current status
Locked
12
12
 
|
You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a
project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be used to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source code. Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but the work is very promising. Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside javascript. Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west panes to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework executes to render the pane... It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds up under real stress ... I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have folks pretty things up a bit ... Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, so I would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are up to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of other folks besides myself ... I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) Dale [1]http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ |
|
|
Hi Dale:
Is not that I have time right now to help, but wanted to comment about an announce in Visual Smalltalk list (I don't know if you read it or not) about a new Smalltalk [1] in this sense. This is a project from Smalltalking group [2] from Ale Reimondo. I just wanted to comment in case of interest. Cheers. Germán. [1] http://forum.world.st/S8-Smalltalk-on-the-quot-Invisible-Machine-quot-td3802015.html [2] http://www.smalltalking.net 2011/10/9 Dale <[hidden email]>: > You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a > project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. > > I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be used > to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source code. > > Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but > the work is very promising. > > Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript > libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within > Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript > examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside > javascript. > > Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on > simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am > basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... > > I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west panes > to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... > > I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the > server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application > specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a > fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the > server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework > executes to render the pane... > > It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to > start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds up > under real stress ... > > I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have folks > pretty things up a bit ... > > Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, so I > would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are up > to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of > other folks besides myself ... > > I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) > > Dale > > [1]http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- > with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ > |
|
|
Germán,
I did see the announcement and it looks to be interesting. I will be curious about S8 integration with javascript and javascript libraries as that is the primary appeal of Amber (at the moment). Dale ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2011 1:24:18 PM | Subject: Re: current status | | Hi Dale: | | Is not that I have time right now to help, but wanted to comment | about | an announce in Visual Smalltalk list (I don't know if you read it or | not) about a new Smalltalk [1] in this sense. This is a project from | Smalltalking group [2] from Ale Reimondo. | | I just wanted to comment in case of interest. | | Cheers. | Germán. | | | [1] | http://forum.world.st/S8-Smalltalk-on-the-quot-Invisible-Machine-quot-td3802015.html | [2] http://www.smalltalking.net | | | 2011/10/9 Dale <[hidden email]>: | > You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a | > project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. | > | > I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be | > used | > to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source | > code. | > | > Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but | > the work is very promising. | > | > Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript | > libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within | > Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript | > examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside | > javascript. | > | > Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on | > simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am | > basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... | > | > I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west | > panes | > to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... | > | > I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the | > server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application | > specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a | > fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the | > server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework | > executes to render the pane... | > | > It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to | > start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds | > up | > under real stress ... | > | > I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have | > folks | > pretty things up a bit ... | > | > Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, | > so I | > would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are | > up | > to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of | > other folks besides myself ... | > | > I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) | > | > Dale | > | > [1]http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- | > with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ | > | |
|
|
We must wait the official first release :)
But I'm very interested because I need a way of "uniform" the building of UI's. The new version of my product PasswordsPro is in Dolphin, with a traditional desktop l&f but I'm planning a new version of my older product Promoter, with some new features (as a SEO toolkit) and seems that my market of users (traditionally know as shareware users, via RegNow, ShareIt, etc) prefer desktop apps to download and install. I first thinked in use Pharo (Polymorphic way as MBagger [1]), but I must say that I would prefer an only one way of build ui's, to use in desktop [2] and web applications. Time will say..... Cheers. [1] http://www.flickr.com/photos/12018791@N06/4120335838/ [2] The MetroStyle applications in Windows 8 can be html+css+javascript and this is a good think imho. 2011/10/9 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]>: > Germán, > > I did see the announcement and it looks to be interesting. > > I will be curious about S8 integration with javascript and javascript libraries as that is the primary appeal of Amber (at the moment). > > Dale > > ----- Original Message ----- > | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> > | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> > | Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2011 1:24:18 PM > | Subject: Re: current status > | > | Hi Dale: > | > | Is not that I have time right now to help, but wanted to comment > | about > | an announce in Visual Smalltalk list (I don't know if you read it or > | not) about a new Smalltalk [1] in this sense. This is a project from > | Smalltalking group [2] from Ale Reimondo. > | > | I just wanted to comment in case of interest. > | > | Cheers. > | Germán. > | > | > | [1] > | http://forum.world.st/S8-Smalltalk-on-the-quot-Invisible-Machine-quot-td3802015.html > | [2] http://www.smalltalking.net > | > | > | 2011/10/9 Dale <[hidden email]>: > | > You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a > | > project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. > | > > | > I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be > | > used > | > to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source > | > code. > | > > | > Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but > | > the work is very promising. > | > > | > Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript > | > libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within > | > Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript > | > examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside > | > javascript. > | > > | > Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on > | > simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am > | > basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... > | > > | > I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west > | > panes > | > to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... > | > > | > I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the > | > server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application > | > specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a > | > fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the > | > server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework > | > executes to render the pane... > | > > | > It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to > | > start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds > | > up > | > under real stress ... > | > > | > I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have > | > folks > | > pretty things up a bit ... > | > > | > Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, > | > so I > | > would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are > | > up > | > to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of > | > other folks besides myself ... > | > > | > I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) > | > > | > Dale > | > > | > [1]http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- > | > with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ > | > > | > |
|
|
I forgot to say that S8, as I understood, will permit the use of
almost any javascript framework, for example, talking about UIs, things as Dojo Toolkit [1]. [1] http://dojotoolkit.org/widgets 2011/10/9 Germán Arduino <[hidden email]>: > We must wait the official first release :) > > But I'm very interested because I need a way of "uniform" the building of UI's. > > The new version of my product PasswordsPro is in Dolphin, with a > traditional desktop l&f but I'm planning a new version of my older > product Promoter, with some new features (as a SEO toolkit) and seems > that my market of users (traditionally know as shareware users, via > RegNow, ShareIt, etc) prefer desktop apps to download and install. I > first thinked in use Pharo (Polymorphic way as MBagger [1]), but I > must say that I would prefer an only one way of build ui's, to use in > desktop [2] and web applications. > > Time will say..... > > Cheers. > > > [1] http://www.flickr.com/photos/12018791@N06/4120335838/ > [2] The MetroStyle applications in Windows 8 can be > html+css+javascript and this is a good think imho. > > 2011/10/9 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]>: >> Germán, >> >> I did see the announcement and it looks to be interesting. >> >> I will be curious about S8 integration with javascript and javascript libraries as that is the primary appeal of Amber (at the moment). >> >> Dale >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> >> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> >> | Sent: Sunday, October 9, 2011 1:24:18 PM >> | Subject: Re: current status >> | >> | Hi Dale: >> | >> | Is not that I have time right now to help, but wanted to comment >> | about >> | an announce in Visual Smalltalk list (I don't know if you read it or >> | not) about a new Smalltalk [1] in this sense. This is a project from >> | Smalltalking group [2] from Ale Reimondo. >> | >> | I just wanted to comment in case of interest. >> | >> | Cheers. >> | Germán. >> | >> | >> | [1] >> | http://forum.world.st/S8-Smalltalk-on-the-quot-Invisible-Machine-quot-td3802015.html >> | [2] http://www.smalltalking.net >> | >> | >> | 2011/10/9 Dale <[hidden email]>: >> | > You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a >> | > project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. >> | > >> | > I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be >> | > used >> | > to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source >> | > code. >> | > >> | > Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but >> | > the work is very promising. >> | > >> | > Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript >> | > libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within >> | > Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript >> | > examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside >> | > javascript. >> | > >> | > Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on >> | > simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am >> | > basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... >> | > >> | > I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west >> | > panes >> | > to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... >> | > >> | > I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the >> | > server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application >> | > specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a >> | > fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the >> | > server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework >> | > executes to render the pane... >> | > >> | > It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to >> | > start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds >> | > up >> | > under real stress ... >> | > >> | > I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have >> | > folks >> | > pretty things up a bit ... >> | > >> | > Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, >> | > so I >> | > would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are >> | > up >> | > to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of >> | > other folks besides myself ... >> | > >> | > I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) >> | > >> | > Dale >> | > >> | > [1]http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- >> | > with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ >> | > >> | >> > |
|
|
In reply to this post by Dale Henrichs
Hi Dale:
I'm going back to restart with some projects now and interested in use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would ask what is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in Amber) and Kaliningrad.
Cheers. 2011/10/9 Dale <[hidden email]> You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a ============================================ Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net> Twitter: garduino Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com |
|
|
I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other projects keep getting in my way:)
I have tODE installed in http://ss3.gemstone.com/ and use it consistently for checking out the object log and making minor production patches. The object log is where all production errors are collected for GemStone, but if you are using Pharo I don't think that tODE can be used to intercept production errors ... yet. With GemStone, I can drop down to topaz to perform any operations that can't be done in tODE If you were working with GemStone, I think that I could recommend using tODE for remote management of a production image. For Pharo, I am not so sure, since you'd still need to maintain vnc for doing some of the things that aren't implemented in tODE... Dale ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 3:04:12 PM | Subject: Re: current status | | Hi Dale: | | | I'm going back to restart with some projects now and interested in | use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would ask what | is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in Amber) and | Kaliningrad. | | | Cheers. | | | | 2011/10/9 Dale < [hidden email] > | | | You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a | project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. | | I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be used | to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source code. | | Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but | the work is very promising. | | Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript | libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within | Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript | examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside | javascript. | | Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on | simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am | basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... | | I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west panes | to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... | | I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the | server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application | specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a | fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the | server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework | executes to render the pane... | | It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to | start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds up | under real stress ... | | I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have folks | pretty things up a bit ... | | Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, so | I | would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are up | to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of | other folks besides myself ... | | I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) | | Dale | | [1] | http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- | with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ | | | | | -- | ============================================ | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | ============================================ | |
|
|
Hi Dale!
Thanks for the explanations. I will experiment a bit. And yes, by now Pharo is behind but your words are making me think in use Gemstone, why not? (it's free for this sort of small systems).
