A couple of simple ergonomic adjustments

> So, Stef, Board, please advice:
>
> Who needs to do what to get it there? The code is there, with a small
> set
> of fonts. And it is trivial to add anyone the user wants.
>
> Should Edgar and the release team just load them? Yes? Edgar, please
> doit
> ASAP!
>
> Should de Board give a commend? Yes? Board, please doit!
>
> Should I do something else? Then, please tell me what.

>
> Cheers,
> Juan Vuletich
>
> stephane ducasse escribió:
>> would be nice to have that in squeak-dev 3.9 and 3.10
>>
>> stef
>>
>> On 9 juil. 07, at 20:31, Juan Vuletich wrote:
>>
>>> Giovanni Corriga escribió:
>>>> Il giorno lun, 09/07/2007 alle 11.25 +0200, Mikael Kindborg ha
>>>> scritto:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi, those are nice changes. I also feel that a font like VeraSans
>>>>> greatly improves the user experience. Looks much more
>>>>> professional/fun/clear in my opinion. I speculate that people who
>>>>> try out Squeak would be more positive to the system with better
>>>>> looking default fonts.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Even better, we could use the free and unencumbered Liberation
>>>> fonts: https://www.redhat.com/promo/fonts/
>>>>
>>>> Here's a screenshot of one of my work images:
>>>> http://www.corriga.net/~giovanni/Hacking.image.png
>>>>
>>>>     Giovanni
>>>>
>>>>
>>> In my opinion http://www.jvuletich.org/issues/Issue0010.htm looks so
>>> much nicer!
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Juan Vuletich
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

> So, Stef, Board, please advice:
>
> Who needs to do what to get it there? The code is there, with a small
> set
> of fonts. And it is trivial to add anyone the user wants.
>
> Should Edgar and the release team just load them? Yes? Edgar, please
> doit
> ASAP!
>
> Should de Board give a commend? Yes? Board, please doit!
>
> Should I do something else? Then, please tell me what.

>
> Cheers,
> Juan Vuletich
>
> stephane ducasse escribió:
>> would be nice to have that in squeak-dev 3.9 and 3.10
>>
>> stef
>>
>> On 9 juil. 07, at 20:31, Juan Vuletich wrote:
>>
>>> Giovanni Corriga escribió:
>>>> Il giorno lun, 09/07/2007 alle 11.25 +0200, Mikael Kindborg ha
>>>> scritto:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi, those are nice changes. I also feel that a font like VeraSans
>>>>> greatly improves the user experience. Looks much more
>>>>> professional/fun/clear in my opinion. I speculate that people who
>>>>> try out Squeak would be more positive to the system with better
>>>>> looking default fonts.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Even better, we could use the free and unencumbered Liberation
>>>> fonts: https://www.redhat.com/promo/fonts/
>>>>
>>>> Here's a screenshot of one of my work images:
>>>> http://www.corriga.net/~giovanni/Hacking.image.png
>>>>
>>>>     Giovanni
>>>>
>>>>
>>> In my opinion http://www.jvuletich.org/issues/Issue0010.htm looks so
>>> much nicer!
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Juan Vuletich
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

> So, Stef, Board, please advice:
>
> Who needs to do what to get it there? The code is there, with a small
> set of fonts. And it is trivial to add anyone the user wants.
>
> Should Edgar and the release team just load them? Yes? Edgar, please
> doit ASAP!
>
> Should de Board give a commend? Yes? Board, please doit!
>
> Should I do something else? Then, please tell me what.

