialising in technology and economy.)

Maybe take a look at Sophie?

PH> This may be too low-level for people on this mail-list.
PH> Please forgive me. If you have ideas for me, I will be grateful.
PH> (I intend to do some serious programming in the days to come. I
PH> have programmed in Fortran, Cobol, Pascal, C , Basic and used
PH> DBase IV and FoxBase. This is all between 1989 to 1994.)

This is beginners. Actually I guess you qualify as a professional
Squeak user, maybe not mainsteram. Squeak is more than programming.

Cheers,

Herbert

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Edgar J. De Cleene

Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Prashanth Hebbar

El 7/6/08 2:06 AM, "Prashanth Hebbar" <[hidden email]> escribió:

> 2. I failed to run some Flash movies on Squeak, some months ago Edgar had
> suggested that older images support Flash but it didn't work for me. Maybe I
> failed to include the Balloon package and was trying to activate the
> FlashPlayer Morph. I lost interest in that at that point in time and left off
> my experiments.

Because Flash in Squeak is older (version 3).
Sure can't run new versions of Flash made things.
By the way my answer to Rob in the SqueakLightII
http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/6056 , shows how to load Flash and as
SqueakLightII is 3.10 based, also could be loaded with user help.

Not run newer Flash and I don't have any plans to do.

Edgar

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Prashanth Hebbar

Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Herbert König

PH> I have been using Squeak for corporate presentation. I have
PH> effectively stopped using PowerPoint. As you suspected, I use the
PH> book morph and the stack morph for creating presentations. My

interesting. What image are you using?

PH: 3.9 and 3.10. I do have 3.6 image but rarely use it.

PH> 1. I tried animating my Squeak presentations using EToys but it is way too hard

To see what can be done, search the web for Squeak News. Tansel
Ersavas has done some very impressive interactive essays in Squeak.
Just to get up your appetitite for learning :-))

PH: Yes. I am going through the stuff now. Thanks for pointing this out.

PH> But I must say that I have been sticking to Squeak as my
PH> authoring platform. I take notes using workspace and export it as
PH> txt files for further use. I use stack morphs to develop story
PH> boards (I am a writer, specialising in technology and economy.)

Maybe take a look at Sophie?

PH: I had given it a quick look an year ago but did not go back. Will do now.

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Prashanth Hebbar

Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Edgar J. De Cleene

> 2. I failed to run some Flash movies on Squeak, some months ago Edgar had
> suggested that older images support Flash but it didn't work for me. Maybe I
> failed to include the Balloon package and was trying to activate the
> FlashPlayer Morph. I lost interest in that at that point in time and left off
> my experiments.

Because Flash in Squeak is older (version 3).
Sure can't run new versions of Flash made things.
By the way my answer to Rob in the SqueakLightII
http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/6056 , shows how to load Flash and as
SqueakLightII is 3.10 based, also could be loaded with user help.

Not run newer Flash and I don't have any plans to do.

Thanks Edgar. My failure with Flash is due to my own doing (not being persistent) and I remember you had given me some good pointers.

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Edgar J. De Cleene

Re: "Smart Paper"?

El 7/6/08 5:39 AM, "Prashanth Hebbar" <[hidden email]> escribió:

> Thanks Edgar. My failure with Flash is due to my own doing (not being
> persistent) and I remember you had given me some good pointers.

And like help you and all here.
I was in the same place six years ago and also I comes from structured world
, Pascal , Omnis 3 and Old Classic Mac Toolbox was my background when I
"discover" Squeak .
I port my old MorphicGreeting from 3.2 times so could have some ideas to
develop.

Stay tuned.

Edgar

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Edgar J. De Cleene

MorphicGreeting (was Re: "Smart Paper"?