Need to think more about.......in this case the way should be to have a Linux VPS, right? Cheers and thanks again. 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]> I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other projects keep getting in my way:) ============================================ Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net> Twitter: garduino Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com |
|
|
German,
Right now I think that going with an Ubuntu 10.10 system is the way to go as there are a number of blog posts out there that tell you how to set up your system whether you are using VMware vms or another vm technology ... Dale ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:09:21 PM | Subject: Re: current status | | Hi Dale! | | | Thanks for the explanations. | | | I will experiment a bit. And yes, by now Pharo is behind but your | words are making me think in use Gemstone, why not? (it's free for | this sort of small systems). | | | Need to think more about.......in this case the way should be to have | a Linux VPS, right? | | | Cheers and thanks again. | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other projects | keep getting in my way:) | | I have tODE installed in http://ss3.gemstone.com/ and use it | consistently for checking out the object log and making minor | production patches. The object log is where all production errors | are collected for GemStone, but if you are using Pharo I don't think | that tODE can be used to intercept production errors ... yet. With | GemStone, I can drop down to topaz to perform any operations that | can't be done in tODE | | If you were working with GemStone, I think that I could recommend | using tODE for remote management of a production image. | | For Pharo, I am not so sure, since you'd still need to maintain vnc | for doing some of the things that aren't implemented in tODE... | | | Dale | | ----- Original Message ----- | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | Sent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 3:04:12 PM | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | Hi Dale: | | | | | | I'm going back to restart with some projects now and interested in | | use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would ask | | what | | is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in Amber) and | | Kaliningrad. | | | | | | Cheers. | | | | | | | | 2011/10/9 Dale < [hidden email] > | | | | | | You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a | | project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. | | | | I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be | | used | | to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source | | code. | | | | Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, but | | the work is very promising. | | | | Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the javascript | | libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within | | Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript | | examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside | | javascript. | | | | Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on | | simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am | | basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... | | | | I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west | | panes | | to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... | | | | I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from the | | server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application | | specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a | | fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the | | server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE framework | | executes to render the pane... | | | | It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going to | | start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds | | up | | under real stress ... | | | | I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have | | folks | | pretty things up a bit ... | | | | Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, | | so | | I | | would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks are | | up | | to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off of | | other folks besides myself ... | | | | I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) | | | | Dale | | | | [1] | | http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- | | with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ | | | | | | | | | | -- | | ============================================ | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | ============================================ | | | | | | | -- | ============================================ | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | ============================================ | |
|
|
Yes, I read several posts and even did some lab in a local machine with no problems.
But to have an Internet ready app need to use a hosted service, for example a VPS or, (must investigate), some cloud service.
Cheers.
2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]> German, ============================================ Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net> Twitter: garduino Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com |
|
|
Ah yes, Nick Ager has instructions for setting up an Amazon ECS instance and there are quite a few hosting services for 64 bit linux floating around...
Dale ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:48:26 PM | Subject: Re: current status | | Yes, I read several posts and even did some lab in a local machine | with no problems. | | | But to have an Internet ready app need to use a hosted service, for | example a VPS or, (must investigate), some cloud service. | | | Cheers. | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | German, | | Right now I think that going with an Ubuntu 10.10 system is the way | to go as there are a number of blog posts out there that tell you | how to set up your system whether you are using VMware vms or | another vm technology ... | | | Dale | | ----- Original Message ----- | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:09:21 PM | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | Hi Dale! | | | | | | Thanks for the explanations. | | | | | | I will experiment a bit. And yes, by now Pharo is behind but your | | words are making me think in use Gemstone, why not? (it's free for | | this sort of small systems). | | | | | | Need to think more about.......in this case the way should be to | | have | | a Linux VPS, right? | | | | | | Cheers and thanks again. | | | | | | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | | | | I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other | | projects | | keep getting in my way:) | | | | I have tODE installed in http://ss3.gemstone.com/ and use it | | consistently for checking out the object log and making minor | | production patches. The object log is where all production errors | | are collected for GemStone, but if you are using Pharo I don't | | think | | that tODE can be used to intercept production errors ... yet. With | | GemStone, I can drop down to topaz to perform any operations that | | can't be done in tODE | | | | If you were working with GemStone, I think that I could recommend | | using tODE for remote management of a production image. | | | | For Pharo, I am not so sure, since you'd still need to maintain vnc | | for doing some of the things that aren't implemented in tODE... | | | | | | Dale | | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | | Sent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 3:04:12 PM | | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | | | | | Hi Dale: | | | | | | | | | I'm going back to restart with some projects now and interested | | | in | | | use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would ask | | | what | | | is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in Amber) | | | and | | | Kaliningrad. | | | | | | | | | Cheers. | | | | | | | | | | | | 2011/10/9 Dale < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is | | | a | | | project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. | | | | | | I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could be | | | used | | | to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source | | | code. | | | | | | Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, | | | but | | | the work is very promising. | | | | | | Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the | | | javascript | | | libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within | | | Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the javascript | | | examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside | | | javascript. | | | | | | Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on | | | simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I am | | | basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... | | | | | | I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west | | | panes | | | to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... | | | | | | I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from | | | the | | | server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of application | | | specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a | | | fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from the | | | server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE | | | framework | | | executes to render the pane... | | | | | | It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am going | | | to | | | start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick holds | | | up | | | under real stress ... | | | | | | I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have | | | folks | | | pretty things up a bit ... | | | | | | Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time around, | | | so | | | I | | | would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks | | | are | | | up | | | to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off | | | of | | | other folks besides myself ... | | | | | | I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) | | | | | | Dale | | | | | | [1] | | | http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- | | | with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | | ============================================ | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | | ============================================ | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | ============================================ | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | ============================================ | | | | | | | -- | ============================================ | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | ============================================ | |
|
|
I think is an interesting opportunity to develop my first Gemstone production system and to develop remotely using tODE :)
2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]> Ah yes, Nick Ager has instructions for setting up an Amazon ECS instance and there are quite a few hosting services for 64 bit linux floating around... ============================================ Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net> Twitter: garduino Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com |
|
|
Keep in mind that you'll still need to use a remote GemTools for certain operations (and those operations can be slow for remote servers) ...