>
> Cheers,
> Juan Vuletich
>
> stephane ducasse escribió:
>> would be nice to have that in squeak-dev 3.9 and 3.10
>>
>> stef
>>
>> On 9 juil. 07, at 20:31, Juan Vuletich wrote:
>>
>>> Giovanni Corriga escribió:
>>>> Il giorno lun, 09/07/2007 alle 11.25 +0200, Mikael Kindborg ha
>>>> scritto:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi, those are nice changes. I also feel that a font like VeraSans
>>>>> greatly improves the user experience. Looks much more
>>>>> professional/fun/clear in my opinion. I speculate that people who
>>>>> try out Squeak would be more positive to the system with better
>>>>> looking default fonts.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Even better, we could use the free and unencumbered Liberation
>>>> fonts: https://www.redhat.com/promo/fonts/
>>>>
>>>> Here's a screenshot of one of my work images:
>>>> http://www.corriga.net/~giovanni/Hacking.image.png
>>>>
>>>>     Giovanni
>>>>
>>>>
>>> In my opinion http://www.jvuletich.org/issues/Issue0010.htm looks so
>>> much nicer!
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Juan Vuletich
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

> Thank you.
>
> At the present time the "upgrade" consists of a fair few MC packages. I have
> had to make the methods rather more resilient then necessay to avoid
> problems with Monticello loading (not quite atomic yet). As I said, if there
> is interest it may be worth creating a unified package.
>
> There are some, perhaps significant, changes to some of the fundamental
> methods in Morphic that could potentially break other packages, though I
> have tested as many as possible and tried to minimise any adverse effects.
>
> Most changes to existing classes are due to a wish to have the development
> enviroment benefit from the enhancements.
>
> Some of the changes may slow things down, while others provide a boost to
> counteract that!
>
> It will be interesting to see how Morphic evolves which may lead to
> requiring fewer workarounds!
>
> At present, with separate packages, it is possible to pick-and-choose the
> enhancements that a user requires, at the expense of a few conditional
> method invocations.
>
> I have tried to work mostly *with* Morphic in terms of implementing the
> "themes", as in using what Morphic provides (in terms of borders, fillStyles
> etc) rather than going down the subclassed-morph approach. This does mean
> that the themes are a little limited, though the plus-side is better
> integration within the Squeak environment.
>
> In terms of fonts, Strike, TTC (why the 'C'?) and Freetype are supported. In
> fact, whatever works in the current environment.
>
> There are major fixes to the window corner grips, splitters and title-bar
> size handling that should make people happier.
> In particular, there are many changes to various morphs to determine their
> proper minimum extent with regard to various layout policies. These may
> cause a problem to some packages, though I feel I have implemented them in
> the way that they were originally intended.
>
> As I remarked in an earlier post, we are committed to ensuring these changes
> move forward *with* Squeak, although it would be nice (easier) if some of
> the changes could be incorporated. It is not as simple as providing a fix to
> an existing Mantis bug.. (I hope this doesn't put you off!).
>
> At present the packages have a "Pinesoft" prefix. That can be changed if
> incorporation is required. We would like to give this back to the community
> that has supported us.
>
> I have added some preferences to allow various levels of involvement with
> the modifications and, at present there are three themes to choose from:
> "StandardSqueak" (mostly like you will be used to); "SoftSqueak"; Vistary
> (as in the screen shot).
>
> The Taskbar can be enabled via preference and is themed along with theming
> of the WorldMainDockingBar.
> Yet to do is providing preference browser based setting of the
> colour/fillstyles used in the UI, though this can be done through code at
> present.
>
> I welcome any feedback.
>
> Gary
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Andreas
> Wacknitz
> Sent: 12 July 2007 8:09 pm
> To: 'The general-purpose Squeak developers list'
> Subject: Re: A couple of simple ergonomic adjustments
>
>
>
>
> > And some not-so-simple ergonomic adjustments ;-)
>
> > A piccy of my Squeak desktop along with one of our applications.
>
> >  http://www.flickr.com/photos/65338133@N00/789894614/
>
> > Nearly ready to release into the community as an add-on package (minus
> > the report builder), though does modify (fix) quite a bit of morphic
> > too.
>
> > Uses the FreetypePlus package (good work Andy!).
>
> > Supports a few different "themes", including one that looks more like
> > "standard" squeak. Provides a nice UI for some standard (business
> > application like) services, choosing colours, selecting a font etc.
> > Also provides a framework for creating "standard" morphs (checkboxes,
> > drop-lists etc).
>
> > If there's any interest I'll speed up getting it ready for release.
>
> This looks rather promising. Many new Squeakers ask for common controls. The
> lack of standard GUI elements is a show stopper for many. With your work
> Squeak will be even more interesting. I can't wait to get my hands on it ;-)
>
> Regards
> Andreas
>
>
>
>