In reply to this post by Prashanth Hebbar

>
>
> El 7/6/08 5:39 AM, "Prashanth Hebbar" <[hidden email]> escribió:
>
>> Thanks Edgar. My failure with Flash is due to my own doing (not being
>> persistent) and I remember you had given me some good pointers.
>
> And like help you and all here.
> I was in the same place six years ago and also I comes from structured world ,
> Pascal , Omnis 3 and Old Classic Mac Toolbox was my background when I
> "discover" Squeak .
> I port my old MorphicGreeting from 3.2 times so could have some ideas to
> develop.
>
> Stay tuned.
>
> Edgar

Was easier as I think, I need save the original 3.2 from six years ago first
in 3.8, delete all windows and create the "greeting card" again.
This one was saved and voila, SqueakLight could open without any complain.
I put here a low quality pict, the music was once send to list by Alan and I
bet nobody find cute kitties into his desk as me

The Project with photo and music is 408 k , so is big to save on the swiki,
but I could send to any.

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Picture 3.jpg (43K) Download Attachment

Prashanth Hebbar

Re: MorphicGreeting (was Re: "Smart Paper"?

Edgar:

That's a cute kitten! I am interested in looking into the project file. Can you send it to me or let me know how best to source it.

Regards,

On 7/6/08, Edgar J. De Cleene <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
>
> El 7/6/08 5:39 AM, "Prashanth Hebbar" <[hidden email]> escribió:
>
>> Thanks Edgar. My failure with Flash is due to my own doing (not being
>> persistent) and I remember you had given me some good pointers.
>
> And like help you and all here.
> I was in the same place six years ago and also I comes from structured world ,
> Pascal , Omnis 3 and Old Classic Mac Toolbox was my background when I
> "discover" Squeak .
> I port my old MorphicGreeting from 3.2 times so could have some ideas to
> develop.
>
> Stay tuned.
>
> Edgar

Was easier as I think, I need save the original 3.2 from six years ago first
in 3.8, delete all windows and create the "greeting card" again.
This one was saved and voila, SqueakLight could open without any complain.
I put here a low quality pict, the music was once send to list by Alan and I
bet nobody find cute kitties into his desk as me

The Project with photo and music is 408 k , so is big to save on the swiki,
but I could send to any.

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--
Prashanth Hebbar
Bangalore
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Edgar J. De Cleene

Re: MorphicGreeting (was Re: "Smart Paper"?

El 7/6/08 7:36 AM, "Prashanth Hebbar" <[hidden email]> escribió:

> Edgar:
>
> That's a cute kitten! I am interested in looking into the project file. Can
> you send it to me or let me know how best to source it.
>
> Regards,

Here the fileOut of original 2002 project.
Was one of my first on Squeak.
Later or tomorrow i look in back ups , have some older of how to read the
colors from external ascii file and have Squeak "learn" this new colors.
Could be useful to some...

Works with GreetingMorph new, the pict and the midi should be on the same
Squeak folder.
Somewhere I have a modern version for explore the computer for files...

I on a half hour and then I start to watch formula one

Edgar

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Morphic-Greeting.1.cs (10K) Download Attachment

John Chandler-3

separating app from platform-specific parts of image?

In reply to this post by Prashanth Hebbar

I need to run Seaside on a Debian Linux machine (a public web server)
to which I do not have console access.

I do not have access to *any* Debian Linux machine, in fact, I have
my PowerBook G4, and that's it.

I understand that I can run a Squeak package that implements VNC, and
that there is a "headless" mode that should allow me to launch Squeak
w/o any GUI.

It is not clear to me which parts of this are platform-independent
and how to get them loaded into a running image w/o having GUI access
to it.

I'm not even sure that I'm asking the question particularly clearly,
but I'm hoping someone can decipher my ravings.

-jmc

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Bert Freudenberg

Re: separating app from platform-specific parts of image?

Am 11.07.2008 um 19:05 schrieb John Chandler:

> I need to run Seaside on a Debian Linux machine (a public web
> server) to which I do not have console access.
>
> I do not have access to *any* Debian Linux machine, in fact, I have
> my PowerBook G4, and that's it.
>
> I understand that I can run a Squeak package that implements VNC,
> and that there is a "headless" mode that should allow me to launch
> Squeak w/o any GUI.
>
> It is not clear to me which parts of this are platform-independent
> and how to get them loaded into a running image w/o having GUI
> access to it.
>
> I'm not even sure that I'm asking the question particularly clearly,
> but I'm hoping someone can decipher my ravings.