Also don't forget that you want to develop in Pharo and deploy in GemStone ... tODE will augment your experience for managing the remote production system... Dale ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:57:50 PM | Subject: Re: current status | | I think is an interesting opportunity to develop my first Gemstone | production system and to develop remotely using tODE :) | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | Ah yes, Nick Ager has instructions for setting up an Amazon ECS | instance and there are quite a few hosting services for 64 bit linux | floating around... | | | Dale | | ----- Original Message ----- | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:48:26 PM | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | Yes, I read several posts and even did some lab in a local machine | | with no problems. | | | | | | But to have an Internet ready app need to use a hosted service, for | | example a VPS or, (must investigate), some cloud service. | | | | | | Cheers. | | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | | | | German, | | | | Right now I think that going with an Ubuntu 10.10 system is the way | | to go as there are a number of blog posts out there that tell you | | how to set up your system whether you are using VMware vms or | | another vm technology ... | | | | | | Dale | | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:09:21 PM | | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | Hi Dale! | | | | | | | | | Thanks for the explanations. | | | | | | | | | I will experiment a bit. And yes, by now Pharo is behind but your | | | words are making me think in use Gemstone, why not? (it's free | | | for | | | this sort of small systems). | | | | | | | | | Need to think more about.......in this case the way should be to | | | have | | | a Linux VPS, right? | | | | | | | | | Cheers and thanks again. | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other | | | projects | | | keep getting in my way:) | | | | | | I have tODE installed in http://ss3.gemstone.com/ and use it | | | consistently for checking out the object log and making minor | | | production patches. The object log is where all production errors | | | are collected for GemStone, but if you are using Pharo I don't | | | think | | | that tODE can be used to intercept production errors ... yet. | | | With | | | GemStone, I can drop down to topaz to perform any operations that | | | can't be done in tODE | | | | | | If you were working with GemStone, I think that I could recommend | | | using tODE for remote management of a production image. | | | | | | For Pharo, I am not so sure, since you'd still need to maintain | | | vnc | | | for doing some of the things that aren't implemented in tODE... | | | | | | | | | Dale | | | | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | Sent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 3:04:12 PM | | | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Hi Dale: | | | | | | | | | | | | I'm going back to restart with some projects now and interested | | | | in | | | | use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would ask | | | | what | | | | is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in Amber) | | | | and | | | | Kaliningrad. | | | | | | | | | | | | Cheers. | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | 2011/10/9 Dale < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | | | | You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which | | | | is | | | | a | | | | project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. | | | | | | | | I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could | | | | be | | | | used | | | | to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber source | | | | code. | | | | | | | | Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the moment, | | | | but | | | | the work is very promising. | | | | | | | | Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the | | | | javascript | | | | libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from within | | | | Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the | | | | javascript | | | | examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside | | | | javascript. | | | | | | | | Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more on | | | | simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so I | | | | am | | | | basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... | | | | | | | | I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and west | | | | panes | | | | to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... | | | | | | | | I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code from | | | | the | | | | server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of | | | | application | | | | specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at a | | | | fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from | | | | the | | | | server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE | | | | framework | | | | executes to render the pane... | | | | | | | | It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am | | | | going | | | | to | | | | start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick | | | | holds | | | | up | | | | under real stress ... | | | | | | | | I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to have | | | | folks | | | | pretty things up a bit ... | | | | | | | | Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time | | | | around, | | | | so | | | | I | | | | would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other folks | | | | are | | | | up | | | | to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas off | | | | of | | | | other folks besides myself ... | | | | | | | | I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) | | | | | | | | Dale | | | | | | | | [1] | | | | http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- | | | | with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | | | ============================================ | | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | | | ============================================ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | | ============================================ | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | | ============================================ | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | ============================================ | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | ============================================ | | | | | | | -- | ============================================ | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | ============================================ | |
|
|
Yes, I understand.