> The process is described at http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/5919
>
> To summarieze, first create a Mantis issue and put your code on it.
> Then get some people to use it and report that it works and is great.
> Then put the issue on the list of Mantis issues ready to be included
> in 3.10.  Then Edgar will try it out.  If it breaks any tests then
> he'll reject it and make you try again, so you really ought to make
> sure it doesn't break any tests.  If it doesn't break any tests and if
> nobody has complained about it then he'll add it to the release.
>
> The release team is trying not to be the arbiter of what goes in and
> what goes out, but rather to set quality standards and to manage the
> incoming issue stream.  We are not fixing up code or writing tests;
> that is your job, not ours.

> On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 09:54:37 +0200, Ralph Johnson wrote:
>
> > On 7/12/07, Juan Vuletich <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> Who needs to do what to get it there? The code is there, with a small
> >> set of fonts. And it is trivial to add anyone the user wants.
> >>
> >> Should Edgar and the release team just load them? Yes? Edgar, please
> >> doit ASAP!
> >
> > No, Edgar should not.
>
> :)
>
> > The process is described at http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/5919
> >
> > To summarieze, first create a Mantis issue and put your code on it.
> > Then get some people to use it and report that it works and is great.
> > Then put the issue on the list of Mantis issues ready to be included
> > in 3.10.  Then Edgar will try it out.  If it breaks any tests then
> > he'll reject it and make you try again, so you really ought to make
> > sure it doesn't break any tests.  If it doesn't break any tests and if
> > nobody has complained about it then he'll add it to the release.
> >
> > The release team is trying not to be the arbiter of what goes in and
> > what goes out, but rather to set quality standards and to manage the
> > incoming issue stream.  We are not fixing up code or writing tests;
> > that is your job, not ours.
>
> And this is also the reason that the 3.10 release team definitely is not  
> just two people. The contributors are also members of the release team.  
> They have other roles, but are fully integrated.
>
> Of course this contradicts the believe that the release team has not  
> enough people.

>
>
>
> El 7/13/07 6:42 AM, "Giovanni Corriga" <[hidden email]>  
> escribió:
>
>> I disagree here. At the moment there's a bottleneck, since Edgar  
>> is the
>> only one who can add stuff to the release. Having more people on the
>> release team could speed things up.
>>
>> Giovanni
>
> If only I could delete wrong files ....
>
> I asking for this from when release start.
>
> Edgar
>
>
>

> Il giorno ven, 13/07/2007 alle 10.40 +0200, Klaus D. Witzel ha scritto:
>> On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 09:54:37 +0200, Ralph Johnson wrote:
>>
>> > On 7/12/07, Juan Vuletich <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Who needs to do what to get it there? The code is there, with a small
>> >> set of fonts. And it is trivial to add anyone the user wants.
>> >>
>> >> Should Edgar and the release team just load them? Yes? Edgar, please
>> >> doit ASAP!
>> >
>> > No, Edgar should not.
>>
>> :)
>>
>> > The process is described at http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/5919
>> >
>> > To summarieze, first create a Mantis issue and put your code on it.
>> > Then get some people to use it and report that it works and is great.
>> > Then put the issue on the list of Mantis issues ready to be included
>> > in 3.10.  Then Edgar will try it out.  If it breaks any tests then
>> > he'll reject it and make you try again, so you really ought to make
>> > sure it doesn't break any tests.  If it doesn't break any tests and if
>> > nobody has complained about it then he'll add it to the release.
>> >
>> > The release team is trying not to be the arbiter of what goes in and
>> > what goes out, but rather to set quality standards and to manage the
>> > incoming issue stream.  We are not fixing up code or writing tests;
>> > that is your job, not ours.
>>
>> And this is also the reason that the 3.10 release team definitely is not
>> just two people. The contributors are also members of the release team.
>> They have other roles, but are fully integrated.
>>
>> Of course this contradicts the believe that the release team has not
>> enough people.
>
> I disagree here. At the moment there's a bottleneck,