Prepare your image locally, make sure VNC works, and if everything is
to your liking, move it to the server.

- Bert -

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Janko Mivšek

Re: separating app from platform-specific parts of image?

In reply to this post by John Chandler-3

Hi John,

John Chandler wrote:

> I understand that I can run a Squeak package that implements VNC, and
> that there is a "headless" mode that should allow me to launch Squeak
> w/o any GUI.
>
> It is not clear to me which parts of this are platform-independent and
> how to get them loaded into a running image w/o having GUI access to it.
>
> I'm not even sure that I'm asking the question particularly clearly, but
> I'm hoping someone can decipher my ravings.

Yes, VNC access to a headless Squeak image is one of Squeak magics a
love most. You just need to install a package RemoteFrameBuffer in your
image, set the parameters then run headless and you'll be able to
connect to image and see its full GUI remotely. No X needed on host
machine. Pure magic :)

Janko

--
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AIDA/Web
Smalltalk Web Application Server
http://www.aidaweb.si
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John Chandler-3

Re: separating app from platform-specific parts of image?

On Jul 11, 2008, at 7:34 PM, Janko Mivšek wrote:

> Hi John,
>
> John Chandler wrote:
>
>> I understand that I can run a Squeak package that implements VNC,
>> and that there is a "headless" mode that should allow me to launch
>> Squeak w/o any GUI.
>> It is not clear to me which parts of this are platform-independent
>> and how to get them loaded into a running image w/o having GUI
>> access to it.
>> I'm not even sure that I'm asking the question particularly
>> clearly, but I'm hoping someone can decipher my ravings.
>
> Yes, VNC access to a headless Squeak image is one of Squeak magics
> a love most. You just need to install a package RemoteFrameBuffer
> in your image, set the parameters then run headless and you'll be
> able to connect to image and see its full GUI remotely. No X needed
> on host machine. Pure magic :)
>
> Janko
>

OK, but if my image is for Mac OS X PPC, and the target machine is
Debian x86, will the image I copy to it even start up?

-jmc

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NorbertHartl

Re: separating app from platform-specific parts of image?

On Sat, 2008-07-12 at 10:36 +0200, John Chandler wrote:

> On Jul 11, 2008, at 7:34 PM, Janko Mivšek wrote:
>
> > Hi John,
> >
> > John Chandler wrote:
> >
> >> I understand that I can run a Squeak package that implements VNC,
> >> and that there is a "headless" mode that should allow me to launch
> >> Squeak w/o any GUI.
> >> It is not clear to me which parts of this are platform-independent
> >> and how to get them loaded into a running image w/o having GUI
> >> access to it.
> >> I'm not even sure that I'm asking the question particularly
> >> clearly, but I'm hoping someone can decipher my ravings.
> >
> > Yes, VNC access to a headless Squeak image is one of Squeak magics
> > a love most. You just need to install a package RemoteFrameBuffer
> > in your image, set the parameters then run headless and you'll be
> > able to connect to image and see its full GUI remotely. No X needed
> > on host machine. Pure magic :)
> >
> > Janko
> >
>
> OK, but if my image is for Mac OS X PPC, and the target machine is
> Debian x86, will the image I copy to it even start up?
>

Don't mix vm and image. I would wonder if you've got an image that's
for Mac OS X PPC. The vm is platform dependent while the image is
not. It should just work that you work with the image on Mac OS PPC
and the copy it to debian Intel machine and start it up.

Norbert

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David T. Lewis

Re: separating app from platform-specific parts of image?

In reply to this post by John Chandler-3

On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 10:36:50AM +0200, John Chandler wrote:
>
> OK, but if my image is for Mac OS X PPC, and the target machine is
> Debian x86, will the image I copy to it even start up?

Yes, it will work fine. Amazing but true.

Dave

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