But is not possible to develop remotely, not only manage remote systems? Cheers.
2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]> Keep in mind that you'll still need to use a remote GemTools for certain operations (and those operations can be slow for remote servers) ... ============================================ Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net> Twitter: garduino Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com |
|
|
This is where you get into the 80% part of tODE ... not all of the tools that are needed for full-time development have been implemented in tODE ... it is adequate for managing, but for development you'll find your self spending 20% of the time dropping into GemTools for GemStone or in the image for Pharo ...
I had reached the point where I knew that I was going to have to refactor things significantly for tODE moving forward and I stopped trying to implement all of the tools ... I had done enough to prove that it could be done, but I had also done enough to know that I wanted to restructure ... For managing remote systems, I have found enough functionality in tODE to do the bulk of my interactions. Develop in Pharo and deploy in GemStone is what most of the GLASS developers do and the goal for Pharo is to make it possible to do remote development for GemStone, but like I said, I have been sidetracked by a couple of other projects since Smalltalks 2011 and I have yet to get back to working on tODE ... Right now I am making a pass through Metacello that will go on for a bit ... Dale ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 3:11:42 PM | Subject: Re: current status | | Yes, I understand. | | | But is not possible to develop remotely, not only manage remote | systems? | | | Cheers. | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | Keep in mind that you'll still need to use a remote GemTools for | certain operations (and those operations can be slow for remote | servers) ... | | Also don't forget that you want to develop in Pharo and deploy in | GemStone ... | | tODE will augment your experience for managing the remote production | system... | | | Dale | | ----- Original Message ----- | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:57:50 PM | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | I think is an interesting opportunity to develop my first Gemstone | | production system and to develop remotely using tODE :) | | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | | | | Ah yes, Nick Ager has instructions for setting up an Amazon ECS | | instance and there are quite a few hosting services for 64 bit | | linux | | floating around... | | | | | | Dale | | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:48:26 PM | | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | Yes, I read several posts and even did some lab in a local | | | machine | | | with no problems. | | | | | | | | | But to have an Internet ready app need to use a hosted service, | | | for | | | example a VPS or, (must investigate), some cloud service. | | | | | | | | | Cheers. | | | | | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | German, | | | | | | Right now I think that going with an Ubuntu 10.10 system is the | | | way | | | to go as there are a number of blog posts out there that tell you | | | how to set up your system whether you are using VMware vms or | | | another vm technology ... | | | | | | | | | Dale | | | | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:09:21 PM | | | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | | | Hi Dale! | | | | | | | | | | | | Thanks for the explanations. | | | | | | | | | | | | I will experiment a bit. And yes, by now Pharo is behind but | | | | your | | | | words are making me think in use Gemstone, why not? (it's free | | | | for | | | | this sort of small systems). | | | | | | | | | | | | Need to think more about.......in this case the way should be | | | | to | | | | have | | | | a Linux VPS, right? | | | | | | | | | | | | Cheers and thanks again. | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | | | | I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other | | | | projects | | | | keep getting in my way:) | | | | | | | | I have tODE installed in http://ss3.gemstone.com/ and use it | | | | consistently for checking out the object log and making minor | | | | production patches. The object log is where all production | | | | errors | | | | are collected for GemStone, but if you are using Pharo I don't | | | | think | | | | that tODE can be used to intercept production errors ... yet. | | | | With | | | | GemStone, I can drop down to topaz to perform any operations | | | | that | | | | can't be done in tODE | | | | | | | | If you were working with GemStone, I think that I could | | | | recommend | | | | using tODE for remote management of a production image. | | | | | | | | For Pharo, I am not so sure, since you'd still need to maintain | | | | vnc | | | | for doing some of the things that aren't implemented in tODE... | | | | | | | | | | | | Dale | | | | | | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > | | | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | Sent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 3:04:12 PM | | | | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Hi Dale: | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | I'm going back to restart with some projects now and | | | | | interested | | | | | in | | | | | use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would | | | | | ask | | | | | what | | | | | is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in | | | | | Amber) | | | | | and | | | | | Kaliningrad. | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Cheers. | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | 2011/10/9 Dale < [hidden email] > | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which | | | | | is | | | | | a | | | | | project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. | | | | | | | | | | I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could | | | | | be | | | | | used | | | | | to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber | | | | | source | | | | | code. | | | | | | | | | | Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the | | | | | moment, | | | | | but | | | | | the work is very promising. | | | | | | | | | | Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the | | | | | javascript | | | | | libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from | | | | | within | | | | | Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the | | | | | javascript | | | | | examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside | | | | | javascript. | | | | | | | | | | Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more | | | | | on | | | | | simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so | | | | | I | | | | | am | | | | | basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... | | | | | | | | | | I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and | | | | | west | | | | | panes | | | | | to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... | | | | | | | | | | I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code | | | | | from | | | | | the | | | | | server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of | | | | | application | | | | | specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at | | | | | a | | | | | fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from | | | | | the | | | | | server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE | | | | | framework | | | | | executes to render the pane... | | | | | | | | | | It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am | | | | | going | | | | | to | | | | | start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick | | | | | holds | | | | | up | | | | | under real stress ... | | | | | | | | | | I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to | | | | | have | | | | | folks | | | | | pretty things up a bit ... | | | | | | | | | | Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time | | | | | around, | | | | | so | | | | | I | | | | | would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other | | | | | folks | | | | | are | | | | | up | | | | | to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas | | | | | off | | | | | of | | | | | other folks besides myself ... | | | | | | | | | | I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) | | | | | | | | | | Dale | | | | | | | | | | [1] | | | | | http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- | | | | | with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | | | | ============================================ | | | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | | | | ============================================ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | | | ============================================ | | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | | | ============================================ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | | ============================================ | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | | ============================================ | | | | | | | | | | | | | -- | | ============================================ | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | | ============================================ | | | | | | | -- | ============================================ | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com | ============================================ | |
|
|
Thanks for the detailed explanation Dale!