>From: Hilaire Fernandes <[hidden email]>
>Reply-To: The general-purpose Squeak developers
>list<[hidden email]>
>To: [hidden email]
>Subject: Re: A couple of simple ergonomic adjustments
>Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 10:09:01 +0200
>
>Yeah, at least it will help a lot to make Squeak more visually appealing. I
>have many friends complaining the Squeak UI looks is a bit old fashion. To
>get it as an addon, it could help to attract more user/developer and to
>grow the community.
>

> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] En
> nombre de Todd Blanchard
> Enviado el: Jueves, 12 de Julio de 2007 16:47
> Para: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
> Asunto: Ergonomics - Rant
>
> Since we are talking about ergonomics, I haven't done any
> coding in modern images in some time (my production system is
> 3.7 based) and when I started working on a fix to a minor
> problem in the HTML parser in a very new image, I found
> myself frustrated at every turn.
>
> 1) When I browse senders, I get a browser with a bunch of methods.  
> If I modify one of the methods, I DO NOT WANT IT TO VANISH
> FROM THE BROWSER ON SAVE!  I keep having to go find the
> freakin' thing for every edit.  STOP IT!
>
> 2) When I select a class in the browser, please show all the
> methods initially in the methods pane.  What used to take 1
> click now takes a couple.  Consider that I'm browsing up and
> down a hierarchy looking for the level that contains the
> implementation for a method.  It takes a couple clicks just
> to look to see if the method is there.
>
> In general, the click per operation count seems to be going
> up, while useful buttons in the browser button bar seem to be
> vanishing (where is the one that lets me find ivar references now?)
>
> Rant over for now.
>
> -Todd Blanchard
>

> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] En
> nombre de Gary Chambers
> Enviado el: Jueves, 12 de Julio de 2007 14:53
> Para: 'The general-purpose Squeak developers list'
> Asunto: RE: A couple of simple ergonomic adjustments
>
> And some not-so-simple ergonomic adjustments ;-)
>
> A piccy of my Squeak desktop along with one of our applications.
>
>  http://www.flickr.com/photos/65338133@N00/789894614/
>
> Nearly ready to release into the community as an add-on
> package (minus the report builder), though does modify (fix)
> quite a bit of morphic too.
>
> Uses the FreetypePlus package (good work Andy!).
>
> Supports a few different "themes", including one that looks
> more like "standard" squeak.
> Provides a nice UI for some standard (business application
> like) services, choosing colours, selecting a font etc.
> Also provides a framework for creating "standard" morphs
> (checkboxes, drop-lists etc).
>
> If there's any interest I'll speed up getting it ready for release.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of Giovanni Corriga
> Sent: 09 July 2007 12:16 pm
> To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
> Subject: Re: A couple of simple ergonomic adjustments
>
>
> Il giorno lun, 09/07/2007 alle 11.25 +0200, Mikael Kindborg
> ha scritto:
> > Hi, those are nice changes. I also feel that a font like VeraSans
> > greatly improves the user experience. Looks much more
> > professional/fun/clear in my opinion. I speculate that
> people who try
> > out Squeak would be more positive to the system with better looking
> > default fonts.
>
> Even better, we could use the free and unencumbered Liberation fonts:
> https://www.redhat.com/promo/fonts/
>
> Here's a screenshot of one of my work images:
> http://www.corriga.net/~giovanni/Hacking.image.png
>
> Giovanni
>
>
>