I must experiment a bit with the develop in pharo and deploy in gemstone style of work. But my final goal is develop remotely (is the main reason I invested time in Amber and similar alternatives) but to be honest I do not like the lack of image and other penalties imposed by the use of javascript. Just an opinion. Cheers. 2012/2/6, Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]>: > This is where you get into the 80% part of tODE ... not all of the tools > that are needed for full-time development have been implemented in tODE ... > it is adequate for managing, but for development you'll find your self > spending 20% of the time dropping into GemTools for GemStone or in the image > for Pharo ... > > I had reached the point where I knew that I was going to have to refactor > things significantly for tODE moving forward and I stopped trying to > implement all of the tools ... I had done enough to prove that it could be > done, but I had also done enough to know that I wanted to restructure ... > For managing remote systems, I have found enough functionality in tODE to do > the bulk of my interactions. > > Develop in Pharo and deploy in GemStone is what most of the GLASS developers > do and the goal for Pharo is to make it possible to do remote development > for GemStone, but like I said, I have been sidetracked by a couple of other > projects since Smalltalks 2011 and I have yet to get back to working on tODE > ... > > Right now I am making a pass through Metacello that will go on for a bit ... > > Dale > > ----- Original Message ----- > | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> > | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> > | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 3:11:42 PM > | Subject: Re: current status > | > | Yes, I understand. > | > | > | But is not possible to develop remotely, not only manage remote > | systems? > | > | > | Cheers. > | > | > | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > > | > | > | Keep in mind that you'll still need to use a remote GemTools for > | certain operations (and those operations can be slow for remote > | servers) ... > | > | Also don't forget that you want to develop in Pharo and deploy in > | GemStone ... > | > | tODE will augment your experience for managing the remote production > | system... > | > | > | Dale > | > | ----- Original Message ----- > | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > > | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > > | > | > | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:57:50 PM > | | Subject: Re: current status > | | > | | I think is an interesting opportunity to develop my first Gemstone > | | production system and to develop remotely using tODE :) > | | > | | > | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > > | | > | | > | | Ah yes, Nick Ager has instructions for setting up an Amazon ECS > | | instance and there are quite a few hosting services for 64 bit > | | linux > | | floating around... > | | > | | > | | Dale > | | > | | ----- Original Message ----- > | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > > | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > > | | > | | > | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:48:26 PM > | | | Subject: Re: current status > | | | > | | | Yes, I read several posts and even did some lab in a local > | | | machine > | | | with no problems. > | | | > | | | > | | | But to have an Internet ready app need to use a hosted service, > | | | for > | | | example a VPS or, (must investigate), some cloud service. > | | | > | | | > | | | Cheers. > | | | > | | | > | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > > | | | > | | | > | | | German, > | | | > | | | Right now I think that going with an Ubuntu 10.10 system is the > | | | way > | | | to go as there are a number of blog posts out there that tell you > | | | how to set up your system whether you are using VMware vms or > | | | another vm technology ... > | | | > | | | > | | | Dale > | | | > | | | ----- Original Message ----- > | | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > > | | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > > | | | > | | | > | | | | Sent: Monday, February 6, 2012 2:09:21 PM > | | | | Subject: Re: current status > | | | | > | | | | Hi Dale! > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | Thanks for the explanations. > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | I will experiment a bit. And yes, by now Pharo is behind but > | | | | your > | | | | words are making me think in use Gemstone, why not? (it's free > | | | | for > | | | | this sort of small systems). > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | Need to think more about.......in this case the way should be > | | | | to > | | | | have > | | | | a Linux VPS, right? > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | Cheers and thanks again. > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | 2012/2/6 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | I haven't made much progress on the Amber rewrite ... other > | | | | projects > | | | | keep getting in my way:) > | | | | > | | | | I have tODE installed in http://ss3.gemstone.com/ and use it > | | | | consistently for checking out the object log and making minor > | | | | production patches. The object log is where all production > | | | | errors > | | | | are collected for GemStone, but if you are using Pharo I don't > | | | | think > | | | | that tODE can be used to intercept production errors ... yet. > | | | | With > | | | | GemStone, I can drop down to topaz to perform any operations > | | | | that > | | | | can't be done in tODE > | | | | > | | | | If you were working with GemStone, I think that I could > | | | | recommend > | | | | using tODE for remote management of a production image. > | | | | > | | | | For Pharo, I am not so sure, since you'd still need to maintain > | | | | vnc > | | | | for doing some of the things that aren't implemented in tODE... > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | Dale > | | | | > | | | | ----- Original Message ----- > | | | | | From: "Germán Arduino" < [hidden email] > > | | | | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > > | | | | > | | | | | Sent: Sunday, February 5, 2012 3:04:12 PM > | | | | | Subject: Re: current status > | | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | | Hi Dale: > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | I'm going back to restart with some projects now and > | | | | | interested > | | | | | in > | | | | | use tODE to develop in a remote image for example and would > | | | | | ask > | | | | | what > | | | | | is the current status of tODE (that you was rewriting in > | | | | | Amber) > | | | | | and > | | | | | Kaliningrad. > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | Cheers. > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | 2011/10/9 Dale < [hidden email] > > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which > | | | | | is > | | | | | a > | | | | | project that allows one to save Amber source to Monticello. > | | | | | > | | | | | I wrote Kaliningrad, because I decided to see how Amber could > | | | | | be > | | | | | used > | | | | | to implement tODE and I needed a way to manage the Amber > | | | | | source > | | | | | code. > | | | | | > | | | | | Anyway, I've just got the inspector pane working at the > | | | | | moment, > | | | | | but > | | | | | the work is very promising. > | | | | | > | | | | | Using Amber I am finding it much easier to leverage the > | | | | | javascript > | | | | | libraries, than when I was trying to use Javascript from > | | | | | within > | | | | | Seaside ... It is much easier for me to translate the > | | | | | javascript > | | | | | examples I find on the web into Amber Smalltalk than Seaside > | | | | | javascript. > | | | | | > | | | | | Now that the proof of concept is done, I want to focus more > | | | | | on > | | | | | simplifying the framework and revamping all of the views, so > | | | | | I > | | | | | am > | | | | | basically building tODE from scratch in Amber ... > | | | | | > | | | | | I want eliminate the side-panel panes and use the east and > | | | | | west > | | | | | panes > | | | | | to allow one to look at multiple views at once ... > | | | | | > | | | | | I'm using JSON to ship the 'view-model' and rendering code > | | | | | from > | | | | | the > | | | | | server to the Amber client, so there is not a lot of > | | | | | application > | | | | | specific code in Amber ... Amber is managing the framework at > | | | | | a > | | | | | fairly high level ... the rendering code that is shipped from > | | | | | the > | | | | | server is actually an Amber Smalltalk block that the tODE > | | | | | framework > | | | | | executes to render the pane... > | | | | | > | | | | | It's a clever trick that works for the inspector, but I am > | | | | | going > | | | | | to > | | | | | start work on the debugger so we'll see if the clever trick > | | | | | holds > | | | | | up > | | | | | under real stress ... > | | | | | > | | | | | I am still severely challenged by CSS, so I would love to > | | | | | have > | | | | | folks > | | | | | pretty things up a bit ... > | | | | | > | | | | | Also it's pretty early in the development cycle this time > | | | | | around, > | | | | | so > | | | | | I > | | | | | would welcome feedback and ideas from folks and if other > | | | | | folks > | | | | | are > | | | | | up > | | | | | to speed on what I am doing, I will be able to bounce ideas > | | | | | off > | | | | | of > | | | | | other folks besides myself ... > | | | | | > | | | | | I find it difficult to et into a good argument with myself:) > | | | | | > | | | | | Dale > | | | | | > | | | | | [1] > | | | | | > http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/2011/10/08/kaliningrad-developing- > | | | | | with-amber-seaside-and-monticello/ > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | > | | | | | -- > | | | | | ============================================ > | | | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino > | | | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com > | | | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com > | | | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com > | | | | | ============================================ > | | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | > | | | | -- > | | | | ============================================ > | | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino > | | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com > | | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com > | | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com > | | | | ============================================ > | | | | > | | | > | | | > | | | > | | | > | | | -- > | | | ============================================ > | | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino > | | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com > | | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com > | | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com > | | | ============================================ > | | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | -- > | | ============================================ > | | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino > | | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com > | | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com > | | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com > | | ============================================ > | | > | > | > | > | > | -- > | ============================================ > | Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net > Twitter: garduino > | Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com > | PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com > | greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com > | ============================================ > | > -- Enviado desde mi dispositivo móvil ============================================ Germán S. Arduino <gsa @ arsol.net> Twitter: garduino Arduino Software http://www.arduinosoftware.com PasswordsPro http://www.passwordspro.com greensecure.blogspot.com germanarduino.blogpost.com ============================================ |
|
In reply to this post by Dale Henrichs
that sounds very good!
BTW, I saw that tODE-one-click is done the "traditional" Seaside way. Do we have a chance to see how are you going at code level? As I'm new to Amber I'm very hungry for examples of Amber-SeasideRest web apps :) About tODE itself, it seems to be a great chance for a rebirth in the Smalltalk developing experience, intriguing Maybe I write describing some sketches about the developing experience in smalltalk sebastian o/ PS: I'm playing around Kaliningrad so thank you very much for that work! On Sunday, October 9, 2011 12:55:49 PM UTC-3, Dale wrote: You may or may not have seen my post on Kaliningrad[1], which is a |
|
|
Sebastian,
----- Original Message ----- | From: "Sebastian Sastre" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Saturday, March 3, 2012 7:47:58 AM | Subject: Re: current status | | that sounds very good! | | | BTW, I saw that tODE-one-click is done the "traditional" Seaside way. | Do we have a chance to see how are you going at code level? As I'm | new to Amber I'm very hungry for examples of Amber-SeasideRest web | apps :) If you hit http://???/tools/amber-browser instead of http://???/tools/tODE you'll get the amber browser for the Amber code which includes the amber-side tODE code... http://???/tools/amber-tODE will get you to my most recent experiments with the amber interface .. | | About tODE itself, it seems to be a great chance for a rebirth in the | Smalltalk developing experience , intriguing | Yes, I think that by simplifying the tools and leveraging the web paradigm, that developers can and will build specialized tools for their applications that are "tightly coupled" to the rest of the tools I want to emphasize the objects in development and play down the browser aspect ... it's objects that make Smalltalk most interesting in the first place, so the objects should be foremost in the development environment ... | | Maybe I write describing some sketches about the developing | experience in smalltalk | My original plans for this year was to get back into tODE, however the git/metacello work has popped up and I think that getting smalltalk to work with git is something worth doing (especially since it's not that far off:)... So I look forward to seeing and hearing what other people think ... Dale |
|
|
Hi Dale:
2012/3/3 Dale Henrichs <[hidden email]> Sebastian, I'm also very interested in study a bit these possibilities, but can't find the urls amber-browser and amber-tODE. I started from the one click image and updated all the stuff from the Naviode repo, but surely I'm doing something wrong.
How I can get these examples?
+11111111111 :) Full agree! My original plans for this year was to get back into tODE, however the git/metacello work has popped up and I think that getting smalltalk to work with git is something worth doing (especially since it's not that far off:)... I haven't had the time to read about git/metacello, only very superficially but I'm not sure of understand what will win (more than the exposure) using git. Is not a way of loss the advantages depicted in the previous point (objects, image) ?
Cheers. Germán. |
|
|
Ah, I've moved development to http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/tODE.html
I guess I updated the project page[1], but didn't announce the change ... sorry ... Dale [1] http://code.google.com/p/tode/ ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Germán Arduino" <[hidden email]> | To: "tode st" <[hidden email]> | Sent: Sunday, March 4, 2012 6:39:27 AM | Subject: Re: current status | | Hi Dale: | | | 2012/3/3 Dale Henrichs < [hidden email] > | | | Sebastian, | | | ----- Original Message ----- | | From: "Sebastian Sastre" < [hidden email] > | | To: "tode st" < [hidden email] > | | | Sent: Saturday, March 3, 2012 7:47:58 AM | | Subject: Re: current status | | | | that sounds very good! | | | | | | BTW, I saw that tODE-one-click is done the "traditional" Seaside | | way. | | Do we have a chance to see how are you going at code level? As I'm | | new to Amber I'm very hungry for examples of Amber-SeasideRest web | | apps :) | | If you hit http://???/tools/amber-browser instead of | http://???/tools/tODE you'll get the amber browser for the Amber | code which includes the amber-side tODE code... | | http://???/tools/amber-tODE will get you to my most recent | experiments with the amber interface .. | | | | | | | | I'm also very interested in study a bit these possibilities, but | can't find the urls amber-browser and amber-tODE. I started from the | one click image and updated all the stuff from the Naviode repo, but | surely I'm doing something wrong. | | | How I can get these examples? | | | | | | | I want to emphasize the objects in development and play down the | browser aspect ... it's objects that make Smalltalk most interesting | in the first place, so the objects should be foremost in the | development environment ... | | | | | | | | +11111111111 :) Full agree! | | | | | | My original plans for this year was to get back into tODE, however | the git/metacello work has popped up and I think that getting | smalltalk to work with git is something worth doing (especially | since it's not that far off:)... | | So I look forward to seeing and hearing what other people think ... | | | | | | | I haven't had the time to read about git/metacello, only very | superficially but I'm not sure of understand what will win (more | than the exposure) using git. Is not a way of loss the advantages | depicted in the previous point (objects, image) ? | | | Cheers. | | | Germán. | | | |
«
Return to tODE
|
1 view|%1 views
| Free forum by Nabble | Edit this page |